Point and click BS?

[MG Forever]

KrazyJoe

brave fencer musaahi and the ps2 one are the same, just that the ps2 one have more skill and te graphic is much more better.

On topic: repetition isn't the point of mmo. i some mmo, they are actually improving on that. the normal atk aren't no more the one hit, one hit, one hit mode. now, some of them make combo for normal atk. ( example: 9dragons ) here, in gaia mmo, as for the mantis ring (rage lvl 4) you make combo, and there isn't really any "normal atk" since you have to use ring for every single atk.

Better graphics, yes. A larger number of skills, yes. More skill, HELL NO.

90% of Musashi Samurai Legend's skills had to be assigned to the O button, meaning you could only use them one at a time. That means, without pulling up the menu and switching, you had like three attacks at your disposal at any given time. MSL had ONE combo attack, NO jumping attacks, and was SLOW AS ********. BFM could bust out two combos and then jump away from an attacking enemy in the time it takes MSL to do his one basic katana combo and then get nailed because he can't dodge worth s**t.

I'm not even going to get into how much better BFM's platforming elements and story (and voice acting) were.

And by the way, I didn't say repetition is the point of an MMO, I said it's just a large part of it.

[PokeLamia]

Refresh dosent like gaia,

Firstly all of you who ask what zelda and y's have to do with MMOs if they arent MMOs themselves then I'd tell you to learn to read, since this is gaia and thats an unresonable request ill just repeate it untill you do.

These games are excelent games, I have never heard ANYONE deny they are great that dosent hate violence in some way shape or form in any video game in general.

and as for that one guy complaining about players learning the pattern, WHOA OH NO!, heaven forbbid any monster attack with a certain style!, I mean gee if vulvaga uses fire breath then everyone knows you just have to dodge the fire to not be hit! that would be absolutly alot more terrible than clicking something and watching random numbers fly off in either direction to see who wins.

[Chokin]

Zelda classifies as an action/adventure game.
They are not MMOs and are therefore irrelevant to your whole argument.
Yeah, they're amazing games. I'm the first person to say that. But, THEY HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THE TOPIC OF MMOs.

The point is:
MMOs involve a lot of repetition.
You either get used to it or stop playing them.
Period.

[PokeLamia]

Chokin

Zelda classifies as an action/adventure game.
They are not MMOs and are therefore irrelevant to your whole argument.
Yeah, they're amazing games. I'm the first person to say that. But, THEY HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THE TOPIC OF MMOs.

The point is:
MMOs involve a lot of repetition.
You either get used to it or stop playing them.
Period.

Your a fricking idiot, I'm sorry to say, but what part of Massivly Multiplayer and Online RPG entails alot of repititon? zelda is the only game i listed that wasnt a roleplaying game the only reason i did is because its universaly recognized. I guess games like .hack dont count as MMOs after all, that game has actual gameplay and isnt repitition.

I dont play MMOs because they all play like the first link, you stand there and click on stuff ever once in a while.

As you can see link number 2 is much more engaging (skip to 1:45 of the video if the intro bothers you) and yes FFCC is a RPG.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntYwe-b5zNM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsVO50gU-dw

cool boss battle
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uaEQyhcpwE4&feature=related

[Chokin]

First off, have a taken a nasty tone with you?
Don't take one with me.

RPG =/= MMORPG
I've played all the games you've mentioned. You can't compare games from different genres.


As for MMOs:
Leveling involves repetition. Succeeding in the game involves leveling.
A huge attraction of MMOs is player interaction. Which has absolutely nothing to do with pointing and clicking except for seeing a player's info (which can usually be found using typed commands).

I'm not the only one to point out that MMOs entail repetition.
We never said it was the point of the game.

I suggest you take your own suggestion and read everything through completely.

[PokeLamia]

Chokin

First off, have a taken a nasty tone with you?
Don't take one with me.

RPG =/= MMORPG
I've played all the games you've mentioned. You can't compare games from different genres.


