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 Posted: Wed May 01, 2013 7:36 pm
 Where do these come into the Bible, etc? How do they fit in relation to the Word of God? Also, what about the solar system- planets and such- how do these come in?
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Posted: Wed May 01, 2013 7:52 pm
Well, they don't. People didn't know about dinosaurs when the bible was written. There's no reason they should appear in it. You only really run into trouble if you take Genesis literally, but my impression is that this is a minority of Christians nowadays.
I don't know about planets. I imagine if they aren't in there, it's because they weren't relevant to the story being told.
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Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 9:40 am
Sanguina Cruenta Well, they don't. People didn't know about dinosaurs when the bible was written. There's no reason they should appear in it. You only really run into trouble if you take Genesis literally, but my impression is that this is a minority of Christians nowadays. I don't know about planets. I imagine if they aren't in there, it's because they weren't relevant to the story being told.
Or perhaps dinosaurs simply aren't relevant to the point the Bible was making?
Or perhaps dinosaurs were commonplace and so simply another animal?
There are multiple animals that aren't mentioned in the Bible, and there are multiple places that aren't mentioned, either.
Consider this: just because something isn't in the Bible doesn't mean that the Bible is any less accurate, or that such things didn't exist at the time. If something is relevant or necessary, it will be in the Bible.
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Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 9:41 am
Subliminal Aftermath Where do these come into the Bible, etc? How do they fit in relation to the Word of God? Also, what about the solar system- planets and such- how do these come in?
Consider the mysteries of God.
Read the last part of Job. Starting in chapter 38. Read through to the end of the book.
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Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 11:55 am
They are not mentioned by name, but they must have been included in the creation of animals. Also, they could not have existed and died before man because death was not introduced until Adam and Eve sinned.
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Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 11:44 pm
Scarlet_Teardrops Sanguina Cruenta Well, they don't. People didn't know about dinosaurs when the bible was written. There's no reason they should appear in it. You only really run into trouble if you take Genesis literally, but my impression is that this is a minority of Christians nowadays. I don't know about planets. I imagine if they aren't in there, it's because they weren't relevant to the story being told.
Or perhaps dinosaurs simply aren't relevant to the point the Bible was making?
Or perhaps dinosaurs were commonplace and so simply another animal?
There are multiple animals that aren't mentioned in the Bible, and there are multiple places that aren't mentioned, either.
Consider this: just because something isn't in the Bible doesn't mean that the Bible is any less accurate, or that such things didn't exist at the time. If something is relevant or necessary, it will be in the Bible.
With respect, I didn't say it was less accurate. I said there's no reason to expect dinosaurs to be in there, because the people who wrote it didn't know about them. I said you will only have an issue if you take Genesis literally, which doesn't seem to be the most popular view by any stretch. In other words, it's not a problem for most Christians and doesn't shake their faith or their belief in the bible, because Genesis to them is about the lessons provided and the underlying truth of god as creator etc., not "this is what actually happened and how it actually happened, literally". If it's a problem for you - if you're a biblical literalist, if everything must be accurate literally or none of it is accurate at all, and you find yourself in a situation where you either must discard the bible or discard science, I can't help you with that. You have to come to your own understanding there. Not literal doesn't mean inaccurate. I'm aware of where I'm posting. I'm not going to go around saying "the bible is inaccurate" because that would be rude and inappropriate. Anyway I haven't read it all, so you'd know about its inaccuracies better than I would. I'm just saying, OK, there's no reason to expect dinosaurs to be in the bible. They didn't coexist with humanity and people didn't know about them back then. There's nothing shameful about that. Requiring the people who wrote the bible to have known about dinosaurs would be astoundingly unfair of us. I'm with you on the "they weren't relevant" thing, but you don't avoid problems by saying "maybe they were just another animal, so weren't mentioned" because they all died about 64 million years before humanity turned up. The bible is about humanity, so why would dinosaurs be in it, "just another animal" or not?
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Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 11:48 pm
Servant Reborn They are not mentioned by name, but they must have been included in the creation of animals. Also, they could not have existed and died before man because death was not introduced until Adam and Eve sinned. Suggestion: God being omniscient, he knew we would sin. I doubt time is as relevant for God as it is for us humans, and as such, would it be unreasonable to suggest he retroactively allowed death to everything that came before us in the billion or so years of life on the planet? When the sin occurred would just be incidental to him, as he is eternal, and time wouldn't affect him the way it does us.
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Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 5:37 pm
I don't think so. Death was part of the curse of sin. There would be no reason for death to happen. The suggestion you provide almost makes me think..that God was trying to hide his mistakes, yet God makes no mistakes. All he made was good, and that would include dinosaurs. Understand? sweatdrop
Why would God kill the dinosaurs in the first place? confused Anyway, I agree time would not be the same for God as he is eternal, and He knew we would sin or else Jesus Christ would not have been there in the beginning.
