|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
 Posted: Thu Aug 06, 2009 8:17 am
Koiyuki Quick question: how would someone use the construct of までもない? Are there any particular moods it's meat to convey? From the looks of the jgram article, までもない is constructed by placing a plain form verb infront of it. I am not sure of other ways of how it is used. A quick translation of it is " no need to". Edit: This grammatical form is level 1 on the JLPT, the highest level of it. As such, most grammatical forms mean the same thing as simplier level 4 and level 3 grammar forms. According to Jgram, this phrase would be very similar to しなくてもいい or "don't have to do". Resources: JgramALCIt appears that it can be used whenever a situation is obvious when explaining or doing something that is not required. Double Edit: The construction has been solved. までもない comes after a verb phrase in the plain form.
|
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Aug 23, 2009 10:10 pm
Koiyuki A brief interruption to the asking of questions: If I see any more threads in this subforum that ask for a word or sentence translation from this moment, they will locked ON SIGHT WITHOUT WARNING OR ANY RESPONSE FROM ME. Thank you. Since I seem to be seeing these inappropriately placed much more often, I'm making a bit of a change to my policy. Instead of locking it, it will be deleted, on sight, with no warning.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Mon Aug 31, 2009 4:19 pm
How do I write this knaji?
熊
*,*;;
(beginner at kanji)
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 12:06 am
PINK GHOUL How do I write this knaji?
熊
*,*;;
(beginner at kanji) (disclaimer: I, nor any of my current literature or resources have even a hint as to the actual stroke order) To begin, I would like to state some general rules about writing Kanji #1- Vertical strokes go from top to bottom #2- Horizontal strokes are from left to right #3- When 2 lines cross, the horizontal line #4- When forming each of the elements, start from the top left most element and work your way down(of course there are exceptions to this) Secondly, I would like to discuss radicals. Radicals in the context of Kanji are other parts of the language that come together to create entirely new words. Kuma, for example, is composed of ム and ヒ surrounding 月 with one upward dash and 3 downward dashes along the bottom. There is a proper stroke order for all Kanji and in time you will learn them all, but as long as you keep those rules in minds, you'll be pick apart any new Kanji you may come across and at the very least have an idea as to how it can be approached. A bit of cultural perspective: many Japanese often lose the ability to remember the stroke order to a lot of Kanji as their use for physically writing it decreases and they become more reliant on other means, such as E-mails and cell phones, and if it's to complex/unnecessary for them to write they often just write it in Hiragana, which sometimes becomes an accepted thing to do among the general population(such is the case with the 2 verbs for existance,有(あ)る & 居(い)る)
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 7:30 pm
PINK GHOUL How do I write this knaji?
熊
*,*;;
(beginner at kanji) Although it is on a website that helps English speakers learn Chinese, this is one of the best sites I have come across to learn and practice Chinese characters in general. For the most part, the ones used in Japan aren't that different than one's used in Taiwan and the mainland. Anyway, here's a link that might help you. http://www.yellowbridge.com/chinese/character-stroke-order.php?searchChinese=1&zi=熊 I would suggest it to you too Koiyuki if you are unsure of correct stroke order.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:11 am
How would you write a noun that did something in a sentence? For example:
• Yesterday, I saw the guy that punched me.
• I read the book with the red cover. (not sure if this fits in)
• The girl who ate the candy kicked a puppy.
I can say "the girl ate candy" and "the girl kicked a puppy" but I'm not sure how you'd put those together.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:36 am
TurtIe Tracks How would you write a noun that did something in a sentence? For example: • Yesterday, I saw the guy that punched me. • I read the book with the red cover. (not sure if this fits in) • The girl who ate the candy kicked a puppy. I can say "the girl ate candy" and "the girl kicked a puppy" but I'm not sure how you'd put those together. Ahh, you mean relative clauses. To begin let's present 2 basic two subject sentences. 昨日は映画を見た. 女はブロンドの毛がある. To make these into relative clauses, you simply move the main topic of the sentence to the end, with the verb or い adjective being used being rendered in the plain form. When you do that, the sentence looks more like this: 映画を見た昨日(rest of sentence). With sentences that end with nouns you would use の to attach it to the sentence(if it ends with a な adjective we use な to attach it) and make it a relative clause, so your sentence would look like this: ブロンドの毛の女(rest of sentence) The same basic rule applies for multiple relative clauses being used in a single sentence, with the less notable clause coming first in the sentence, IE if I wanted to say "A store where girls who like spending cash gather is Forever 21" the clause in red would come first, the clause in blue second and the verb in green coming last. That particular sentence would look like this: お金を遣うのが 好きな女が 集まる店はForever 21です.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 6:32 pm