As for MMOs:
Leveling involves repetition. Succeeding in the game involves leveling.
A huge attraction of MMOs is player interaction. Which has absolutely nothing to do with pointing and clicking except for seeing a player's info (which can usually be found using typed commands).

I'm not the only one to point out that MMOs entail repetition.
We never said it was the point of the game.

I suggest you take your own suggestion and read everything through completely.

No i have, but apperantly you cant seem to swallow the truth so I'll leave it be.

anyone who thinks MMOs are inherently repititous does not know what an MMO is. It is lazyness and coincidence that makes MMOs full of the repetitive and BOARING crap they are full of.

and please. dont even start with player interaction, there is no valuable player interaction to be found on 99% of ALL MMOrpgs making it not a aspect of them but an aspect of a select few communities among hundreds of millions.

also MMORPGs and RPGs are not uncomparable, you obviously dont have any clue what an RPG is either.

[MG Forever]

PokeLamia

I guess games like .hack dont count as MMOs after all, that game has actual gameplay and isnt repitition.

*Bursts into laughter*

With that one sentence you've not only made me question your sanity, but also lost any credibility as far as your argument is concerned.

.HACK was the most repetitious RPG I've ever played, including old-school 8-bit RPGs. There are, what, seven or eight dungeon types, and twenty or so "rooms" in each dungeon that are randomly assembled. No one in their right mind could ever say that a game where you have to pass through identical rooms dozens of times is not repetitive.

Oh, and let's not forget that you get like one skill per weapon, which you basically spam over and over again every fight.

@Cho: I suggest you not waste your breath finger energy trying to convince the TC, she's obviously too wrapped up in her own reality.

[PokeLamia]

The Right Honorable MG

PokeLamia

I guess games like .hack dont count as MMOs after all, that game has actual gameplay and isnt repitition.

*Bursts into laughter*

With that one sentence you've not only made me question your sanity, but also lost any credibility as far as your argument is concerned.

.HACK was the most repetitious RPG I've ever played, including old-school 8-bit RPGs. There are, what, seven or eight dungeon types, and twenty or so "rooms" in each dungeon that are randomly assembled. No one in their right mind could ever say that a game where you have to pass through identical rooms dozens of times is not repetitive.

Oh, and let's not forget that you get like one skill per weapon, which you basically spam over and over again every fight.

@Cho: I suggest you not waste your breath trying to convince the TC, she's obviously too wrapped up in her own reality.

Youve obviously never played .hack//fragments, but even then i was refering to the game, which is action based. and its rather a joke that you think its repitious becuase it had the most veriety of enemie AI patterns i had ever faced. each monster had to be fought with different stratagy in mind, the game had traps and is generaly not easy to transverse. who knows though, maybe you just grinded your way through it. like most good RPGs, skill is optional if you grind high enough.

[Din Whispers]

Sure a lot of MMOs are repetitive, probably all of them, but I find enjoyment in that certain repetitiveness. One can slay thousands upon thousands of monsters and I find gratification from earning my levels to progress further to harder areas. Part of the excitement doesn't really come in the game itself. It comes from meeting new aquaintances or making friends who are on the same journey, sharing the same goals, and experiencing the same game together.

Also, I don't really see the difference between the point and click method and the games you've mentioned. Sure you might be exploring dungeons or jumping around carrying a Crystal Chalice, but it all boils down to moving your joystick/arrow pad and pushing a button to attack the same old monsters... which in my opinion, isn't that much different than the point and click method. You do get skills and make strategies in those games and it'll be the same with this game just in another way.

If you don't like the MMOs out there, then I think that means most of the MMOs are probably not for you. There are many genres of games, if you feel like this isn't for you, then you can always look for another game more befitting to you.

[RD-Malachi]

Quick to jump to the gun, as I see it, it is only adding more possibilities if gamepay and items. Why complain about more free stuff to an already free game. If you think it will suck, then why are you even playing this. Kids these days.

