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 Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 9:05 am
This is a response to the two largely contrasting opinions of the use of the PYT thread. I personally can recognize both the points being made (not in the argument), I'm talkin about bogging the thread down with huge tl'drs that only a few people want to read. But at the same time, where else do you post? it's a thought aint it!?
Enter, the DDT.
No it's not parasite removal. No it won't ruin your vegetables. What it is, is the Deep Discussion Thread. So thus when you enter this thread, expect some TL;DR... uh I mean deep discussions. The point is a topic is being covered here, and people can chime in and what have you. I feel like this might be a bit better than keeping things in the PYT, just because it favors both the people who want to post this stuff, and those who would prefer to not take 10 minutes to catch up on recent posts.
Hope you enjoy!
and if this thread ain't viable, I'll just delete it, so NBD right?
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:50 am
Why do I want to say something about Rammus saving the day here?
I don't know, but you a bro.
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:52 am
Medeus Those conclusions are all correct ones to come to, if you don't understand the whole picture. Although for the record, you are the one who brought up God, so you realize that you've invited me to share what I know on that topic, eh? God decided that Unconditional Love was the only fair way to be close to the ones who choose to Love him back. If he used his power to force people into Loving him, by definition it wouldn't be true Love. So you can't question his Power if he's choosing not to use it for Our sake. If he Forced everybody in the world to choose Good every time, it wouldn't be a choice, and that would make God sadistic and cruel. If his Power isn't in question, then you move on to his Motives. Why would he allow suffering in a world that's supposed to be forgiven? Well, Why would he bother forgiving anybody if he just liked to watch suffering happen? Why would he have sent his Son to Die for our sake, if he Wanted us to keep doing what we were doing as if it didn't matter? You're right LPS, You are Loved and Forgiven for everything you do, but you've already told me that You're the only one who's forgiveness matters to you. You're choosing not to accept a free gift from the God who just wants to hang out with you, because you're That important to him. But how could he force you to look his way, and still call it Love? You're so important to Him that he's chosen to sit with you while you're gazing off in the distance, he's closer by than you know, and you don't know because you've decided that you don't like it. If you truly believed you were forgiven by God, you would Live as if God had forgiven you, and you're not doing that. Wouldn't it make a difference to you if you found out that the Creator of the Universe and everyone in it Wants to talk to you? That He Wants to make a difference in your Life, but he can't because you won't let him? The question isn't "Why is there Suffering in the world if God is Love?", The question is, "Why are you choosing to suffer when God's Love and Mercy is waiting for you to realize it's there?" Would you please stop telling me I 'don't understand' things just because I don't see them the way you do? neutral Honestly, this feels like the conversation between John Smith and Pocahontas where he tells her she 'doesn't know any better' and she's 'uncivilized'. What is right for you is not right for everyone, and what you want is not what everyone wants. Until you understand that, you have no real foundation to be telling anyone else they don't understand something just because they don't value and desire the same things as you.
When you get right down to it the foundation of my belief is that I am God, in that I am the creator of my own reality. That's what I believe the Bible means by 'made in God's image' - I interpret that as less of a physical image and more of an extension of the creative ability. So as long as I forgive and love and accept myself and do what makes me happy, one could argue that I am basking in God's love and forgiveness in every moment, that I am honoring and accepting God because I am honoring and accepting and loving and forgiving myself. And by that logic, God has made a difference in my life - I didn't used to love myself. I used to want to believe that everything was out of my control so I could shift the blame - to my environment, to a higher power, to anyone but me. I used to want to feel powerless because it was better than feeling like I could be doing something and just wasn't. And that didn't make me feel good. One could argue that I wasn't letting God into my life then, because I was disempowering myself and submitting to the ideology that everything was out of my hands.
But believing in myself has done wonderful things for me, and having faith that I am in complete control of my reality has proven both true and beneficial through my experiences. An external God who tells me to live in fear of judgment and waste my life doing what they tell me I 'shalt' and 'shalt not' do so I can get into some members-only afterlife won't ever compare to the feeling of power, freedom, and security I get right now by knowing that I am always loved, always protected, and always in control. Something that feels this good can't possibly be the 'wrong' conclusion, and if it is, why should I care, if it's what makes me happy? If your interpretation of God doesn't want me to be happy regardless of how I choose to live and what I choose to believe, then it's not an interpretation of God I need in my life. And if your interpretation of God does want me to be happy, then you are doing him/her a disservice by trying to 'correct' beliefs I am already happy with simply because they do not line up with yours.
