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Posted: Sun Dec 24, 2006 10:37 am
A CHRISTIAN SPEAKS ON THE FAITH AND PATH OF WICCA
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by James Clement Taylor I am a Christian and not a Wiccan. A Christian is one who has been baptized in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and who has made a personal, free-will decision to commit himself and all his or her life to our Lord and God and Savior, Jesus Christ. Both of these things are true of me. I am a Greek Orthodox Christian, a member of St. Mary's Eastern Orthodox Church, Calhan, Colorado. In this paper, I am not speaking as agent for any church, but I am, entirely on my own responsibility, speaking the truth in love, as we Christians are supposed to do.
A Situation of Strife and Shame:
There are many Christians today who believe that anyone who is not a Christian is doomed to an eternity of suffering in hell. Any decent person, believing this, would be compelled to try to save as many people from this fate as possible. But is this belief correct? Jesus Christ, having noted the faith and righteousness of a Roman centurion, a Pagan, proclaimed:
"Assuredly I say to you, I have not found such great faith, not even in Israel! And I say to you that many will come from east and west, and sit down with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven. But the sons of the kingdom will be cast out into outer darkness. There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth." (Matthew 8:10-12) If we accept these words as true, and surely we should, then it is clear that heaven will contain many who are not Christians, and hell will contain many who are! Clearly, throughout the Gospels, Jesus Christ sets forth the criteria for entrance into the kingdom of heaven, and those criteria include love, kindness, forgiveness, and a refusal to judge others: "For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses." (Matthew 6:14-15) "For with what judgment you judge, you will be judged; and with the same measure you use, it will be measured back to you." (Matthew 7:2)
"But go and learn what this means: `I desire mercy and not sacrifice.'" (Matthew 9:13)
"Therefore be merciful, just as your Father also is merciful. Judge not, and you shall not be judged. Condemn not, and you shall not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be for- given." (Luke 6:36-3 cool
Is it not clear? Anyone who fails in these things, will calling himself a Christian save him? Anyone who obeys God in these things, will being unbaptized condemn him? Jesus said, "Not everyone who says to Me, `Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven." (Matthew 7:21) In addition to these words from the Gospel, let us look at the words of Micah the Prophet, centuries earlier, who wrote:
He has shown you, O man, what is good; And what does the Lord require of you But to do justly, To love mercy, And to walk humbly with your God? (Micah 6:6- cool
Where, in any of this, does it say what doctrines one is to believe, or whose teachings concerning reality one must accept? All these things speak on how one ACTS, how one lives one's life, the kind of person one's actions gradually bring into being. Yet it is not by good works that we earn our way into heaven, because there is no way we can earn the free gift of God's mercy and grace, which alone can save us. But it is clear that it is not by faith, in the sense of sharing the Christian faith, that we are saved, either. The faith which saves us is not faith in the goodness of our works, nor faith that we have the right theology and / or belong to the right church. Rather, it is faith in God, and in His mercy:
"So then it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who has mercy." (Romans 9:16) But the Wiccans, you will say, do not have faith in God. Yet by their own theology, they certainly do. Those who call them "Satan worshippers" are entirely wrong. They do not worship Satan, or even believe that Satan exists. Instead, they worship a Goddess and a God whom they understand as manifestations of a higher and unknown Deity. Now if you are a Christian, this will sound familiar to you, and it should. In the Bible we find the following:
"Then Paul stood in the midst of the Areopagus and said, 'Men of Athens, I perceive that in all things you are very religious; for as I was passing through and considering the objects of your worship, I even found an altar with this inscription: TO THE UNKNOWN GOD. Therefore, the One whom you worship without knowing, Him I proclaim to you" (Acts 17:22-23) The Wiccans worship the Unknown God, as manifested to them in the form of a Goddess and a God. Therefore, our Bible tells us they worship the same God we do; and if they do not know this, we should know it! For those of us who are unable to simply stand on God's Word, and must prove to themselves the truth of what it proclaims the holy Apostle John has given us the method for doing this. You have only to attend any public Wiccan ceremony, and test the spirits which are there, to see "whether they are of God" (1 John 4:1).
You will find that, while you may perceive the power manifested there as less than what you have experienced as a Christian, that power is clearly the power of God.
Dear brothers and sisters in Christ, these people of Wicca have been terribly slandered by us. They have lost jobs, and homes, and places of business because we have assured others that they worship Satan, which they do not. We have persecuted them, and God will hold us accountable for this, you may be sure, for He has said, "Assuredly I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me." (Matthew 25:40)
Let us, from this point onward, repent of our misdeeds and declare that henceforth we shall obey Christ our God, and not judge others or condemn them, so that He will not have to judge and condemn us for our sins.
* Z * F O S * E
Light & Life, James Clement Taylor I a, actually suprised. rofl
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Posted: Sun Dec 24, 2006 4:37 pm
[Mod note: In future Baluk, please try not to copy paste full articles if they're this long. I know it's not a written rule, but perhaps in future you should consider copy pasting key points and quotes, and giving a link to the full article, for those who want to read it in it's entirety. It's just a little hard on the eyes. You're not in trouble or anything, this is just a suggestion. sweatdrop ]
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 12:56 am
I did not want to read the whole thing... what is your personal thought?
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Posted: Tue Jan 02, 2007 8:12 am
I've read the entire thing and the main message I got out of it was; even if you do not believe in the Christian god, there is still a chance you can go to heaven because you were kind and never hurt or judged someone harshly.
