|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
 Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 12:47 pm
I know this is a topic of debate among many Christians, but someone in my youth group recently came across a video online by a preacher by the name of Craig Lewis. It's a tape of him preaching, and I have to say that it is something that really got to me.
The video is called 'The Truth about Hip Hop', the link is http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=-2512318500146146032&q=The+truth+about+hip+hop For those who do not wish to watch it (there's two parts, and they're like an hour and 45 mins, but definately worth it) I'll throw out a few of the main points.
At first I was a little skeptical of it all, because I was like 'great...here goes another preacher rambling on about how horrible secular music is and how we're all going to hell if we listen to it..' but it's not like that at all. Actually, I was really convicted by the video, even though I don't listen to hip hop music.
Really you have to watch it, but I will do my best to sum the basic points up. He went through various artists and pointed out the songs and some of the lyrics. What really struck me how artists can literally proclaim themselved God in the middle of the song and it goes right by us. There is something about hip hop that is almost seductive. Even if you don't really like it you can't help but move to the beats. There is actually a lot of satanic tones to some of the songs, and its suprising how we don't even pick it up. There was a study on the brain that was done, and it was proven that, if put to music, our brains can pick up and record things we hear, even if we are not conscious of what we are hearing. So basically, even if we can't understand the words sometimes, we still get the meaning, subconsciously.
He used all of this to bring up a really interesting point. When he was created, Lucifer was in charge of worshipping God. He was the one who ushered in the worship. How did he do this? Through music. Lucifer was created to make music. Isn't it interesting how music is a dominant force in our society? First it was the rock and roll generation, where satanic rituals were literally performed in concerts. It doesn't happen now, but the effect is still same. Secular music still glorifies satan. "But it's talking about peace and love!" but not God. Anything that does not glorofy God, glorifies Satan. Just think about it. It's too obvious to be calling Satan a god and worshipping him and making sacrifices. No, Satan's smarter than that. He'll use subtlety (sorry, can't spell that XP). Even in the end times (this is not on the video; one of the board members brought up this point when we were discussing the film) do you think the numer 666 will come up anywhere? Yes and no. People will not be walking around with those exact numbers on their heads and hands. Why not? Because it would be too obvious! People would figure out pretty quick that the Bible was right, and even though some people won't be convinced, it will still be a blow to Satan's 'kingdom'. So what about a computer code based on those three numbers? A little less obvious, but still follows what the Bible has to say.
So back on track...there was another thing that got to me. He was preaching this message one time and there happened to be a rap artist in the back (forgive me...I forget his name, he was a part of some group that was pretty big a while back) and he was convicted by the message and got saved. I mean, this guy was part of a group that had made millions, and he just up and quit. A few years later the guy's wife called and asked Craig Lewis to come over. He was manifesting demons. Craig Lewis started casting them out and what not, but when he got to the last one (demon number 42, I think) there was nothing that he could say that was doing it. Here is the conversation as follows:
"Demon, I command you in the name of Jesus to come out!"
"Uh-uh".
"I command you!"
Demon shakes his head, contorts the man's face into a smile that literally goes from ear to ear "Nope. What are you gonna do?"
"I'll call a legion of angels."
"They're busy. So what are you gonna do?"
Craig Lewis sits back and asks the Holy Spirit for wisdom. Finally, the answer comes.
Craig asked the man's wife to play a worship song. She cranked it, and the demon began to get nervous. He saw that he was getting weak, so he was then able to cast him out. So why was this demon so susceptable to music? The demon had to be played out because he had been played in. Now, there was more to this convo...I just broke it down for simplicity's sake. But it's an interesting concept.
Obviously there was a lot more, if there is over two hours of material on it...but these were the things that really hit me. It made me think. It can be applied to any music we listened to. He even talked about horror movies. As an aside, he mentioned that in every horror movie in history (he also challenges the listeners to look everything up) someone related to the production (team, actors, music, etc) or someone close to a member of the production team, has died. Jesus demands living sacrifices, and Satan does the opposite. (He goes into this a little more too).
But maybe music has a bigger effect on our lives than we think. After hearing it, many of the people in my youth group threw out ALL of their hip hop CDs. We're talking like up to twenty a person.
But just think about this, and consider it.
|
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 2:06 pm
well, first off, i dont think there is anyything wrong with any type of music, it is just the words. there are, after all, christian artists for every type of music.
