Ritual Question?

[Fiddlers Green]

Musical_Vampire_Socks

I'm confused about something....
When you do a Ritual do you rise energy (Meditation, Praying, Singing, Dancing and more) first or do a spell first?

If you do spells that is...and if your consider the rising energy its own category in a ritual.

Well I do and I'm not sure which to do first and for what reasons. Should I Rise Energy for the spell first or do the spell and then rise energy to send it out to the universe after the spell or does it matter. What do you think?

Where shall you be appropriating your energy from?
Furthermore, is the spell in question functional because of it's precise interface with cosmic underpinnings, or is it functional as a focusing tool for your own will?  

[Fiddlers Green]

Musical_Vampire_Socks

I will be appropriating my energy from the universe.
The spells functionality is mutable.

Where in the universe? Have you checked the stability of your local geomancy to see if it can cope well with the influx of external energy, or if it has enough energy that it can be drawn from without damaging it?

As for it being mutable... let me put it this way instead, the spell you are going to use, would it work if the person performing it had no idea they were working a ritual, and would it work if they knew it wouldn't?  

[Fiddlers Green]

Musical_Vampire_Socks

Why do these questions matter can't you just tell me what you think about the question without asking me more questions about it? Would you rise energy first or would you do the spell first? I want to know what you think about it and how you would do it you way in your environment.

They matter the same way when one discusses fruit, it matters whether one wishes to discuss oranges or apples. For some it would be the one way, for others it would be different. Some spells shape energy that is already present, like chiseling an ice sculpture, others create a path thru which energy later brought to the equation flow... like creating irrigation canals and then letting the water pass thru them. Still other spells work around a system of exchange or petition to request or demand the aid of other entities in achieving the desired results. There is not a clear and concise nomenclature in widespread enough use to know when someone requests information about rituals or spells, which they are talking about.
I ask so that I might better understand your question.  

[Aino Ailill]

Fiddlers Green

Musical_Vampire_Socks

I will be appropriating my energy from the universe.
The spells functionality is mutable.

Where in the universe? Have you checked the stability of your local geomancy to see if it can cope well with the influx of external energy, or if it has enough energy that it can be drawn from without damaging it?

What do you mean by this? I am afraid I don't comprehend.  

[Fiddlers Green]

Aino Ailill

Fiddlers Green

Musical_Vampire_Socks

I will be appropriating my energy from the universe.
The spells functionality is mutable.

Where in the universe? Have you checked the stability of your local geomancy to see if it can cope well with the influx of external energy, or if it has enough energy that it can be drawn from without damaging it?

What do you mean by this? I am afraid I don't comprehend.

Okay, let's assume a universal ebb and flow of energy.
I shall call it Vis.
Vis is in all things, it is a part of all things. It flows about the world, and pools and eddies in areas or beings.
The Geomancy of an area is the natural currents alongst which it flows. Not unlike naturally occurring rivers and streams.
In some such areas, water may be added to or taken away in certain quantities without appreciably damaging the ecosystem. Especially if it is the same kind of water (fresh or salt).
However, take too much, or introduce too much, or of the wrong kind, and you can damage the ecosystem in horrible ways.
The same works with Vis and Geomancy.
Instead of fish getting disturbed by their now dehydrated or saline environ, however, it is anything that is part of the local Geomancy.
Does that help at all?  

[CuAnnan]

Musical_Vampire_Socks

Why do these questions matter

I have attempted to write this several times now, but the sheer disgust that this question has provoked in me is making it difficult to keep my temper.
The question he asked was possibly the most fundamental question that should be asked of any self-trained ecclectic practitioner.
Those of us that have traditions to fall back on know that the Hearth/Circle/Summoning Triangle/Self/Insert-tradition-specific-containing-method-here will work.
What consideration do you give to the magics of others? What of the effect your "spell" is going to have on the alchemist ten blocks down the road who's doing very sensitive electromagnetic manipulations? Or the medium who's trying to clear out their house?
Or the poor sensitive b*****d who doesn't believe in magic?