Also, this entire conversation started with you trying to connect laughter to your religious 'truth', and got derailed into God when I tried to share my perspectives on 'evil'. I think it's gone on more than long enough, given its relatively light beginnings. I'll just try to remember to steer clear of engaging in these conversations with you in the future, since I don't really enjoy how many judgments you seem to throw into your arguments.
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 7:09 pm
Cabron LaSwan
Medeus Those conclusions are all correct ones to come to, if you don't understand the whole picture. Although for the record, you are the one who brought up God, so you realize that you've invited me to share what I know on that topic, eh? God decided that Unconditional Love was the only fair way to be close to the ones who choose to Love him back. If he used his power to force people into Loving him, by definition it wouldn't be true Love. So you can't question his Power if he's choosing not to use it for Our sake. If he Forced everybody in the world to choose Good every time, it wouldn't be a choice, and that would make God sadistic and cruel. If his Power isn't in question, then you move on to his Motives. Why would he allow suffering in a world that's supposed to be forgiven? Well, Why would he bother forgiving anybody if he just liked to watch suffering happen? Why would he have sent his Son to Die for our sake, if he Wanted us to keep doing what we were doing as if it didn't matter? You're right LPS, You are Loved and Forgiven for everything you do, but you've already told me that You're the only one who's forgiveness matters to you. You're choosing not to accept a free gift from the God who just wants to hang out with you, because you're That important to him. But how could he force you to look his way, and still call it Love? You're so important to Him that he's chosen to sit with you while you're gazing off in the distance, he's closer by than you know, and you don't know because you've decided that you don't like it. If you truly believed you were forgiven by God, you would Live as if God had forgiven you, and you're not doing that. Wouldn't it make a difference to you if you found out that the Creator of the Universe and everyone in it Wants to talk to you? That He Wants to make a difference in your Life, but he can't because you won't let him? The question isn't "Why is there Suffering in the world if God is Love?", The question is, "Why are you choosing to suffer when God's Love and Mercy is waiting for you to realize it's there?" Would you please stop telling me I 'don't understand' things just because I don't see them the way you do? neutral Honestly, this feels like the conversation between John Smith and Pocahontas where he tells her she 'doesn't know any better' and she's 'uncivilized'. What is right for you is not right for everyone, and what you want is not what everyone wants. Until you understand that, you have no real foundation to be telling anyone else they don't understand something just because they don't value and desire the same things as you.
When you get right down to it the foundation of my belief is that I am God, in that I am the creator of my own reality. That's what I believe the Bible means by 'made in God's image' - I interpret that as less of a physical image and more of an extension of the creative ability. So as long as I forgive and love and accept myself and do what makes me happy, one could argue that I am basking in God's love and forgiveness in every moment, that I am honoring and accepting God because I am honoring and accepting and loving and forgiving myself. And by that logic, God has made a difference in my life - I didn't used to love myself. I used to want to believe that everything was out of my control so I could shift the blame - to my environment, to a higher power, to anyone but me. I used to want to feel powerless because it was better than feeling like I could be doing something and just wasn't. And that didn't make me feel good. One could argue that I wasn't letting God into my life then, because I was disempowering myself and submitting to the ideology that everything was out of my hands.
But believing in myself has done wonderful things for me, and having faith that I am in complete control of my reality has proven both true and beneficial through my experiences. An external God who tells me to live in fear of judgment and waste my life doing what they tell me I 'shalt' and 'shalt not' do so I can get into some members-only afterlife won't ever compare to the feeling of power, freedom, and security I get right now by knowing that I am always loved, always protected, and always in control. Something that feels this good can't possibly be the 'wrong' conclusion, and if it is, why should I care, if it's what makes me happy? If your interpretation of God doesn't want me to be happy regardless of how I choose to live and what I choose to believe, then it's not an interpretation of God I need in my life. And if your interpretation of God does want me to be happy, then you are doing him/her a disservice by trying to 'correct' beliefs I am already happy with simply because they do not line up with yours.