And as for the deamon, my youth group sings this song, and part of the song says "not even all the deamons in hell can stop these words" or something to that point.... so, the words of the songs are powerfull...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 2:55 pm
I didn't necessarily mean that types of music are bad. I really meant that it is the lyrics, but that the words against the music are more potent than the words by themselves. Basically, the excuse "I just like the beat" can't cut it. That's what I meant, as I do know that there are Christian hip hop artists.
But he does go into a detailed point about Christian artists and hip hop music, and how secular artists have 'gospel' songs. In my opinion, that's a little sketchy...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 6:25 pm
Same bullcrap. different decade. No, really. I'm not supporting the morality of secular music, per se, but this is really nothing short of fear-mongering. I've gotten about 5 minutes into this video and I am listening to it as we speak. The man starts out with with the standard bashing of heavy-metal. I mean, really, haven't we gotten over that? The guy clearly doesn't know much about the subject beyond rumours of satanic murder and other such things. Besides, his theology is, to say the least, rather lacking. Firstly, 666 is not the mark of the devil (regardless of the fact that '616' is a closer translation), but the mark of the herald of the Devil (also known as the Beast out of the Earth), which will come after the Beast out of the Earth's reign of about three and a half years. This mark of the Beast, will be put on people's hands to show those who are legally allowed to do business transactions. Prior to this reign, however, the number 666 has absolutely no satanic meaning aside from that we attribute to it. Secondly, where the deuss does he get the 'When he was created, Lucifer was in charge of worshipping God. He was the one who ushered in the worship. How did he do this? Through music. Lucifer was created to make music.' part? Just where does this show up in the bible? It's nothing short of heresy the way that this 'preacher' claims to have God speak directly to him to tell him about what The Satan's purpose is. He quotes a rather generic verse that, when I read it, says nothing of the sort. Oooh, this is the fun part. I just got the hte part where he says, and I quote, 'back in ancient Salem, witches, when they wanted to put a curse on somebody, they would write it backwards and mail it to the person...' Now, I'm not sure if this man is aware of this, but there was a grand total of one 'witch' in Salem, if that. It was simply a slave that was practicing her tribal religion. Like I've said, I'm not promoting the values of this secular music in question, however I am also not willing to stand by and watch paranoid christians go around and spread such stupidity. Really, people, just use some common sense when you choose your music, and you'll be fine.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 6:44 pm
That is a good point Hikari, and I really think that makes sense, but in order for me to believe that I think I need some Bible proof.
Not Bible proof of the entire thing, because I completely agree with the lyrics and even the beat of hip-hop, but I just want to know where the pastor learned that Satan was the lead worshipper and made music to God in heaven. It seems really interesting, but I've never recalled a statement like this before.
Other than that, I find that the pastor has a very good point biggrin And I have heard people say "I just like the beat" plenty of times!!!
Cometh the Inquisitor, you do not need to call us "paranoid" for finding an opinion based upon our religion. We have done nothing to you, so why must you accuse? You have chosen to read this post. you also don't need to call it "bullcrap" just because you don't agree with it....
But, its fine whatever, although you don't agree with it, I do. I'll tell you why from a Christian's point of view:
I am a Christian, and as a Christian sometimes I am led off in sinful directions. Now, I think I will be okay when facing sin in the face (for example, listening to music that does not promote God, obsession with actors or movies, being caught up with looks or who I want to be friends with, etc. Normal everyday things.) But it is only until I suddenly step back and realize that God's voice seems so distant that I realize that it is these "everyday things" that lead me away. It is because I assume that "if I just use common sense" I'll be fine. But it is more than that. Because if we let "everyday things" become a part of who we are, they will begin to pile up until we realize we have a mountain before us. It is like collecting pennies. If you collect them subconsciously and then finally take a look at how much money you have in the jar you will see you have at least 10 dollars in it. But you will also come to learn that everyday, little things can pile up.
Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to preach to ya because I know that you are not a Christian and I want to be fair here. But I guess I am trying to show you how earth works in some of our lives.