Musical_Vampire_Socks

Would you rise energy first or would you do the spell first?

Neither.

Musical_Vampire_Socks

I want to know what you think about it and how you would do it your way in your environment.

Why?
My environment is completely different to yours. There's a castle in mine. And a Catholic Seminary. And a University.
All within a quarter mile of each other and a mile of my house.
Do you have these things?
Do you live in a valley, on a plain, on a mountain, on a heath?
Why would the practices of my tradition, in my area, work for you in your tradition or area?
I do not understand what you hope to get out of this.  

[Aino Ailill]

Fiddlers Green

Aino Ailill

Fiddlers Green

Musical_Vampire_Socks

I will be appropriating my energy from the universe.
The spells functionality is mutable.

Where in the universe? Have you checked the stability of your local geomancy to see if it can cope well with the influx of external energy, or if it has enough energy that it can be drawn from without damaging it?

What do you mean by this? I am afraid I don't comprehend.

Okay, let's assume a universal ebb and flow of energy.
I shall call it Vis.
Vis is in all things, it is a part of all things. It flows about the world, and pools and eddies in areas or beings.
The Geomancy of an area is the natural currents alongst which it flows. Not unlike naturally occurring rivers and streams.
In some such areas, water may be added to or taken away in certain quantities without appreciably damaging the ecosystem. Especially if it is the same kind of water (fresh or salt).
However, take too much, or introduce too much, or of the wrong kind, and you can damage the ecosystem in horrible ways.
The same works with Vis and Geomancy.
Instead of fish getting disturbed by their now dehydrated or saline environ, however, it is anything that is part of the local Geomancy.
Does that help at all?

Very much, thank you!

Edit: I have just googled Geomancy and it is called a divination practice. Is your use of the term unique? Are there multiple uses? Where did your use of the term, and this concept, derive from?  

[CuAnnan]

Aino Ailill

Is your use of the term unique?

Nope. It's used over here to mean much the same.
"Mancy", while it's etymology is certainly to divine, has come to mean "the magic of", for want of a better term.

Aino Ailill

Where did your use of the term, and this concept, derive from?

I'm not actually certain in my case. Much like necromancy doesn't evoke the concept of divining via the dead, I guess.  

[Fiddlers Green]

Aino Ailill

Very much, thank you!

Edit: I have just googled Geomancy and it is called a divination practice. Is your use of the term unique? Are there multiple uses? Where did your use of the term, and this concept, derive from?

Glad to help.
As for using the term geomancy, it is a matter of outgrowth. The -mancy suffix denotes divination thru the medium of. To me, this is the gateway step. The geomantic lines, or the lines (interconnectivity between points) that one would look at when performing geomancy are the core of the matter. The actual term my society uses for the study of vis interactions in natural and constructed systems is not something I am at liberty to share, and I know no better terminology. I did not invent the usage of this term, however, it is considered vulgar amongst my society. Sorta like talking about Star Fish or Jelly Fish. We all know they aren't fish, but it just sorta stuck.

As Cu mentioned, it is related to Necromancy having connotations other than just divination with the dead, altho, it all starts with being aware.  

[TeaDidikai]

CuAnnan

Musical_Vampire_Socks

Why do these questions matter

I have attempted to write this several times now, but the sheer disgust that this question has provoked in me is making it difficult to keep my temper.

I had a similar reaction.

Quote:

Why?
My environment is completely different to yours. There's a castle in mine. And a Catholic Seminary. And a University.
All within a quarter mile of each other and a mile of my house.
Do you have these things?
Do you live in a valley, on a plain, on a mountain, on a heath?
Why would the practices of my tradition, in my area, work for you in your tradition or area?
I do not understand what you hope to get out of this.

To add to Cu's point, there are cultural purity standards that exist in some traditions that would effect answers.