Koiyuki TurtIe Tracks How would you write a noun that did something in a sentence? For example: • Yesterday, I saw the guy that punched me. • I read the book with the red cover. (not sure if this fits in) • The girl who ate the candy kicked a puppy. I can say "the girl ate candy" and "the girl kicked a puppy" but I'm not sure how you'd put those together. Ahh, you mean relative clauses. To begin let's present 2 basic two subject sentences. 昨日は映画を見た. 女はブロンドの毛がある. To make these into relative clauses, you simply move the main topic of the sentence to the end, with the verb or い adjective being used being rendered in the plain form. When you do that, the sentence looks more like this: 映画を見た昨日(rest of sentence). With sentences that end with nouns you would use の to attach it to the sentence(if it ends with a な adjective we use な to attach it) and make it a relative clause, so your sentence would look like this: ブロンドの毛の女(rest of sentence) The same basic rule applies for multiple relative clauses being used in a single sentence, with the less notable clause coming first in the sentence, IE if I wanted to say "A store where girls who like spending cash gather is Forever 21" the clause in red would come first, the clause in blue second and the verb in green coming last. That particular sentence would look like this: お金を遣うのが 好きな女が 集まる店はForever 21です. Wow, thank you so much for the quick and informative response! biggrin So, would "I read the book with a red cover." would be "赤いジャケットの本を読んだ。"? (Or I guess "赤いジャケットの本を読みました。")
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 7:04 pm
TurtIe Tracks Koiyuki TurtIe Tracks How would you write a noun that did something in a sentence? For example: • Yesterday, I saw the guy that punched me. • I read the book with the red cover. (not sure if this fits in) • The girl who ate the candy kicked a puppy. I can say "the girl ate candy" and "the girl kicked a puppy" but I'm not sure how you'd put those together. Ahh, you mean relative clauses. To begin let's present 2 basic two subject sentences. 昨日は映画を見た. 女はブロンドの毛がある. To make these into relative clauses, you simply move the main topic of the sentence to the end, with the verb or い adjective being used being rendered in the plain form. When you do that, the sentence looks more like this: 映画を見た昨日(rest of sentence). With sentences that end with nouns you would use の to attach it to the sentence(if it ends with a な adjective we use な to attach it) and make it a relative clause, so your sentence would look like this: ブロンドの毛の女(rest of sentence) The same basic rule applies for multiple relative clauses being used in a single sentence, with the less notable clause coming first in the sentence, IE if I wanted to say "A store where girls who like spending cash gather is Forever 21" the clause in red would come first, the clause in blue second and the verb in green coming last. That particular sentence would look like this: お金を遣うのが 好きな女が 集まる店はForever 21です. Wow, thank you so much for the quick and informative response! biggrin So, would "I read the book with a red cover." would be "赤いジャケットの本を読んだ。"? (Or I guess "赤いジャケットの本を読みました。") There is a section on the wikipedia page explaining relative causes in languages for Japanese. It can be found here.Relative causes can be directly tided to noun phrases in sentences in Japanese. Your example of "I read the book with a read cover" is a good sentence with a relative phrase in English, but not quite in Japanese. Maybe saying "The book I read with the red cover was interesting" would make it more like a sentence with a relative clause in Japanese. ”赤いジャケットの読んだ本は面白かった。” Would be a way of saying that. Even though 読む is a verb, since it is modifying the noun in the phrase, I can use the particle の in front of it like it was a noun. You could probably also say ”読んだ赤いジャケットの本は面白かった。” There is a nuance probably with the exact translation in English, but to me both sound of equal meaning. (Occasionally, I write a sentence down how it would probably be spoken, but not necessarily grammatically correct. Please be patient with me).
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 7:06 pm
TurtIe Tracks Koiyuki TurtIe Tracks How would you write a noun that did something in a sentence? For example: • Yesterday, I saw the guy that punched me. • I read the book with the red cover. (not sure if this fits in) • The girl who ate the candy kicked a puppy. I can say "the girl ate candy" and "the girl kicked a puppy" but I'm not sure how you'd put those together. Ahh, you mean relative clauses. To begin let's present 2 basic two subject sentences. 昨日は映画を見た. 女はブロンドの毛がある. To make these into relative clauses, you simply move the main topic of the sentence to the end, with the verb or い adjective being used being rendered in the plain form. When you do that, the sentence looks more like this: 映画を見た昨日(rest of sentence). With sentences that end with nouns you would use の to attach it to the sentence(if it ends with a な adjective we use な to attach it) and make it a relative clause, so your sentence would look like this: ブロンドの毛の女(rest of sentence) The same basic rule applies for multiple relative clauses being used in a single sentence, with the less notable clause coming first in the sentence, IE if I wanted to say "A store where girls who like spending cash gather is Forever 21" the clause in red would come first, the clause in blue second and the verb in green coming last. That particular sentence would look like this: お金を遣うのが 好きな女が 集まる店はForever 21です. Wow, thank you so much for the quick and informative response! biggrin So, would "I read the book with a red cover." would be "赤いジャケットの本を読んだ。"? (Or I guess "赤いジャケットの本を読みました。") That would be correct. It's a rather simple way to integrating more complex Japanese into your everyday structure, and communicate more detailed info, such as where you bought the jacket you wore yesterday, or where you saw that girl with the mole on her chin.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 7:15 pm