Also, this entire conversation started with you trying to connect laughter to your religious 'truth', and got derailed into God when I tried to share my perspectives on 'evil'. I think it's gone on more than long enough, given its relatively light beginnings. I'll just try to remember to steer clear of engaging in these conversations with you in the future, since I don't really enjoy how many judgments you seem to throw into your arguments. One question: How do you know? How do you know that you're the best you've got? How do you know there isn't something better out there for you? How do you know that by retaining the life that comes from acknowledging and giving yourself to Others, even external God sometimes, won't bring you an even greater happiness? It's good that you're confidant, it's good that you love yourself and have high self-esteem, because most people don't even have that, and it's one of the things that God wants for you. He's not out to try and put you in a box of rules and regulations so that He gets all the glory for it. Sure, he has some guidelines that are meant to keep you safe, healthy, and Thriving on freedom, not in spite of the 'guidelines, but because of them. He's asking you, as a gentleman, to give him room to move freely in Your world of truth so that he can be even more amazing, even more creative, even more Giving to You individually than you Might be capable of on your own. I think you're right in that the Spirit reflects God by creativity, but a mirror requires both a Maker and a Face looking into it to be really fulfilling it's purpose, for a mirror cannot look into itself and know who/what it is entirely on it's own. It requires a reflection to know who it's not and where/how it should to expand into what it's meant to be. Obviously anybody can go about it on their own. But they'll never know if it's better to walk with a friend if they never invite a friend to walk with them in the first place. That's my only point; How do you know?
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 7:38 pm
Medeus One question: How do you know? How do you know that you're the best you've got? How do you know there isn't something better out there for you? How do you know that by retaining the life that comes from acknowledging and giving yourself to Others, even external God sometimes, won't bring you an even greater happiness? It's good that you're confidant, it's good that you love yourself and have high self-esteem, because most people don't even have that, and it's one of the things that God wants for you. He's not out to try and put you in a box of rules and regulations so that He gets all the glory for it. Sure, he has some guidelines that are meant to keep you safe, healthy, and Thriving on freedom, not in spite of the 'guidelines, but because of them. He's asking you, as a gentleman, to give him room to move freely in Your world of truth so that he can be even more amazing, even more creative, even more Giving to You individually than you Might be capable of on your own. I think you're right in that the Spirit reflects God by creativity, but a mirror requires both a Maker and a Face looking into it to be really fulfilling it's purpose, for a mirror cannot look into itself and know who/what it is entirely on it's own. It requires a reflection to know who it's not and where/how it should to expand into what it's meant to be. Obviously anybody can go about it on their own. But they'll never know if it's better to walk with a friend if they never invite a friend to walk with them in the first place. That's my only point; How do you know? How do you know if your better off or not? I could ask you the same thing; how do you know your life is better with a strong faith then without it? When we do wrong, we blame ourselves. that's natural. When a christian does wrong, they blame themselves, again, natural. here is my issue. When we accomplish something, we give ourselves the credit. I worry that when some christians accomplish something, they give god the credit. I've seen this in a lot of people, and I know that if everything I did that was good was credited, at least in some part, to God, that I would have very little confidence in myself. So I can ask you the same thing; how do you know your better off with a strong faith? Your answer should be that you don't, simply because you haven't lived the other side. My answer is the same, I haven't lived the other side. I haven't lived religiously, so i can't tell you that my life would be better or worse. But here's the thing. Your probably going to say that its better with. and that's fine, cause i would say without. neither of us have evidence (inb4 bible is evidence). But the point is it doesn't matter to either of us, because we think our life is better this way, and that kinda makes it true. that confidence that you have in god is the same confidence i have in knowing i am responsible for me. Neither is wrong.
