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 Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 1:57 pm
I've picked up two main reasons given for abortion over in the abortion threads.
1. The fetus is not a person.
2. The woman's bodily integrity trumps the fetus' right to life.
Strange, that when I looked up reasons given for abortion neither of those reasons showed up at all...
From a website:
Why Do Women Have Abortions?
- a statistical breakdown*
Responses listed as primary reason %
Social Reasons (given as primary reason)
- Feels unready for child/responsibility 25%
- Feels she can't afford baby 23%
- Has all the children she wants/Other family responsibilities 19%
- Relationship problem/Single motherhood 8%
- Feels she isn't mature enough 7%
- Interference with education/career plans 4%
- Parents/Partner wants abortion <1%
- Other reasons <6.5%
TOTAL: 93%
(Approx.)
"Hard Cases" (given as primary reason)
- Mother's Health 4%
- Baby may have health problem 3%
- Rape or Incest <0.5%
TOTAL:
7%
(Approx.)
Poll Fact: An April 2004 Zogby poll found that 56% of Americans support legal abortion in only three or fewer circumstances: when the pregnancy results from rape or incest or when it threatens the life of the mother.
*Source: Lawrence Finer, et. al, "Reasons U.S. Women Have Abortions: Quantitative and Qualitative Perspectives" Perspectives on Sexual and Reproductive Health, Vol. 37 No. 3 (Sept., 2005) p. 110.
Between that discrepancy and the avowal I've seen more than once in those threads that "nothing is leaving my uterus alive!", I'm left to wonder if the more active pro-choice people over there are projecting...What do the rest of you think?
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Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 2:09 pm
Those are actually reasons for the continued legalization, a justification of the reasons below.
Notice, of course, the 5% which many would consider neccesary. 10,000 women or so will die from a pregnancy so they abort- But how does that justify the extra million with no more than poor planning to blame?
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Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 3:07 pm
divineseraph Those are actually reasons for the continued legalization, a justification of the reasons below. Notice, of course, the 5% which many would consider neccesary. 10,000 women or so will die from a pregnancy so they abort- But how does that justify the extra million with no more than poor planning to blame? Put that way, as justifications, that makes more sense. But I must say they are poor justifications. If a matter of a mere nine months will lead to "personhood" as the life progresses naturally from one stage to the next, how can you possibly justify interrupting that process? And I'm sorry, but "MY BODY! MINE MINE MINE!" is just selfish and shallow in my eyes. We're not talking rape or physical assault here, no matter how much the other side may compare the two, but the creation of a new life. That should be a beautiful thing, not a matter of horror and disgust. (I am not talking about conception through rape here, which can leave mental scars. I'm talking about the loving union of two people.)
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Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:11 pm
Winged Isis divineseraph Those are actually reasons for the continued legalization, a justification of the reasons below. Notice, of course, the 5% which many would consider neccesary. 10,000 women or so will die from a pregnancy so they abort- But how does that justify the extra million with no more than poor planning to blame? Put that way, as justifications, that makes more sense. But I must say they are poor justifications. If a matter of a mere nine months will lead to "personhood" as the life progresses naturally from one stage to the next, how can you possibly justify interrupting that process? And I'm sorry, but "MY BODY! MINE MINE MINE!" is just selfish and shallow in my eyes. We're not talking rape or physical assault here, no matter how much the other side may compare the two, but the creation of a new life. That should be a beautiful thing, not a matter of horror and disgust. (I am not talking about conception through rape here, which can leave mental scars. I'm talking about the loving union of two people.) I agree with you. Most of the pro-choicers I have come to meet have this selfish attitude. Most believe that it is their body and they can do whatever they wish with the fetus as it is not a sentient being until it is born. I believe that this is just an excuse for them because they cannot handle responsibility. It gives them an easy way out and blames something else for their problems. This is where I have the problem with pro-choice. Sure, it is your body but the fetus is also part of your body. It has your DNA as well as the DNA of your partner. Therefore, it is a part of you, not just some mass of nothingness.
A lot of reasons they give seem like they are not that well thought out, but they still fool millions into believeing them. To me, this is a growing problem with more and more of the younger crowd unwilling to take responsibility for their unborn child and unwilling to work hard enough to do the things they must in turn they abort their child.
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Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:12 pm
The craziest fringes of any movement always scream the loudest. Like me. I can project like a goddamn opera diva impaled on a 15-horsepower vibrator.
Er--what I meant was that most pro-choice people aren't going to be arguing on the internet, because they don't feel that strongly about it. And they're pro-choice for sane reasons, not because they hate children or whatever.
And the near-50% in the poll (I did a paper on similar statistics, once upon a time) have probably been brainwashed into thinking killing a fetus is their best option. After all, it's legal, so it can't be that bad, AMIRITE? They either genuinely believe it's not human, or whatever, or lie to themselves to make it easier.
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Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:13 pm
The fetus is in no way part of the mother other then emotional attachments and having half the DNA. The umbilical cord, placenta, and amniotic sac all belong to the fetus.
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Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:15 pm
La Veuve Zin The craziest fringes of any movement always scream the loudest. Like me. I can project like a goddamn opera diva impaled on a 15-horsepower vibrator. Where can i get one of those?
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Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:21 pm
Tiger of the Fire La Veuve Zin The craziest fringes of any movement always scream the loudest. Like me. I can project like a goddamn opera diva impaled on a 15-horsepower vibrator. Where can i get one of those? If I knew, I wouldn't be able to type.