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Posted: Wed May 08, 2013 12:34 am
Servant Reborn I don't think so. Death was part of the curse of sin. There would be no reason for death to happen. The suggestion you provide almost makes me think..that God was trying to hide his mistakes, yet God makes no mistakes. All he made was good, and that would include dinosaurs. Understand? sweatdrop Why would God kill the dinosaurs in the first place? confused Anyway, I agree time would not be the same for God as he is eternal, and He knew we would sin or else Jesus Christ would not have been there in the beginning. I know what you mean, but are you assuming death is bad? Without death how could we be with God in paradise? Without death you and I wouldn't exist, because there would just be Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden as was at the beginning. You'd have to say that you and I weren't part of God's plan, that everything that happened in the history of the world except that which took place in the garden of Eden wasn't God's plan. Which just sounds bizarre to me, because God would have known it was all going to happen, and set things up so that they would. If Eve was not intended to take the fruit, god, knowing she would anyway, could have banished the serpent ahead of time, or put the tree somewhere less easy to get to. As you said, God must have planned sin. Otherwise, the conclusion is either that God made a horrendous mistake, or god is not omniscient. With a perfect and omniscient deity, God must have planned everything to happen the way it did. So death must be a part of god's plan. I merely suggest that the curse of sin is retroactive. Possibly we are not on the same page as per the age of the world. But if you have issues with "the world cannot be billions of years old because humans didn't exist back then and there can't have been death", possibly retroactive curse of sin could reconcile you there. Just an idea. But I see what you're saying - it's like God using sin as an "excuse" for death, when God doesn't need excuses for anything because he's God and can just say "well, deal with it, my work is perfect, too bad". On the other hand, you might take Genesis 6:6-7 to be evidence that God can make mistakes. Why would he regret something if he knew it was going to happen, and did it anyway? People do that sometimes, often if they're drunk, but God is perfect and should be immune to Bad Decision-Making Brought On By Alcohol. Or Ambrosia. Or whatever it is God drinks. On sin bringing death into the world. If we suppose that everything exists as God made it, they cannot have changed after the introduction of sin, yes? Why would God make animals so well suited to hunting if he never intended them to hunt? Why would he make things so well suited to detecting and running from danger if he never intended for them to have anything to flee from? Not all God made was good. He says as much in Isaiah 45:7. Unless you define good as "made by God" in which case everything made by God would be good, but that would also include some terrible things like anencephaly and flesh-eating bacteria and poverty and famine and.... and prolapse. And parasitic worms that live in your eyeballs. Now I'm with you on dinosaurs being good. I'd go so far to say that dinosaurs were wicked awesome. Was Jesus there at the beginning? Is that a.... a biblical ret-con, or something? I get very confused on what counts as "God" and what counts as "God the father". Let's just say I am not convinced by the Trinitarian view. But that's another discussion. And I don't know why God killed the dinosaurs. You'd have to ask him. Why make something he was just planning on wiping out anyway? I suppose one could say the same of humanity, as he wiped out most of us as well, if one takes the story of Noah literally. That would be a part of the unknown nature of God or something, I suppose. Maybe he just thought dinosaurs were neat. This conversation is interesting! Thanks for it. smile
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Posted: Wed May 08, 2013 12:07 pm
I would argue that originally everything was good, but not so anymore. In your first example of Genesis, you mention how God was displeased by man. Indeed, he would be displeased because they had become wicked. We are like that because of our sin. I don't see why there is an issue for Him to regret. Personally, it has happened to me. My grandfather was a heavy drinker and smoker, and I knew early on it would impact his health, and lead to death. He never listened to me, ignored the reality of it, and kept at it. So, I knew ahead of time he would die from this, but when..was a mystery. Needless to say, he died. I did regret it because even though I KNEW WHERE IT WOULD LEAD, it did not change my love for my grandpa. I wanted him to live healthy and without that addiction. Death is tragic. The only good that came was that he became saved before he died. Otherwise, you know where he would go.
You are correct when say that God knew everything. Oh, and let me explain about Jesus in the beginning.
Genesis 1:1-2 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 The earth was without form, and void; and darkness was on the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters.
Genesis 3:22-24
22 Then the Lord God said, “Behold, the man has become like one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put out his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever”— 23 therefore the Lord God sent him out of the garden of Eden to till the ground from which he was taken. 24 So He drove out the man; and He placed cherubim at the east of the garden of Eden, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to guard the way to the tree of life.
God has always been God. Therefore, he must have had the Holy Spirit and Jesus Christ present or else he would cease to be God. Who is "Us" if not Jesus? He also carried the Holy Spirit, which is why He died to give it to us, right?
I think plan is the wrong word. I mean, he foresaw, but it was not his intention. His intention was that humans would live with him and all. Nevertheless, he has the power to use "bad" for good. He gave us free will to choose for ourselves and glorify him.
Death is bad. Why else did Jesus weep when Mary wept when her brother had died? He had compassion for their loss. Anyway, I don't know how old or young the planet is.
I suppose..the heart of this is that a retroactive use of death seems..against His character in my opinion. However, you are right He wiped out almost everything with the flood. I'm just thinking that..well, first, what did animals eat? If there was death, they must have eaten each other. But later in the Bible, when new kingdom is mentioned, animals eat grass. So, did dinosaurs eat grass or each other?
....This post is all over the place, but because I'm trying to organize my thoughts. lol
Ok so...let's forget what they ate for now. The dinosaurs were wiped out and the only thought I might come to is that..they were supposed to be..a testament of how awesome and imaginative he can be. It's weak argument, but I can't think of anything.
But wait. Wasn't..Leviathan a dinosaur? confused
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