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 7:53 pm
Rhed King How do you know if your better off or not? I could ask you the same thing; how do you know your life is better with a strong faith then without it? When we do wrong, we blame ourselves. that's natural. When a christian does wrong, they blame themselves, again, natural. here is my issue. When we accomplish something, we give ourselves the credit. I worry that when some christians accomplish something, they give god the credit. I've seen this in a lot of people, and I know that if everything I did that was good was credited, at least in some part, to God, that I would have very little confidence in myself. So I can ask you the same thing; how do you know your better off with a strong faith? Your answer should be that you don't, simply because you haven't lived the other side. My answer is the same, I haven't lived the other side. I haven't lived religiously, so i can't tell you that my life would be better or worse. But here's the thing. Your probably going to say that its better with. and that's fine, cause i would say without. neither of us have evidence (inb4 bible is evidence). But the point is it doesn't matter to either of us, because we think our life is better this way, and that kinda makes it true. that confidence that you have in god is the same confidence i have in knowing i am responsible for me. Neither is wrong. You wrongly assume that I haven't lived on the other side. Trust me, I know what it's like to give myself the credit for everything I do, and I am not too proud of the things I've done because of that. You know I'm the one who has to take credit for getting myself an a**-wart that I had to have surgically removed today? I'm the one who gave my whole family Scabies last summer, because I knew better than God did what was good for me. If I give myself credit for all the Good things, I have to give myself credit for all the bad, and that's harder to bear than the former. But God said that He would Empower me to do Great things, he Said he'd give me the credit for doing amazing things that are helpful, life-giving, and full of love, so long as I thank him for giving me the Tools to do so. He Also said that he would take all my bad stuff, and that I don't have to take credit for that anymore. It may have been my fault, but God promised me that it wouldn't count against me if I just gave it to him. So here's me without God: -I take all the credit -I take all the blame -I have no way of knowing if God will still let me have good things Me With God: -I give him thanks -I receive great blessings -I've been promised eternal life because of it. God has promised me everything. I've experienced what it's like to live without him, and I know from that experience that I do a lot more bad on my own than good. I know not everybody thinks that way, but I would never have known how Bad I had it if God hadn't shown up in my life as an amazing kind of comparative Good. Now I know there's a lot of talk about rules and guidelines, and being forced to Do things that will take away from you, but none of that makes sense until you understand that God genuinely wants Good for you, and would be willing to forsake the rules for You if You're willing to take a leap of faith and trust that he wants everything for you. He's not just willing to meet you Halfway, he's willing to go 99% of the way for You, because you mean That much to him, and that 1% difference will change your world so drastically, you might not even know what hit you. But you'll never really know until you risk that 1% in the hopes of gaining all 99% AND more of/than what you may not already have, in addition to fantastic things that you didn't even know you wanted.
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 8:00 pm
Rhed King Medeus One question: How do you know? How do you know that you're the best you've got? How do you know there isn't something better out there for you? How do you know that by retaining the life that comes from acknowledging and giving yourself to Others, even external God sometimes, won't bring you an even greater happiness? It's good that you're confidant, it's good that you love yourself and have high self-esteem, because most people don't even have that, and it's one of the things that God wants for you. He's not out to try and put you in a box of rules and regulations so that He gets all the glory for it. Sure, he has some guidelines that are meant to keep you safe, healthy, and Thriving on freedom, not in spite of the 'guidelines, but because of them. He's asking you, as a gentleman, to give him room to move freely in Your world of truth so that he can be even more amazing, even more creative, even more Giving to You individually than you Might be capable of on your own. I think you're right in that the Spirit reflects God by creativity, but a mirror requires both a Maker and a Face looking into it to be really fulfilling it's purpose, for a mirror cannot look into itself and know who/what it is entirely on it's own. It requires a reflection to know who it's not and where/how it should to expand into what it's meant to be. Obviously anybody can go about it on their own. But they'll never know if it's better to walk with a friend if they never invite a friend to walk with them in the first place. That's my only point; How do you know? How do you know if your better off or not? I could ask you the same thing; how do you know