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 Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:12 pm
Hinote Tosatsu Lance Fulgurant Username: Lance Fulgurant RPC Name: Kane Nanashi RPC Rank: Genin Bloodline/Clan/Demon: Hyoton Profession: Ninjutsu Specialist Ninja Types: Elemental Control(Hyoton), Combo User Talent Description: When performing Hyoton techniques of his rank or lower, Kane may choose to perform the technique without hand-seals, or without the incantation, but he must still must perform hyoton techniques of higher rank and other techniques as normal. When near large quantities of snow/ice, Kane may perform techniques below his rank using neither hand-seals nor incantations, but does not receive the extreme environment bonus from elemental control, and receives no chakra control bonuses. Talent Sacrifice: Kane is treated as having the Weak-Bodied profession weakness in addition to his chosen profession weakness(fewer weapon/taijutsu styles) How it happened: While still in the academy, Kane was bullied by most of the larger, stronger students because of his quietness, perceiving his soft-spoken nature for weakness. One day, as two students brutally beat him while a third held his arms behind his back, Kane felt a power welling up inside of himself and a sudden frigid blast of air sent his attackers flying. Since then, Kane has learned to perform all Hyoton techniques without the use for seals or words. Try, "When in an extreme environment Kane is able to use Hyoton jutsu with neither seals nor incantation, but does not receive any power or chakra bonuses when using jutsu this way." Or some variation thereof in your own words. Makes a tiny bit more sense than to say you don't receive the environmental bonus when it's just a tweak on the bonus. Still approved. Alright, I just want to make sure I understand, would this mean he would not still receive the +1 or he would? just want to make sure we're on the same page
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Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:17 pm
Lance Fulgurant Hinote Tosatsu Lance Fulgurant Username: Lance Fulgurant RPC Name: Kane Nanashi RPC Rank: Genin Bloodline/Clan/Demon: Hyoton Profession: Ninjutsu Specialist Ninja Types: Elemental Control(Hyoton), Combo User Talent Description: When performing Hyoton techniques of his rank or lower, Kane may choose to perform the technique without hand-seals, or without the incantation, but he must still must perform hyoton techniques of higher rank and other techniques as normal. When near large quantities of snow/ice, Kane may perform techniques below his rank using neither hand-seals nor incantations, but does not receive the extreme environment bonus from elemental control, and receives no chakra control bonuses. Talent Sacrifice: Kane is treated as having the Weak-Bodied profession weakness in addition to his chosen profession weakness(fewer weapon/taijutsu styles) How it happened: While still in the academy, Kane was bullied by most of the larger, stronger students because of his quietness, perceiving his soft-spoken nature for weakness. One day, as two students brutally beat him while a third held his arms behind his back, Kane felt a power welling up inside of himself and a sudden frigid blast of air sent his attackers flying. Since then, Kane has learned to perform all Hyoton techniques without the use for seals or words. Try, "When in an extreme environment Kane is able to use Hyoton jutsu with neither seals nor incantation, but does not receive any power or chakra bonuses when using jutsu this way." Or some variation thereof in your own words. Makes a tiny bit more sense than to say you don't receive the environmental bonus when it's just a tweak on the bonus. Still approved. Alright, I just want to make sure I understand, would this mean he would not still receive the +1 or he would? just want to make sure we're on the same page The +1 is inherent in the type at all times, that would just make the additional bonus unavailable when using the special jutsu method.