Music is one of those "little everyday things" if not chosen very discreetly.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 8:56 pm
stone_angel4 Cometh the Inquisitor, you do not need to call us "paranoid" for finding an opinion based upon our religion. I never called you parenoid, I called the preacher paranoid. Oh, and honey, it's my religion to. Quote: We have done nothing to you, so why must you accuse? You have chosen to read this post. you also don't need to call it "bullcrap" just because you don't agree with it.... Actually, if you'd read my post, you'd notice that I not only read the post, but I spent the time to listen to the sermon that hikari posted up and I directed my post at that sermon. Quote: But, its fine whatever, although you don't agree with it, I do. I'll tell you why from a Christian's point of view: I am a Christian, and as a Christian sometimes I am led off in sinful directions. Now, I think I will be okay when facing sin in the face (for example, listening to music that does not promote God, obsession with actors or movies, being caught up with looks or who I want to be friends with, etc. Normal everyday things.) But it is only until I suddenly step back and realize that God's voice seems so distant that I realize that it is these "everyday things" that lead me away. It is because I assume that "if I just use common sense" I'll be fine. But it is more than that. Because if we let "everyday things" become a part of who we are, they will begin to pile up until we realize we have a mountain before us. It is like collecting pennies. If you collect them subconsciously and then finally take a look at how much money you have in the jar you will see you have at least 10 dollars in it. But you will also come to learn that everyday, little things can pile up. Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to preach to ya because I know that you are not a Christian[/y] and I want to be fair here. But I guess I am trying to show you how earth works in some of our lives. . I would be annoyed, but I know that you simply are misunderstood. Let me clarify right now. I am christian and I have been for the majority of my life. I am not infallible, and I understand the influence of unhealthy things, be they musical or not, be they secular or not. I do live my life constantly fighting against unhealthy influences and their effects on my life and my spirituality, and I can tell you that while a good point has been raised by the 'things add up' part of hte arguement. However, to use this pastor's own example... 'The best part of waking up... Now how many of you know the rest of that song?' Now here's a return question: how many of the people that know that song actually like foldgers? Another example: How much do you know about Islam? Certainly you know a bit about it. You know, Muhhammed is their main prophet, they have a thing known as 'jihad' in their religion, they don't eat pork. Now, according to the arguement that, if you know something, then you must believe it, then you must be a muslim. That you know something, in no way means that you believe it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 9:16 pm
What did this preacher dude look like? The video won't work on my computer, and if it's who I think it is I've heard him before and his theology is whacked.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 9:52 pm
Shadow Singer What did this preacher dude look like? The video won't work on my computer, and if it's who I think it is I've heard him before and his theology is whacked. Something like this
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 10:02 pm
Quote: First it was the rock and roll generation, where satanic rituals were literally performed in concerts. It doesn't happen now, but the effect is still same. Secular music still glorifies satan. "But it's talking about peace and love!" but not God. Anything that does not glorofy God, glorifies Satan. Row, row, row your boat, gently down the stream... It seems we are indoctrinating our children into Satan from the start. rolleyes
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2006 3:37 pm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2006 6:29 pm
Ahem, well....
I wasn't expecting such a negative response, to be honest. I was just throwing an idea out there. I don't mind a friendly debate, but I have to say that I do not really appreciate being attacked...
Lucifer is described in Isaiah (14:4-17). It is the description of the fall. There is another description in Ezekiel 28:12-19. Even though it seems to describe earthly kings, the passage leads into an oracle about Satan (which is actually the Hebrew word for 'adversary'). It describes him as a Cherub. It is the Cherubin that guard the holiness of God and His throne, and also associated with the presence of God and ushering it in. Lucifer was the cheif guardian. Through descriptions, he was probably the most beautiful creature ever created. Revelation indicated that angels are in constant worship, and Isaiah refers to him having harps.
It was not in this video that I first heard of Lucifer being created to make music. I thought it was common knowledge, but apparently not.
How do we know that God isn't speaking to him? The Bible does say to weigh everything we hear against the word of God, and in my honest opinion, there was nothing that raised warning flags. God speaks to different people in different ways, who are we to doubt Him? Clearly there are fakes, and I don't know, maybe he is making it all up. But if it was all lies, how could so much good come out of it? Is it not our purpose to reach and save the lost? People's lives are being changed for the better. I don't think Satan likes to work like that.
I realize that '666' is not 'the devil's number'. But however it will work, I'm not going to pretend to know. The computer thing was just a suggestion thrown out in our disscussion time. I would never call it fact.