Koiyuki TurtIe Tracks Koiyuki TurtIe Tracks How would you write a noun that did something in a sentence? For example: • Yesterday, I saw the guy that punched me. • I read the book with the red cover. (not sure if this fits in) • The girl who ate the candy kicked a puppy. I can say "the girl ate candy" and "the girl kicked a puppy" but I'm not sure how you'd put those together. Ahh, you mean relative clauses. To begin let's present 2 basic two subject sentences. 昨日は映画を見た. 女はブロンドの毛がある. To make these into relative clauses, you simply move the main topic of the sentence to the end, with the verb or い adjective being used being rendered in the plain form. When you do that, the sentence looks more like this: 映画を見た昨日(rest of sentence). With sentences that end with nouns you would use の to attach it to the sentence(if it ends with a な adjective we use な to attach it) and make it a relative clause, so your sentence would look like this: ブロンドの毛の女(rest of sentence) The same basic rule applies for multiple relative clauses being used in a single sentence, with the less notable clause coming first in the sentence, IE if I wanted to say "A store where girls who like spending cash gather is Forever 21" the clause in red would come first, the clause in blue second and the verb in green coming last. That particular sentence would look like this: お金を遣うのが 好きな女が 集まる店はForever 21です. Wow, thank you so much for the quick and informative response! biggrin So, would "I read the book with a red cover." would be "赤いジャケットの本を読んだ。"? (Or I guess "赤いジャケットの本を読みました。") That would be correct. It's a rather simple way to integrating more complex Japanese into your everyday structure, and communicate more detailed info, such as where you bought the jacket you wore yesterday, or where you saw that girl with the mole on her chin. These kind of phrases are also EXTREMELY difficult for machine translators to work with (they fail to realize who is doing the verb in the relative clause) so they must be understood well if you are going to translate from Japanese to English. But, translation is a whole another ball game in terms of style and how one goes about translating a phrase.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 7:25 pm
IdiotbyDefault Koiyuki TurtIe Tracks Koiyuki TurtIe Tracks How would you write a noun that did something in a sentence? For example: • Yesterday, I saw the guy that punched me. • I read the book with the red cover. (not sure if this fits in) • The girl who ate the candy kicked a puppy. I can say "the girl ate candy" and "the girl kicked a puppy" but I'm not sure how you'd put those together. Ahh, you mean relative clauses. To begin let's present 2 basic two subject sentences. 昨日は映画を見た. 女はブロンドの毛がある. To make these into relative clauses, you simply move the main topic of the sentence to the end, with the verb or い adjective being used being rendered in the plain form. When you do that, the sentence looks more like this: 映画を見た昨日(rest of sentence). With sentences that end with nouns you would use の to attach it to the sentence(if it ends with a な adjective we use な to attach it) and make it a relative clause, so your sentence would look like this: ブロンドの毛の女(rest of sentence) The same basic rule applies for multiple relative clauses being used in a single sentence, with the less notable clause coming first in the sentence, IE if I wanted to say "A store where girls who like spending cash gather is Forever 21" the clause in red would come first, the clause in blue second and the verb in green coming last. That particular sentence would look like this: お金を遣うのが 好きな女が 集まる店はForever 21です. Wow, thank you so much for the quick and informative response! biggrin So, would "I read the book with a red cover." would be "赤いジャケットの本を読んだ。"? (Or I guess "赤いジャケットの本を読みました。") That would be correct. It's a rather simple way to integrating more complex Japanese into your everyday structure, and communicate more detailed info, such as where you bought the jacket you wore yesterday, or where you saw that girl with the mole on her chin. These kind of phrases are also EXTREMELY difficult for machine translators to work with (they fail to realize who is doing the verb in the relative clause) so they must be understood well if you are going to translate from Japanese to English. But, translation is a whole another ball game in terms of style and how one goes about translating a phrase. Indeed. I think one of the greatest challenges of learning/translating a language isn't just the grammar, but also understanding the speaker's intent with their statement, on top of any cultural barriers that are faced when taking phrases and concepts from one to the next. In my view a proficient speaker and translator of a language knows not just how to speak the words, but also the history and meaning behind them, and communicating that to those you are communicating them to without having to restate it every single time, and doing so with the same fluency in the language being translated into as the one it's being translated from.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2009 12:04 pm
How do the japanese make their japanese casual? I want to learn to speak casual because people says that my japanese is way too polite. do they like omit all the particles or something?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2009 12:52 pm
It really depends on how to define casual. There are several levels of casual speak, much of it stemming from using plain forms and more informal language and terms. If you're going as a tourist of the country, I would recommend sticking to the neutral polite forms, since they, like many others around the world, reserve casual language for those we are more familiar with
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2009 1:12 pm
Koiyuki It really depends on how to define casual. There are several levels of casual speak, much of it stemming from using plain forms and more informal language and terms. If you're going as a tourist of the country, I would recommend sticking to the neutral polite forms, since they, like many others around the world, reserve casual language for those we are more familiar with yeah, like i want to know infomal and plain. and i have another question. do like the japanese omit all the particles in the sentence when speaking in casual form??
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