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Hinote Tosatsu Vice Captain
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Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:33 pm
Hinote Tosatsu Lance Fulgurant Hinote Tosatsu Lance Fulgurant Username: Lance Fulgurant RPC Name: Kane Nanashi RPC Rank: Genin Bloodline/Clan/Demon: Hyoton Profession: Ninjutsu Specialist Ninja Types: Elemental Control(Hyoton), Combo User Talent Description: When performing Hyoton techniques of his rank or lower, Kane may choose to perform the technique without hand-seals, or without the incantation, but he must still must perform hyoton techniques of higher rank and other techniques as normal. When near large quantities of snow/ice, Kane may perform techniques below his rank using neither hand-seals nor incantations, but does not receive the extreme environment bonus from elemental control, and receives no chakra control bonuses. Talent Sacrifice: Kane is treated as having the Weak-Bodied profession weakness in addition to his chosen profession weakness(fewer weapon/taijutsu styles) How it happened: While still in the academy, Kane was bullied by most of the larger, stronger students because of his quietness, perceiving his soft-spoken nature for weakness. One day, as two students brutally beat him while a third held his arms behind his back, Kane felt a power welling up inside of himself and a sudden frigid blast of air sent his attackers flying. Since then, Kane has learned to perform all Hyoton techniques without the use for seals or words. Try, "When in an extreme environment Kane is able to use Hyoton jutsu with neither seals nor incantation, but does not receive any power or chakra bonuses when using jutsu this way." Or some variation thereof in your own words. Makes a tiny bit more sense than to say you don't receive the environmental bonus when it's just a tweak on the bonus. Still approved. Alright, I just want to make sure I understand, would this mean he would not still receive the +1 or he would? just want to make sure we're on the same page The +1 is inherent in the type at all times, that would just make the additional bonus unavailable when using the special jutsu method. Alrighty, just making sure I understood correctly, cool, I will make the correction in my profile, thanks again for the help mrgreen
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 9:49 pm
Username: Hinote Tosatsu
RPC Name: David Greyson
RPC Rank: B
Bloodline/Clan/Demon: Ichibi
Profession: Teaching Master
Ninja Types: Tactical, Combo
Talent Description: Sandstone Creation:
Combining his Ichibi granted control over sand with the sand compaction jutsu, David has developed the ability to apply sand compaction not only to sand for storage, but sand jutsu as well. By using the sand compaction technique on a sand jutsu, the technique's strength is increased by one half rank for each compaction level used on it. (To a maximum of four levels, as that is his limit.) This strength is in the form of durability, raising the jutsu's ability to hold up against attacks. Offensive jutsu specifically stated to use their hardness as part of their attack power also rise in offensive power, at the same rate.
Talent Sacrifice:
For each level of compaction, the amount of sand used to form the jutsu must be increased by the full requirement of the jutsu. (A jutsu that requires three units requires six at level one, nine at level two, twelve at level three, and fifteen at level four.)
Furthermore, a jutsu may only be compacted by one level per post, meaning it would take a full four posts to reach level four compaction.
Compacting a jutsu requires the use of the sand compaction technique in every compaction post.
Flexible jutsu lose their flexibility when compacted, holding their form permanently.
How it happened: There's no real story here. David learns jutsu, David sees method of using jutsu, David uses method. Very simple, very straightforward. Nobody said David had much care for fancy reasons and backgrounds. I've made some modifications since I PM'd this to you, so it's probably a bit better now. Still couldn't think of a traditional sacrifice, but as I think I mentioned before, this is more like a specialized jutsu method than an actual talent. A second opinion to help smooth things up a bit more?
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Hinote Tosatsu Vice Captain
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 10:27 pm
Question: Say you compacted a jutsu only once. Would you be able to use it in that same post (assuming you are not a combo user), or no?
Other than that, I believe this is good. Your thoughts, captain?
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Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 5:38 am
As you know I like popping in at random times to be a pain in the ***. here I go.
wouldn't crushing the sand into sandstone just turn it into doton jutsu? Also since it goes from a more or less fluid (flexible) state of being to a rigid one i'm guessing it would affect his reaction time (say to move the sand in the way of an attack) as well as speed.
It seems the tradeoff would be speed and reaction time for defensive and possibly offensive strength boost.
You mention he can compact it for storage as well. Could you pre-compact the sand so you don't actually have to spend that time or chakra later on? that seems to ruin your weakness completely.
even two ranks ranks of possible boost seems like a lot whether it is defensive or offensive. having it affect both would be pushing it even further as you said is possible "Offensive jutsu specifically stated to use their hardness as part of their attack power also rise in offensive power, at the same rate".