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Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:25 pm
La Veuve Zin Tiger of the Fire La Veuve Zin The craziest fringes of any movement always scream the loudest. Like me. I can project like a goddamn opera diva impaled on a 15-horsepower vibrator. Where can i get one of those? If I knew, I wouldn't be able to type. Okay...NOW I have the hots for you ninja
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Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2007 2:30 am
La Veuve Zin The craziest fringes of any movement always scream the loudest. Like me. I can project like a goddamn opera diva impaled on a 15-horsepower vibrator. Er--what I meant was that most pro-choice people aren't going to be arguing on the internet, because they don't feel that strongly about it. And they're pro-choice for sane reasons, not because they hate children or whatever. And the near-50% in the poll (I did a paper on similar statistics, once upon a time) have probably been brainwashed into thinking killing a fetus is their best option. After all, it's legal, so it can't be that bad, AMIRITE? They either genuinely believe it's not human, or whatever, or lie to themselves to make it easier. You know, I can actually sympathize with one or two of the sane reasons. Take finances, for instance. I know full well that raising children isn't cheap, I've raised two. But the fact remains that there IS help out there. http://www.cdhs.state.co.us/Most people also have families to fall back on for help. It might mean *gasp* living within a budget and doing without, but it can be done. My mother was an expert at stretching a dollar until it screamed for mercy. She was the COUPON QUEEN! smile
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Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2007 9:33 am
Winged Isis You know, I can actually sympathize with one or two of the sane reasons. Take finances, for instance. I know full well that raising children isn't cheap, I've raised two. But the fact remains that there IS help out there. http://www.cdhs.state.co.us/Most people also have families to fall back on for help. It might mean *gasp* living within a budget and doing without, but it can be done. My mother was an expert at stretching a dollar until it screamed for mercy. She was the COUPON QUEEN! smile A coworker of mine, who probably makes about $13/hr, and is in college, recently got pregnant. Her boyfriend is in med school. Apparently she was trying to get pregnant, is happy that she did, and plans to keep the baby. Go figure... eek She's in her 30s, but still...
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Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2007 9:50 am
La Veuve Zin Winged Isis You know, I can actually sympathize with one or two of the sane reasons. Take finances, for instance. I know full well that raising children isn't cheap, I've raised two. But the fact remains that there IS help out there. http://www.cdhs.state.co.us/Most people also have families to fall back on for help. It might mean *gasp* living within a budget and doing without, but it can be done. My mother was an expert at stretching a dollar until it screamed for mercy. She was the COUPON QUEEN! smile A coworker of mine, who probably makes about $13/hr, and is in college, recently got pregnant. Her boyfriend is in med school. Apparently she was trying to get pregnant, is happy that she did, and plans to keep the baby. Go figure... eek She's in her 30s, but still... And I bet it never once crossed her mind, "OMG! This FETUS is sucking the nutrients out of me! It's violating me! KILL KILL KILL!" Some pro-choicer REALLY needs to have a talk with her...
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Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2007 9:44 pm
I feel there is no reason at all for abortion. If I was pregnant I believe it is ment to be. Whether that child is for me or for another. Whether I am to die so it can live or what not. I believe it happens for a reason and its not our decision to stop it. If all children were killed because of incest, rape, mothers health, baby might have problems... wouldnt there be a lot less people in the world? In the begning of man kind didnt they have sex... with one another being family more than likely... not have medicine to help the baby... etc... So there is no justifying it now. At least so I think.
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Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2007 3:59 am
Winged Isis La Veuve Zin Winged Isis You know, I can actually sympathize with one or two of the sane reasons. Take finances, for instance. I know full well that raising children isn't cheap, I've raised two. But the fact remains that there IS help out there. http://www.cdhs.state.co.us/Most people also have families to fall back on for help. It might mean *gasp* living within a budget and doing without, but it can be done. My mother was an expert at stretching a dollar until it screamed for mercy. She was the COUPON QUEEN! smile A coworker of mine, who probably makes about $13/hr, and is in college, recently got pregnant. Her boyfriend is in med school. Apparently she was trying to get pregnant, is happy that she did, and plans to keep the baby. Go figure... eek She's in her 30s, but still... And I bet it never once crossed her mind, "OMG! This FETUS is sucking the nutrients out of me! It's violating me! KILL KILL KILL!" Some pro-choicer REALLY needs to have a talk with her... That poor, misinformed woman.
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Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2007 11:46 am
divineseraph Winged Isis La Veuve Zin A coworker of mine, who probably makes about $13/hr, and is in college, recently got pregnant. Her boyfriend is in med school. Apparently she was trying to get pregnant, is happy that she did, and plans to keep the baby. Go figure... eek She's in her 30s, but still... And I bet it never once crossed her mind, "OMG! This FETUS is sucking the nutrients out of me! It's violating me! KILL KILL KILL!" Some pro-choicer REALLY needs to have a talk with her... That poor, misinformed woman. Oh, but she wanted it, so it magically transformed from a domain-violating parasite into a precious baby. See, the human life cycle starts off like this: Egg --> parasite. When the mother finds out she's pregnant, if she's happy about the pregnancy, the parasite senses this and transforms into a cute widdle baby human being. If she doesn't want it, it remains a nutrient-sucking parasite that exists only to violate the woman's bodily integrity. It continues to resemble a hideous tadpole-like fetus until the second it leaves the woman's body, when it becomes an ugly neonate. It's wrong to kill it after it's born, though, because the law says so. Laws are always right.
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