I do have a question, however, for the Inquisitor. Where did you get the information that there were no witches in Salem? It's just an honest question. I know that many Christians were killed during that period, and today the city is very heavily wrapped up in witchcraft. I know this to be true because I have family there, and I was there myself not too long ago.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2006 9:28 pm
x_Hikari_x Ahem, well.... I wasn't expecting such a negative response, to be honest. I was just throwing an idea out there. I don't mind a friendly debate, but I have to say that I do not really appreciate being attacked... Neither do I. Fourtunatly for both both of our self-esteems, no such attack occoured in either post. Only a misunderstanding (on your part) and a somewhat agitated reply (on my part). Quote: Lucifer is described in Isaiah (14:4-17). It is the description of the fall. Why say this arguement when it has been so eloquently put already. Tangled Up In Blue Except that Isaiah 14 really is about Babylon, the kingdom. That whole book is a bunch of prophecies about Israel and the nations that oppose it, and Isaiah 14:1-23 is a continuation of the prophecy against Babylon that began in Isaiah 13. It's followed by prophecies against or about Assyria, Moab, Damascus, Cush, and Egypt. It would be very bizarre if out of all of those, the prophecy against Babylon was a metaphor for Satan's 'Babylon' (while the others really were prophecies against nations contemporary to Israel), especially since reading it that way would give it an apocalyptic bent that would be out of step with the rest of Isaiah. I should also point out that Lucifer is a Latin word, and as such appears nowhere in the original text. It is a translation of the Hebrew Helel ben Shaḥar, which means 'the brilliant one'. Additionally, the Jewish Encyclopedia states that, 'It is obvious that the prophet in attributing to the Babylonian king boastful pride, followed by a fall, borrowed the idea from a popular legend connected with the morning star.' [1]Lucifer is a misapplied appellation when used to refer to Satan. Quote: There is another description in Ezekiel 28:12-19. Even though it seems to describe earthly kings, the passage leads into an oracle about Satan (which is actually the Hebrew word for 'adversary'). Yes, and no where in there does it mention anything about music. And yes, 'satan' in hebrew means 'adversary', which would make the proper term for the devil The Satan. Just to clear up confusion that might ensue, as that is how I, personally, refer to him. Quote: It describes him as a Cherub. It is the Cherubin that guard the holiness of God and His throne, and also associated with the presence of God and ushering it in. Lucifer was the cheif guardian. Through descriptions, he was probably the most beautiful creature ever created. Revelation indicated that angels are in constant worship, and Isaiah refers to him having harps. No, Seraphims are the ones that surround the Throne of God and sing continual worship ('Holy, Holy, Holy, Is the Lord God Almisghty', if I remember Revalation correctly) Quote: It was not in this video that I first heard of Lucifer being created to make music. I thought it was common knowledge, but apparently not. Well, when it's simply dogma, it's rather understandable that alot of Christians wouldn't know it. Quote: How do we know that God isn't speaking to him? Same way we know that God isn't speaking to me the holy words of Christ. We don't, but we can make a pretty good guess. Quote: Clearly there are fakes, and I don't know, maybe he is making it all up. Oh, I really doubt that he's making it up. I think he believes every word of it. I just also happen to believe that he's wrong. Quote: But if it was all lies, how could so much good come out of it? WWII was horribly bad, but you can't deny the good that has happened because of it (namely, government recognition of the prejudice against the Jews, a rectification of the wrongs done to the state of Germany, the advancement of Japan from a rather backwards and xenophobic nation into the technological powerhouse it is today to name a few). The ends don't justify the means, even if God can make good come of any situation. Quote: Is it not our purpose to reach and save the lost? Well, apparently not, according to Mr. Lewis, as, I quote him directly (talking on the subject playing christian music to non-christians) 'You don't try to reach out to the world! The world is already lost!'