If you have any other boosts that could be applied (dunno if ichibi gives you a boost) this talent could permit more than the 2 rank boost you suggest
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Hinote Tosatsu Vice Captain
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Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 8:10 am
@Greg: I am a combo user, but in the instance that I was not, the jutsu would have to be used in one post, followed in the next post by compaction. The jutsu could however be fired in the same post as a compaction, since it's technically already been used, just held back. In the case of a combo user, the jutsu could be cast, compacted once, and fired, in a single post.
@Hikaro: This idea is based entirely off of this sand jutsu.
Suna Kojinmari [Sand Compaction]
Rank: E
Type: Ninjutsu | Supplementary
Element: Sand
Units: 0
Description: This technique was created when the lack of an abundance of sand being available was recognized as a severe hindrance to invading sand shinobi. While gourds of sand could be used to allow the user to take sand with them, the amounts contained within a normal gourd were insufficient for higher-level techniques. This technique does not eliminate the need for gourds, but rather it complements it. By using chakra to forcefully pack sand together, the user can hold a vast amount more sand inside a normal gourd, allowing them to double its regular capacity. Additionally, as the sand is kept held in place by the users chakra, the sand does not add any extra weight to the gourd. If the user has any chakra control benefits, they can compress their sand even more, allowing their gourd to hold even more. Base – 1x – One benefit – 2x – Two benefits – 3x, and so on. Sand based benefits in particular, such as Elemental Control Sand, count as two benefits by default. This technique is passive after it is activated, costing no chakra, but it's effects can not be stacked.
Sand, sufficiently packed together, becomes sandstone, being much stronger than normal sand. However, it is still sand regardless, and bac be broken down just as easily as it was hardened. If you've ever held a piece of sandstone I'm sure you'll understand, but if not, simply know that the stuff crumbles back into sand if you put enough pressure on it with your hand. Of course, this technique uses chakra to harden it a good deal beyond the point of easily breaking it down, but that is the basis of it.
This isn't for use with sand manipulation, but rather sand jutsu, so the speed and reaction time don't really apply. Any jutsu with built in speed that would be affected at all by this, would likely be considered "Flexible", and thus lose all mobility anyways.
Pre-compacting the sand before use would not work, since it'd be in a form different from the jutsu required. Turning that compacted sand into the jutsu form would break it down to level zero, or no compaction again.
The two rank boost is a lot, but you also have to recall that to achieve that you must spend four posts doing nothing but focusing on the jutsu intended. Basically, it becomes a charging time, and you're basically helpless until it's done, if you want the full charge. I could even go back to Greg's question and say that the jutsu could not be cast/fired in the same post as compaction, making it a six post charging time for level four, if that really seemed a problem. I might even do that anyways, cause now I think of it it sounds kind of fun. Though it does cut down the immediate usefulness of the trick quite a lot.
(Note: This charging time really only applies to jutsu with offensive capability. Defensive jutsu such as walls are obviously static, thus don't require being "Fired" after casting them.)
The Ichibi does in fact give a boost. Elemental control sand. And yes, it does make this a bit OP at level four, if used in the desert. That's why it's mostly restricted to static, or defensive jutsu. When I originally wrote it up it included offensive, which Greg rightly shot down for being too much. I still felt the need to include the note about offensive jutsu that I did, due to jutsu such as the sand staff, which have set durability levels which would logically be affected by this.
Suna Tsue [Sand Staff]
Rank: C
Type: Ninjutsu | Supplementary
Element: Sand
Units: 3
Description: A technique handy when the user is left defenseless against an armed opponent. Performing a series of seals and holding their hand above the ground, large amounts of sand will fly towards the user as if being drawn by a magnet. The sand will clump and stick together in an elongated shape that will take the form of a bo staff. It can be used in the exact same fashion as that of a normal staff, that is to deliver and defend from attacks, though due to it’s nature it can only take so much punishment before crumbling. The staff can receive three attacks of up to A rank strength, or an equivalent of lower attacks, before crumbling. It can however be repaired on the fly by sacrificing E ranked chakra. Every sacrifice of E ranked chakra can repair the damage from one A ranked attack. Additionally the user can cause the entire length of the staff to be covered in sand spikes which can rip and tear skin if a direct hit is given. These spikes cost D ranked chakra to create.