your life is better with a strong faith then without it? When we do wrong, we blame ourselves. that's natural. When a christian does wrong, they blame themselves, again, natural. here is my issue. When we accomplish something, we give ourselves the credit. I worry that when some christians accomplish something, they give god the credit. I've seen this in a lot of people, and I know that if everything I did that was good was credited, at least in some part, to God, that I would have very little confidence in myself. So I can ask you the same thing; how do you know your better off with a strong faith? Your answer should be that you don't, simply because you haven't lived the other side. My answer is the same, I haven't lived the other side. I haven't lived religiously, so i can't tell you that my life would be better or worse. But here's the thing. Your probably going to say that its better with. and that's fine, cause i would say without. neither of us have evidence (inb4 bible is evidence). But the point is it doesn't matter to either of us, because we think our life is better this way, and that kinda makes it true. that confidence that you have in god is the same confidence i have in knowing i am responsible for me. Neither is wrong. See, heres my problem with this whole discussion. In some way, were all biased against religious people in the fact that we think they all only turn to a higher power because they need something to believe because they don't trust themselves, or that all they want to do is 'CONVERT ALL THE NON-BELIEVERS' Or we just see one example of devout followers who are a bit extreme and develop that opinion (or something similar) about EVERYONE OF THAT FAITH. IT'S LIKE RACISM, CEPT WITH FAITH! D: (jk) No. I believe in God. I believe that through him, I have the strength to get through my day. I thank him when something goes right because if my fate were to have things go wrong who could I blame? s**t goes wrong. It ain't God's fault It ain't my fault. It happens. If J does good? I thank God and give myself a damn Cookie. I give God credit for giving me the capacity and the strength to do Good. Why not? He deserves my thanks. Real or not, SOME power up there deseves my thanks for creating me and giving me the ABILITY TO DO GOOD. I pray to him IN HOPES that my day will go right and that people are safe and happy and stuff. Heres another thing: I KNOW everyone isn't happy. I KNOW they arent always safe. The world is a drark and scary place. FULL of uncertainties. But I agree with med. Why be afraid of these uncertainties? No one here is FORCING God upon you. Were just saying (speaking on my own and possibly Meds behalf if he agrees) is we choose to believe in God because we believe we were created by a higher power. We call it God. You might call it Fate or "The Big Bang and Evolution" But what made those? What made ANYTHING? I unno. Something. You have the right to call it whatever. But I choose to call it GOD.
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 8:39 pm
Medeus Rhed King How do you know if your better off or not? I could ask you the same thing; how do you know your life is better with a strong faith then without it? When we do wrong, we blame ourselves. that's natural. When a christian does wrong, they blame themselves, again, natural. here is my issue. When we accomplish something, we give ourselves the credit. I worry that when some christians accomplish something, they give god the credit. I've seen this in a lot of people, and I know that if everything I did that was good was credited, at least in some part, to God, that I would have very little confidence in myself. So I can ask you the same thing; how do you know your better off with a strong faith? Your answer should be that you don't, simply because you haven't lived the other side. My answer is the same, I haven't lived the other side. I haven't lived religiously, so i can't tell you that my life would be better or worse. But here's the thing. Your probably going to say that its better with. and that's fine, cause i would say without. neither of us have evidence (inb4 bible is evidence). But the point is it doesn't matter to either of us, because we think our life is better this way, and that kinda makes it true. that confidence that you have in god is the same confidence i have in knowing i am responsible for me. Neither is wrong. You wrongly assume that I haven't lived on the other side. Trust me, I know what it's like to give myself the credit for everything I do, and I am not too proud of the things I've done because of that. You know I'm the one who has to take credit for getting myself an a**-wart that I had to have surgically removed today? I'm the one who gave my whole family Scabies last summer, because I knew better than God did what was good for me. If I give myself credit for all the Good things, I have to give myself credit for all the bad, and that's harder to bear than the former. But God said that He would Empower me to do Great things, he Said he'd give me the credit for doing amazing things that are helpful, life-giving, and full of love, so long as I thank him for giving me the Tools to do so. He Also said that he would take all my bad stuff, and that I don't have to take credit for that anymore. It may have been my fault, but God promised me that it wouldn't count against me if I just gave it to him. So here's me without God: -I take all the credit -I take all the blame -I have no way of knowing if God will still let me have good things Me With God: -I give him thanks -I receive great blessings -I've been promised eternal life because of it. God has promised me everything. I've experienced what it's like to live without him, and I know from that experience that I do a lot more bad on my own than good. I know not everybody thinks that way, but I would never have known how Bad I had it if God hadn't shown up in my life as an amazing kind of comparative Good. Now I know there's a lot of talk about rules and guidelines, and being forced to Do things that will take away from you, but none of that makes sense until you understand that God genuinely wants Good for you, and would be willing to forsake the rules for You if You're willing to take a leap of faith and trust that he wants everything for you. He's not just willing to meet you Halfway, he's willing to go 99% of the way for You, because you mean That much to him, and that 1% difference will change your world so drastically, you might not even know what hit you. But you'll never really know until you risk that 1% in the hopes of gaining all 99% AND more of/than what you may not already have, in addition to fantastic things that you didn't even know you wanted. Ok, you don't have experience outside of God. Your life can suck with or without him. Im not asking you to reference before or after, though I realize that I phrased it poorly. My question there was rhetorical. because you can't turn your belief in god on or off, and see the difference, you live with god on, and I live with god off, if you will. I hope that makes sense, i'll admitt i did a bad job explaining that. For J: I do believe in God, but I'm pretty convinced that I can't begin to assume i have the capacity to ask him to do anything; and I don't feel that I want to rely on him either. I guess what I'm saying is that I feel like it's restricting to have something like god as such a big part of your life
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:25 pm
Rhed King Ok, you don't have experience outside of God. Your life can suck with or without him. Im not asking you to reference before or after, though I realize that I phrased it poorly. My question there was rhetorical. because you can't turn your belief in god on or off, and see the difference, you live with god on, and I live with god off, if you will. I hope that makes sense, i'll admitt i did a bad job explaining that. For J: I do believe in God, but I'm pretty convinced that I can't begin to assume i have the capacity to ask him to do anything; and I don't feel that I want to rely on him either. I guess what I'm saying is that I feel like it's restricting to have something like god as such a big part of your life I think there's a small part of everybody that believes in Something bigger than themselves, though of course I have no way to prove it. Look, trusting God can't make you weaker than you already are. Never in your childhood would anybody blame you for asking things of your Parents right? It's not like you were helpless; in fact children are designed to be independent. But your parents were better equipped to take care of you than You were at the time. That never changes as you grow older, except when you get into bigger and better things you have to go to a bigger and better source. Even if you feel you don't want things per-say, God would love to give you his Time, cuz he has eternity to wait for you. On almost all levels, All he really wants from you is conversation, running dialogue, a little time out of your day that you can spare for him, because You're important enough to God to spend time with. You see it as restricting to ask for something from the God who Created Everything, and has open storehouses of wealth to share with the ones who ask; I see it as more "restricting" to rely on whatever meager portions you may be able to scrap up at the end of every day, eh?
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:38 pm
Medeus Even if you feel you don't want things per-say, God would love to give you his Time, cuz he has eternity to wait for you. On almost all levels, All he really wants from you is conversation, running dialogue, a little time out of your day that you can spare for him, because You're important enough to God to spend time with. ...Why?
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Sharkbutt The Orgiastic Crew
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:45 pm
Wantcookie Medeus Even if you feel you don't want things per-say, God would love to give you his Time, cuz he has eternity to wait for you. On almost all levels, All he really wants from you is conversation, running dialogue, a little time out of your day that you can spare for him, because You're important enough to God to spend time with. ...Why? Why are you important to God?
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:48 pm
Medeus Wantcookie Medeus Even if you feel you don't want things per-say, God would love to give you his Time, cuz he has eternity to wait for you. On almost all levels, All he really wants from you is conversation, running dialogue, a little time out of your day that you can spare for him, because You're important enough to God to spend time with. ...Why? Why are you important to God? No. Why actively worship/pray/etc. to God when, if He's omnipotent and omnipresent, simply being to the best of your ability should be more than enough?