[PokeLamia]

Din Whispers

Sure a lot of MMOs are repetitive, probably all of them, but I find enjoyment in that certain repetitiveness. One can slay thousands upon thousands of monsters and I find gratification from earning my levels to progress further to harder areas. Part of the excitement doesn't really come in the game itself. It comes from meeting new aquaintances or making friends who are on the same journey, sharing the same goals, and experiencing the same game together.

Also, I don't really see the difference between the point and click method and the games you've mentioned. Sure you might be exploring dungeons or jumping around carrying a Crystal Chalice, but it all boils down to moving your joystick/arrow pad and pushing a button to attack the same old monsters... which in my opinion, isn't that much different than the point and click method. You do get skills and make strategies in those games and it'll be the same with this game just in another way.

If you don't like the MMOs out there, then I think that means most of the MMOs are probably not for you. There are many genres of games, if you feel like this isn't for you, then you can always look for another game more befitting to you.

In those games there isnt feedback though, there isnt a response you just click on something and its automatic, you cant try harder, you cant think quickly, you cant change your plans, If I'm fighting a monster i think is impossible in CCFF I might find a weak point and beat it, If i find one in Wow, In a point and click adventure movement also dosent matter, you just stand there and attack for a minute or 10, dodging attacks, and EVEN taking blows for your friends are all possible in a system that is coded more like CCFF or PSO, and thats just the start, you can get into even more stratagies and interactivness for each level of detail you want to add. unconventional items become usable, you can hide under tables use a large log to keep distance between you and your enemy. all of which would be rather impossible on a point and click because there is no hit calculation, attack is automatic.

[Din Whispers]

I'll give you that those games are more responsive and provide faster feedback, in which you find patterns and move according to beat a monster or boss. Its an in the moment adrenline rush. I see MMOs in a different light, because the battles truely take place outside of the game. You think of ways to make your character more efficient and plan out your how you build your character, figuring out how to respond in situations beforehand then putting them into actions. Its a sense of creation and experimenting, if you fail, you come up with a new take on your builds and strategies. Its about coming up with ways to approach the enemy, looking in the future rather than the now.

Thats how I see it anyways.

[PokeLamia]

Din Whispers

I'll give you that those games are more responsive and provide faster feedback, in which you find patterns and move according to beat a monster or boss. Its an in the moment adrenline rush. I see MMOs in a different light, because the battles truely take place outside of the game. You think of ways to make your character more efficient and plan out your how you build your character, figuring out how to respond in situations beforehand then putting them into actions. Its a sense of creation and experimenting, if you fail, you come up with a new take on your builds and strategies. Its about coming up with ways to approach the enemy, looking in the future rather than the now.

Thats how I see it anyways.

Well You can really do both in a game like mine, Lets make an example, you go into battle guns blazing with your magic caster and you tank taking hits, for this example we will use only two combatants although in a truely epic battle you could have more, the problem is this enemy is a infernal centaur ranger, and he keeps picking off your damn spell caster before you can do anything about it. so instead after you train to the next level, or whatever proccess the game has for improving your hero, you make your warrior take arrow snatch, he drops his heavy shield sheiths his sword and this time arround he consentrates on catching or deflecting those arrows ala some sort of reflex save (possibly something like RE4), something he wouldnt have been able to do last battle, while the arcane witch works her magic. next level he might take a skill that makes him better at throwing the arrows back at the target so when he has to gaurd from arrows he can be more usefull

[Din Whispers]

Wouldn't something like that example make battles more linear? I mean the warrior has to drop everything so he can catch arrows and let the caster do the work. The combatants would have to use the same couple tactics everytime they encounter that type of enemy. In the point and click players are more free to do what they want.. even though a lot of players would most likely let the auto-attack do all the work, they can still pop a strong skill if they want or even a pointless one.

I have to go to sleep, its getting late here. It was nice discussing this with you.