As can be seen, this jutsu has a built in durability limit. Now, Elemental Control would have no effect on this jutsu. It wouldn't make sense for it to, since it's actual attack power relies on the user's strength, not the jutsu. However, the talent would be able to increase the durability by hardening the staff. Level one would raise it to A.5, followed by AE(Since I don't believe in jutsu being jumped from A to S directly.), AE.5, AD. If a convincing argument was made to have elemental controll effect the jutsu as well, it would jump it up further to AB.
The chances of my attaining an S ranked boost with this are actually stunningly low due to my own rule of looping A rank before hitting S.
Ask short yet meaningful questions, get massive rants for answers. =p
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Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 12:47 pm
as you said I don't think the staff's offensive ability is really affected. Except you could hit a person harder without it breaking.
thank you for the answers. If I think of more you can trust me to bring em up.
They weren't really yes or no questions and your answers weren't that long so don't worry about it.
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Hinote Tosatsu Vice Captain
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Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 10:08 pm
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Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 10:30 pm
Something I noticed. The "Talent Sacrifice" section doesn't really have a sacrifice, just limitations on the talent. It needs an actual sacrifice to be considered at talent.
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Hinote Tosatsu Vice Captain
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Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 10:49 pm
As I have mentioned previously, there is no relevant sacrifice for this. I would sacrifice taijutsu in the blink of an eye since I'll never use it anyways, but it has no connection with the talent. Furthermore, this is barely a talent at all. All of the bonuses it gives are balanced out internally by the restrictions, achieving the balance sought out by talent sacrifices already. And furthermore, it has been policy since this system was first released to allow talents, if sufficiently balanced and restricted within themselves, to allow them without an inherent sacrifice. These instances are of course rare since almost anything can have a sacrifice, but this one really doesn't.
The only reason I don't just make it as a jutsu instead, thereby bypassing the restriction entirely anyways, is because I personally feel it fits better as a talent. (And also because it's the only talent I can think of for David that I didn't cover in the updated Ichibi.)
Long story short, since it doesn't give any major bonuses, it doesn't really need a major weakness. Nothing I could come up with could be of equal value to the gain, and it'd be an improportionate loss.
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Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 12:24 am
Hinote Tosatsu As I have mentioned previously, there is no relevant sacrifice for this. I would sacrifice taijutsu in the blink of an eye since I'll never use it anyways, but it has no connection with the talent. Furthermore, this is barely a talent at all. All of the bonuses it gives are balanced out internally by the restrictions, achieving the balance sought out by talent sacrifices already. And furthermore, it has been policy since this system was first released to allow talents, if sufficiently balanced and restricted within themselves, to allow them without an inherent sacrifice. These instances are of course rare since almost anything can have a sacrifice, but this one really doesn't. The only reason I don't just make it as a jutsu instead, thereby bypassing the restriction entirely anyways, is because I personally feel it fits better as a talent. (And also because it's the only talent I can think of for David that I didn't cover in the updated Ichibi.) Long story short, since it doesn't give any major bonuses, it doesn't really need a major weakness. Nothing I could come up with could be of equal value to the gain, and it'd be an improportionate loss. As you have said previously and I've said myself, this is in fact barely a talent at all. Not only that, but I also mentioned my strong opposition to creating a talent that basically adds yet another ability or rather convoluted jutsu to the arsenal of a jinchuuriki, which for all intents and purposes this in fact is. Not only that, but in our talk I believe we went over what has happened in the past with talents and how they've been approved by others without actual sacrifices and instead some sort of restriction. I do believe I said that this goes against the whole purpose of the talent system, which is to give up something rather integral for a benefit in another area of equal importance. It has not been a policy within the talent system, but rather something enacted because of the