Dutch Facebook Page Aims To Save ‘Black Pete

[MiameMiame]

Quote:

A Dutch Facebook page seeking to preserve the country’s fall “Sinterklaas” festival exactly as it is — including clowns in blackface makeup known as “Black Petes” — has received nearly a million ‘likes’ just 24 hours after it was created.
The swift growth of the ‘Pete-ition” page reflects the depth of emotional attachment most Dutch people feel to the tradition, and their annoyance at outsiders who judge it without understanding it.
On Tuesday a U.N. expert condemned the tradition as racist.

In the festival, St. Nicholas arrives in mid-November accompanied by a horde of helpers — the Black Petes, who also have red lips and curly hair. Opponents say they are an offensive caricature of black people; supporters say Pete is a figure of fun whose appearance is harmless.

This article was copied from the Huffington Post and pasted onto a Dutch website.


Since no one is making a thread about it, I figured I'd do it myself 4laugh ! Discuss away 4laugh !!!

[Eveille]

Blackface is offensive. It is a simpleminded charicature of an entire race of people, and to top it off blackface is also usually associated with certain simple personality traits as well. So it isn't just an appearance thing, but tying personality to appearance, which is pretty much the definition of racism.

However, how many black people are even in that country? Is there even anyone who might get offended at seeing a bunch of black 'helpers' (slaves/servants) following their white Santa around?

[MiameMiame]

Eveille

Blackface is offensive. It is a simpleminded charicature of an entire race of people, and to top it off blackface is also usually associated with certain simple personality traits as well. So it isn't just an appearance thing, but tying personality to appearance, which is pretty much the definition of racism.

However, how many black people are even in that country? Is there even anyone who might get offended at seeing a bunch of black 'helpers' (slaves/servants) following their white Santa around?

'Zwarte Piet' is very loved by the whole Dutch (and Belgium) nation. I don't really know if there is anyone associating Zwarte Piet with certain caracter traits, but I doubt those caracter traits would be negative. Technically seen it is Racism but, it's not portraying black people as bad (They're not doing anything bad, they're handing out presents and candy)

Yes, there are people offended that Zwarte Piet is zwart (black). Though those people are usually black, native Dutch people (whites in other words) are happy with the tradition and wouldn't change a thing about it (for the most part, there's always people nagging).

[Alexander J Luthor]

Mixed feeliiiiiiiiings! On the one hand, that's incredibly racist. On the other hand, it's volunteers handing out a shitload of gifts.

Also, we're fast approaching the American holiday where people dress up as my race then get ******** wasted. YOU'RE NOT POCAHONTAS, YOU SKANK, GET SOME PANTS ON.

[Yuki_Windira]

o.o; All I see is a spirit fellow who likes making people smile and laugh and also likes giving them candy to help create even more smiles.

[Tomoe the Fox]

Try watching black and white movies that have black face and then tell me it's not meant to be offensive. People "in character" while in black face act like simpletons. Try watching Birth of a Nation (where the KKK are heroes and "black congressmen" act like monkeys). It's horrible.

[x-Garethp-x]

Lathyru

Try watching black and white movies that have black face and then tell me it's not meant to be offensive. People "in character" while in black face act like simpletons. Try watching Birth of a Nation (where the KKK are heroes and "black congressmen" act like monkeys). It's horrible.

There's a large difference in culture between American blackface and Dutch Black Pete. Just because they look the same doesn't mean they are

[Canoot]

s**t's racist and outdated. Just because it's a tradition doesn't make it any less offensive.
How about finding someone who's actually black to play Pete.

[Tomoe the Fox]

x-Garethp-x

Lathyru

Try watching black and white movies that have black face and then tell me it's not meant to be offensive. People "in character" while in black face act like simpletons. Try watching Birth of a Nation (where the KKK are heroes and "black congressmen" act like monkeys). It's horrible.

There's a large difference in culture between American blackface and Dutch Black Pete. Just because they look the same doesn't mean they are

So it's ok because a bunch of white people say it's not racist? rofl He's a black servant to Santa! Please explain the history of that one because if wikipedia is accurate (ha) the character was originally an evil spirit. ( I am Dutch but don't read or speak it so my research is limited on this one.) Now in modern times he is "mischievous" huh... doesn't sound anything like our black face stereotypes. rolleyes

[Glorious Leader Luna]

Lathyru

x-Garethp-x

Lathyru

Try watching black and white movies that have black face and then tell me it's not meant to be offensive. People "in character" while in black face act like simpletons. Try watching Birth of a Nation (where the KKK are heroes and "black congressmen" act like monkeys). It's horrible.