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Sharkbutt The Orgiastic Crew
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 9:06 pm
Wantcookie Medeus Wantcookie Medeus Even if you feel you don't want things per-say, God would love to give you his Time, cuz he has eternity to wait for you. On almost all levels, All he really wants from you is conversation, running dialogue, a little time out of your day that you can spare for him, because You're important enough to God to spend time with. ...Why? Why are you important to God? No. Why actively worship/pray/etc. to God when, if He's omnipotent and omnipresent, simply being to the best of your ability should be more than enough? Because, at that point, you'd still be choosing to do it alone. He's not asking you to lose faith in yourself. Think about it this way: if Life were a race, everybody is given the tools and ability to run it to the end on their own. God isn't trying to take any of that away. But he is offering to run it with you, and give you help if/when you need it. He's not taking away from your strength, he's adding to it. All he wants is to run right next to you, and he wants you to know that he's available and willing to be called on whenever you need. That's just God being a good friend. It would be good-friendly of you to talk to him while he's there, thank him when he helps you out, and let him know that you enjoy his company. If you don't enjoy his company, he'll be a gentleman and get out of your way, but he never stays far from earshot in case you ever change your mind about wanting a friend. So the real question is, not "Why Worship someone who's there regardless?"; the question becomes, "Why not give thanks to someone who's there, and is offering to help you out?". eh?
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 9:12 pm
Medeus Wantcookie Medeus Wantcookie Medeus Even if you feel you don't want things per-say, God would love to give you his Time, cuz he has eternity to wait for you. On almost all levels, All he really wants from you is conversation, running dialogue, a little time out of your day that you can spare for him, because You're important enough to God to spend time with. ...Why? Why are you important to God? No. Why actively worship/pray/etc. to God when, if He's omnipotent and omnipresent, simply being to the best of your ability should be more than enough? Because, at that point, you'd still be choosing to do it alone. He's not asking you to lose faith in yourself. Think about it this way: if Life were a race, everybody is given the tools and ability to run it to the end on their own. God isn't trying to take any of that away. But he is offering to run it with you, and give you help if/when you need it. He's not taking away from your strength, he's adding to it. All he wants is to run right next to you, and he wants you to know that he's available and willing to be called on whenever you need. That's just God being a good friend. It would be good-friendly of you to talk to him while he's there, thank him when he helps you out, and let him know that you enjoy his company. If you don't enjoy his company, he'll be a gentleman and get out of your way, but he never stays far from earshot in case you ever change your mind about wanting a friend. So the real question is, not "Why Worship someone who's there regardless?"; the question becomes, "Why not give thanks to someone who's there, and is offering to help you out?". eh? But isn't the action of using what you were given to it's very limit thanks enough?
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Sharkbutt The Orgiastic Crew
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 9:19 pm
Wantcookie Medeus Wantcookie Medeus Wantcookie Medeus Even if you feel you don't want things per-say, God would love to give you his Time, cuz he has eternity to wait for you. On almost all levels, All he really wants from you is conversation, running dialogue, a little time out of your day that you can spare for him, because You're important enough to God to spend time with. ...Why? Why are you important to God? No. Why actively worship/pray/etc. to God when, if He's omnipotent and omnipresent, simply being to the best of your ability should be more than enough? Because, at that point, you'd still be choosing to do it alone. He's not asking you to lose faith in yourself. Think about it this way: if Life were a race, everybody is given the tools and ability to run it to the end on their own. God isn't trying to take any of that away. But he is offering to run it with you, and give you help if/when you need it. He's not taking away from your strength, he's adding to it. All he wants is to run right next to you, and he wants you to know that he's available and willing to be called on whenever you need. That's just God being a good friend. It would be good-friendly of you to talk to him while he's there, thank him when he helps you out, and let him know that you enjoy his company. If you don't enjoy his company, he'll be a gentleman and get out of your way, but he never stays far from earshot in case you ever change your mind about wanting a friend. So the real question is, not "Why Worship someone who's there regardless?"; the question becomes, "Why not give thanks to someone who's there, and is offering to help you out?". eh? But isn't the action of using what you were given to it's very limit thanks enough? Is it? If I gave you a Pencil for Christmas, and you sharpened it down to the stub, I would just assume it was a useful gift, and be glad I gave it to you, but it's not like Using it was the same as taking the time for a quick "Thanks for the pencil!" Now, using it meant you appreciated it, and it was a good Gift, but don't think God would be surprised to find you Using something he already knew you'd need, eh? The whole point is building a Relationship with him, not just taking the nice things and moving on with life. He wants to spend time with you, wants to give you nice things, wants to share his abundance with you, but he can only do that if you let him, and you can't let him do that if you're busy pretending like he isn't there in the first place, just taking the nice things he puts in front of you, never caring where it came from.
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