leniency of those approving those talents. Had it been up to myself, the rules would have remained as rigid as they were when placed there. The reason bloodline talents have been approved in the past is because they seek to improve the usage of someones own bloodline in most cases. Looking back as little as Lance's own talent, it seeks to allow him to use what's already given to him in a different manner at the sacrifice of weapon and/or taijutsu styles. This works because a bloodline isn't something implanted within him, it's something that is apart of him. Unlike the ability you are applying for which would come from the Ichibi and not yourself, making it not even a talent of you, but rather the Ichibi. And when you get right down to what the talent is even as just something the Ichibi has, it's more of a technique. Honestly if this was desired, you could've just attempted to include such a thing in the Ichibi edits while you were doing it to avoid having to apply for it. In the end the talent system is plain and simple: You must lose one ability to gain another. If equivalent exchange cannot be created, then it cannot become a talent. You'd be better off working this into a watered down jutsu version and submitting it as a custom rather than putting it here. I hadn't replied in a while because through our conversation on this the night you submitted that I had assumed it was understood that I was for the most part opposed to it being a talent of any kind. P.S.- I did not wait to respond in an effort to halt progression of your RPC during our bout, since that came up the last time we spoke in a joking fashion. But seriously, I didn't wait this long to try and "wait you out" so-to-speak.
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Hinote Tosatsu Vice Captain
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Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 8:42 am
It's not really an Ichibi thing to be honest. It's a method of using a jutsu to enhance other jutsu. The Ichibi's involvement is limited to, and I should mention, I could probably exclude it even here, keeping the jutsu as mobile as it was originally, despite the added effects.
But, I suppose I have to give up on it now. I'll probably go ahead and convert it to jutsu format instead. (And think of another talent idea... =/)
I do disagree on not allowing jutsu to enhance jinchuuriki's demon abilities though. The demon may not be inherently a part of them, but they are expected to have some mastery of it's abilities, and a talent is simply a greater skill in an ability.
Side note: I hate having to apply for things within my own systems/areas...
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Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 10:18 am
Hinote Tosatsu It's not really an Ichibi thing to be honest. It's a method of using a jutsu to enhance other jutsu. The Ichibi's involvement is limited to, and I should mention, I could probably exclude it even here, keeping the jutsu as mobile as it was originally, despite the added effects. But, I suppose I have to give up on it now. I'll probably go ahead and convert it to jutsu format instead. (And think of another talent idea... =/) I do disagree on not allowing jutsu to enhance jinchuuriki's demon abilities though. The demon may not be inherently a part of them, but they are expected to have some mastery of it's abilities, and a talent is simply a greater skill in an ability. Side note: I hate having to apply for things within my own systems/areas... Yeah I mean as a jutsu it would probably just be a lot easier to deal with. And Hinote, that's kind of ridiculous in my opinion. A jinchuuriki gets a chakra bonus, a free element, and added passive abilities as well. Your demon already enhances your jutsu, gives you both fuuton and sunaton as elements even if you didn't have them before, treats sunaton as an elemental control element which basically gives you a third shinobi type, a resistance to genjutsu, and this is all before you even bother with a demon cloak. Your demon giving you these abilities is inherent proof that you already have mastery over them. This argument is something akin to a Ranmaru bloodline user who wanted Hikaro's Recon Mask to help them sense things around them better. You have beyond an arsenal of abilities behind your character based on the Ichibi already, adding more for 'mastery' purposes to me is just as pointless as the former. I'd suggest being content with what you have (I know you already are, but even more so haha) because there are many people in this guild who cannot even fathom the ability your RPC already possesses. Side Note: I know, it can be the worst.
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Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 2:17 pm
yaknow I kind of agree with Jinchuuriki not getting talents. At least not anything too strong. They do get a LOT from their demon abilities, plus profession and ninja type. I can see Hinote's argument, but if anyone shouldn't get a talent it should be jinchuuriki
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