There's a large difference in culture between American blackface and Dutch Black Pete. Just because they look the same doesn't mean they are

So it's ok because a bunch of white people say it's not racist? rofl He's a black servant to Santa! Please explain the history of that one because if wikipedia is accurate (ha) the character was originally an evil spirit. ( I am Dutch but don't read or speak it so my research is limited on this one.) Now in modern times he is "mischievous" huh... doesn't sound anything like our black face stereotypes. rolleyes

It's as Racist as Santa elves is heightist.

[texasshojo]

my son wanted to dress as st nick or pete for Halloween. I said no way to pete.

[Tomoe the Fox]

Glorious Leader Luna

Lathyru

x-Garethp-x

Lathyru

Try watching black and white movies that have black face and then tell me it's not meant to be offensive. People "in character" while in black face act like simpletons. Try watching Birth of a Nation (where the KKK are heroes and "black congressmen" act like monkeys). It's horrible.

There's a large difference in culture between American blackface and Dutch Black Pete. Just because they look the same doesn't mean they are

So it's ok because a bunch of white people say it's not racist? rofl He's a black servant to Santa! Please explain the history of that one because if wikipedia is accurate (ha) the character was originally an evil spirit. ( I am Dutch but don't read or speak it so my research is limited on this one.) Now in modern times he is "mischievous" huh... doesn't sound anything like our black face stereotypes. rolleyes

It's as Racist as Santa elves is heightist.

Are you seriously comparing a race of people who were ENSLAVED and exploited for generations (not to mention being regarded as "sub-human" by social darwinists and/ degraded to servant roles for much of the last century by whites) to a FICTIONAL race of fairy creatures? burning_eyes I don't know whether to laugh or cry at the sheer amount of ignorance of this post.

[Kai-Shan Valandria]

They are a different country with a different history than us, and people need to take their butthurt hypertolerance somewhere else. It's like Dunkin Donuts campaign out of Taiwan, where one of the exectutive's daughters covered herself in some dark makeup and people auto-decided it was blackface and HOMG SUPER RACISS OFFUNSIVE!!!11!!!

[MiameMiame]

Lathyru

x-Garethp-x

Lathyru

Try watching black and white movies that have black face and then tell me it's not meant to be offensive. People "in character" while in black face act like simpletons. Try watching Birth of a Nation (where the KKK are heroes and "black congressmen" act like monkeys). It's horrible.

There's a large difference in culture between American blackface and Dutch Black Pete. Just because they look the same doesn't mean they are

So it's ok because a bunch of white people say it's not racist? rofl He's a black servant to Santa! Please explain the history of that one because if wikipedia is accurate (ha) the character was originally an evil spirit. ( I am Dutch but don't read or speak it so my research is limited on this one.) Now in modern times he is "mischievous" huh... doesn't sound anything like our black face stereotypes. rolleyes

There are actually a lot of black people who like black pete and dont want the holiday to dissapear. This whole discussion stems from 24 people (who hapen to be black) making a big deal about one complaint sent in by an (also black) woman.

Besides that Sinterklaas is a statement AGAINST slavery. Sint Nicolaas lived around the 17th century in Spain, he originally came from Turkey. In Spain he bought child slaves and freed them. In return (as a thank-you) these children chose to work for Nicolaas and he paid them. These children had the chance to leave but they stayed with Sint Nicolaas untill his death. That also explains why he is seen as someone who loved children very much.

If you are Dutch you surely know about this story, its part of our culture. We have been celebrating this for over 200 years now. Claiming to be Dutch is nice but not knowing anything about the culture is a bit.... stupid, I guess. I'd definetly recommend to come over and ecperience the party yourself. Its pretty awesome smile
As a child, I always looked forward to Sinterklaas and Zwarte Piet. Believe it or not, I never thought of Zwarte Piet as a black person. Adults are the only ones who have second thoughts, kids dont.

Sorry if I made typos, I typed this on my cellphone xp

[Yonakii]

As long as he isn't portrayed in a negative way (e.g. played by a white person with a painted face, or is dressed up as a slave) then it's not a big deal. If you're gonna be that PC, you might as well say that we should take away Santa's Little Helpers because they discriminate against midgets and make them look like slaves.