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Posted: Tue Jan 02, 2007 10:57 am
Yes, that is supposed to be the Christian view. Many, however, do not uphold this belief. The Church has not done a good job of teaching its religion properly, so many Christians who claim they are Christian are really just ignorant sweatdrop This is my 9th year in Catholic school, I go to Mass every Sunday (even if I think it's boring as heck), and my mom's a CCD teacher. Plus, both sides of my family are very religious, so I'd say I'm quite well-informed xp
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Posted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 5:55 pm
i think we cant comdemn people for believeing what they want to believe or what they believe in....personally worshiping God comes in many shapes and forms.....whether its christianity wicca hinduism islam or judiasim (hopefully its spelled right.) i dont condemn people for what they believe even if they think they are right. i have my beliefs they have theirs heart
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Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 7:57 pm
*sigh* I'm glad you're trying to premote unity/convince us that not all christians or at least the christian ideals have no harming intent against other relgions, or at least Wicca.
I will however challenge your point by saying people have been practacing magic (traditional witchcraft/wicca) long before any notion of a God or Christ had been... bestowed(?) upon the public. Then the bible came along. You could argue that even if the bible was written later, God still created the world. Fair enough. But if Wiccans were worshiping before Christians, and hence, closer to when the world was created, then perhaps they actually got it right?
Just a thought ^_^ Blessed Be ~Wolfsbane
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Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 8:59 pm
Heh. How about a wiccan view on christianity? I like some of the values and things christianity and catholicism teach... But the religion itself... meh. I used to go to a christian youth group, because of the people, nothing else. After a while I quit, it was a bit too intense for an aethiest beginning to explore wicca rather than anything else. There were three things there that pissed me off to no end. #1 - People talking about how other religions are all crap, and followers of those religions are going to hell. #2 - when they said to bring friends, christian or not, and if they weren't christian, they'd try as a group to gently sway them and then convert them. #3 - Christians say Pagans worship the devil - Paganism is the ONE religion they will NOT accept. And I hate it that people come to your door to preach to you. I really hate that. Christians can accept buddists, jews, everything except for wiccans and pagans, despite the fact that most pagans and wiccans accept christians. Ireally don't get that.
rolleyes
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:20 pm
Yes, I agree that it is a bit sad that most Christians and related can't accept Wiccans for who they are and not what they believe. I know some rather accepting Christians though, seeing as I go to a Christian church every Wednesday but, as The Spam Fairy, only for the people.
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 5:25 pm
Thank you very much. I wish there were more people like you were I live. Living in a conservative community such as here in the South and being a Wiccan. Sometimes it's pretty dangerous. People burn Harry Potter books around her, so you can just imagine the hostility Wiccans are regarded with here.
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Posted: Sun Jan 21, 2007 5:14 pm
I go to a Christian youth group every wednesday, but only for the people like Twilit Nocturne and The Spam Fairy. I go because my friend Allison (a devout Christian) goes and likes me to go with her... and my friend Kassandra and I are both Wiccan, but we respect Allison's belief and out of friendship we go.
But what is really f*cked up is that we told Allison our beliefs recently, and asked if she would mind if we performed a healing ritual for her cold, and she freaked.
I haven't talked to her since, and she's very, very angry with me for teaching Kassandra the Wiccan ways. (Yes, I teach Wiccan, but only to a select few. >o>)
For she believes that she would have been able to convert Kassandra from her former Atheism to Christian, given time. But in reality, Kassandra was interested in Wicca long before she began to go to Vision Youth (said Christian Youth Group) with Allison.
Damn the devout Christians (no offense...) and their evil hatred and violent ways.
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Posted: Mon Jan 22, 2007 1:25 pm
I think it is a sign of the times, of more peaceful times. I hope that someday all Christians will be of an opinion like this - or one that comes to the same conclusion - the conclusion that people may believe as they will provided that belief is not harming anyone.
Someday I believe this will happen. When it does there will be much peace. Actually the majority of Christians are very much like this - the reason that people believe them to be bible thumping lunatics in because those are the outspoken minority within the group. We must always remember that there are people like this because it teaches us that the few members of the group do not represent the whole group.
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 11:22 am
im Chatholic myself. and i attend the masses when im forced to (skhool xp ) and i belive in God. but somtimes i dont. (against the 10 comandments) but, what i've realized is, is that, the chatholic church is VERY secretive, and dont like to share DEEP info about a lot. i asked lots of questiosn to my preists and pls, but i NEVER NOT ONCE got a complete streight anser. so, when they practically accept all other religons and not pagan and wiccan, it just meens; their scared. when they dont understand or have a back way of things, then they hate it. when they can't understand or when they choose not to because of rumores " wiccans r devil worshipers" they dont even have a second glance at the wiccan and pagan religon. for me, ther r things that i belive, but when im in dought i look at the things that fill up those emtey spaces, and give me reassurance. that tell me the ansers that i was looking for.
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 3:40 pm
It's not only that they're afraid, but they've been brought up that way, told those things, and it's basically been part of their entire lives. What they do they really do because they feel like they're saving people, that they're doing a good deed. It says in the bible that to be a good Christian, one must "be their brother's keeper" (someone wasn't and he was cursed for all eternity to never have any friends. So sad sad ) So the truly devoted christians who beleive fully in their religion, and really do beleive, as it says in some sects (not all, mind you) that all who do not worship their God will go to hell, the feel it is their duty to protect and save the rest of us. How can they be blamed for that? It's difficult, but I beleive the best way to go about things is let them do what they feel is right, while educating them as to what we really stand for, so these prejudices will not be heald at our throats for the rest of our lives. That way, everyone wins 3nodding (well, as far as I can see, anyway. Often times i'm as blind as a bat, so don't take this as your answer, simply a suggestion 3nodding )
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