. Apparently, God told him that Jesus was wrong. Quote: People's lives are being changed for the better. I don't think Satan likes to work like that. Who said The Satan was behind this? That's one of the major problems with the majority of Christianity. People always assume that some evil force has to be behind every act of evil, when people themselves are quite capable of messing up by themselves. Quote: I do have a question, however, for the Inquisitor. Where did you get the information that there were no witches in Salem? It's just an honest question. I know that many Christians were killed during that period, and today the city is very heavily wrapped up in witchcraft. I know this to be true because I have family there, and I was there myself not too long ago. Well, any history book would tell you that they the only 'pagan' there was Tituba. wikipedia on tituba Traditionally, the affected girls are said to have been "entertained" by Parris' slave Tituba, during the winter of 1692, although there is no contemporary evidence to support the story. Tituba's race is also often cited as Carib-Indian or that she was of African descent, but contemporary sources describe her only as an "Indian." Research by Elaine Breslaw has suggested that she may well have been captured in what is now Venezuela and brought to Barbados, and so may have been an Arawak Indian, but other slightly later descriptions of her, by Gov. Hutchinson writing his history of the Massachusetts Bay Colony in the 18th century, describe her as a "Spanish Indian." In that day, that typically meant an Indian from the Carolinas/Georgia/Florida. Contrary to the folklore, there is no evidence whatsoever to support the assertion that Tituba told any of the girls any stories about using magic. The one supportable association with any kind of magical practices is that John Indian, another slave in the Parris household and assumed to have been Tituba's husband, was told a recipe for discovering the identity of a witch, a British recipe given to him by a neighbor of the parsonage. . Basically everyone else (all 200 of them) were mast likely accused out of spite, jealousy, or something of the sort. Wikipedia on the Salem Witch TrialsUMKC School of Law on the Salem Witch trialsElectronic Text center ad UVa Library on the Salem witch trials
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 6:15 pm
Alright, I think I can deal with that. It's so hard to know one's intentions and meanings over the internet...
Quote: NIV study Bible Ezekiel 28:12-19. This passage is similar to the one found in Isaiah chapter 14, in that it begins as a prophecy against an earthly ruler but leads into an oracle against Satan, the real power behind the pagan king. The ruler of Babylon is the initial subject in Isaiah, while Ezekiel begins with the ruler of Tyre. Some scholars claim that this passage refers only to an earthly king, but the word "cherub" is used in Scripture only of angelic beings. Moreover, this individual was "in Eden, the garden of God", which distinguishes him from earthly kings
In the KJV and the NKJV, Ezekiel 28:13 hints that Satan was infact involved with music in heaven.
Genesis 3:24 reports the Cherubim as guarding, and in the first chapter in Ezekiel they are associated with the throne of God. It is often mentioned that God dwelled (ie manifested His presence in a special way) and ruled from between them (Ex 25:22, Nu 7:89, 1Sa 4:4 2Sa 6:2, 2Kings 9:15, Ps 80:1, 99:1, Isa 37:16). Isaiah 6:3 and Revelation 4:8 speak of two different types of angels, the first being the Seraphim. It is thought that Cherubim and Seraphim are closely related. Those in Revelation do not have names; they are only described.
Ends may not justify the means, but I personally think it's a little extreme to compare one preacher's beliefs to something so big as a war. He isn't hurting anyone, as far as I can tell. Does not evil denote Satan? I'm not the kind of person that goes around acting all holy and condemning, but I do think that we need to take everything with a grain of salt. And how is it that people are capable of messing up? It was when evil itself was brought into the world. Satan may not be synonymous with evil, but the two go hand in hand. It is because sin was brought into the world that we are able to mess up, and Satan is the one who did the initial sinning. Yes, Adam and Eve screwed up, but it was first Satan who tried to be bigger than God. Satan may not be directly behind everything that is evil, but in the long run, you'll find him somewhere back there.
Yes, I do recall that now. When I was in Salem for a school trip they made us sit through a session on the history of the trials, with all these puppets and things...cool, but there were undertones of witchcraft that did not sit well with me (of course, that is most likely due to the way the culture in that town has shaped itself due to what happened in the past).
But we have to rember that these are secular sources. Of course they are going to deny that anything spiritual had happened, for people always seek to explain things. I do realize that I was not there and that I could not know what really happened, but in my experience, I would not be one to be so quick as to dismiss the girls being possessed as a disease or child's play. But that is my own personal opinion.
I must say that you are very good at arguing, lol, you're making me work. But I suppose that's a good thing ^-^.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Wed Dec 13, 2006 3:33 pm
x_Hikari_x In the KJV and the NKJV, Ezekiel 28:13 hints that Satan was infact involved with music in heaven. Well, from what I've heard, we're all, technically, supposed to be 'involved' in music and worship and stuff in heaven, as that will be our existance (worshiping and praising God). Quote: Genesis 3:24 reports the Cherubim as guarding, and in the first chapter in Ezekiel they are associated with the throne of God. It is often mentioned that God dwelled (ie manifested His presence in a special way) and ruled from between them (Ex 25:22, Nu 7:89, 1Sa 4:4 2Sa 6:2, 2Kings 9:15, Ps 80:1, 99:1, Isa 37:16). Isaiah 6:3 and Revelation 4:8 speak of two different types of angels, the first being the Seraphim. It is thought that Cherubim and Seraphim are closely related. Those in Revelation do not have names; they are only described. But The Satan was still a Cherubim, and it is the Seraphim that sing the praises. Quote: Ends may not justify the means, but I personally think it's a little extreme to compare one preacher's beliefs to something so big as a war. But it is, in principle, the same. Remember, the only sin that is any worse than the others is Blasphemy against the Holy Spirit, so spouting off false doctrines and war are the same in God's eyes. Quote: He isn't hurting anyone, as far as I can tell. Not physically, no. But he is convicing people of a false doctrine, which leads them away from Christ. Quote: Does not evil denote Satan? Not necesarrily. Man is perfectly capable of evil without The Satan's (or his minions') help. Quote: I'm not the kind of person that goes around acting all holy and condemning, but I do think that we need to take everything with a grain of salt. And how is it that people are capable of messing up? It was when evil itself was brought into the world. Satan may not be synonymous with evil, but the two go hand in hand. It is because sin was brought into the world that we are able to mess up, and Satan is the one who did the initial sinning. Yes, Adam and Eve screwed up, but it was first Satan who tried to be bigger than God. Satan may not be directly behind everything that is evil, but in the long run, you'll find him somewhere back there. THat's circular logic. If we couldn't make mistakes before the Fall, then we never would have Fallen in the first place. People were always capable of sinning, it's just that Adam and Eve didn't before that. And The Satan doesn't need to be directly involved in all the evil out there. There simply needs to be a lack of God's light and wisdom and evil naturally spawns. Quote: But we have to rember that these are secular sources. Of course they are going to deny that anything spiritual had happened, for people always seek to explain things. I do realize that I was not there and that I could not know what really happened, but in my experience, I would not be one to be so quick as to dismiss the girls being possessed as a disease or child's play. But that is my own personal opinion. Well, you must admit that the conditions under which the girls were found were highly suspicious (they were out playing at night and they got caught. They then blamed Tituba in order to not get into trouble [as, we must remember, tituba was a slave, so, to them, it was the equivalent of blaming the dog for chewing up your homework]). This, coupled with the prevailing thoughts about witches (the general opinion held was 'for every witch you catch, there is an entire coven out there yet to be caught'), mixed with the methods of finding witches (they tortured you until you confessed. There was basically no way to prove your innocence), as well as the fact that these people were all devout puritans (the denomination that makes hard-line baptists look liberal) and you can pretty much come to the conclusion that there, in all likelyhood was no witchcraft that happened during the Salem Witch Trials. Quote: I must say that you are very good at arguing, lol, you're making me work. But I suppose that's a good thing ^-^. Heh, thanks.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Dec 24, 2006 10:35 am
Sorry for the long dealy...I've been busy, then lazy, and then depressed...so yeah.
I do have to say that I was perhaps wrong about one thing. I was just going on what I had always been taught, and that's probably a fault on my part, but it's one of those things that has been drilled into my head as a child, and so I never thought to actually check up on it.
In terms of Satan leading music in heaven, there is no solid proof. There is, however, some that suggests he was at least involved in it.
Quote: Question: "Was Satan in charge of music in Heaven?" Answer: Ezekiel 28:13 of the KJV and NKJV seem to hint that Satan was involved with music in Heaven. The two Scripture passages that describe Satan before he fell are Ezekiel 28:12-19 and Isaiah 14:12-15. Satan was the “anointed cherub” (Ezekiel 28:14). He was adorned with every precious jewel imaginable (Ezekiel 28:13). He was “the model of perfection, full of wisdom and perfect in beauty” (Ezekiel 28:12b). Likely he was the highest of all angels. He was persuasive enough to convince one-third of the angels to join him in his rebellion (Revelation 12:4). Even after his fall from heaven, not even Michael the archangel dares to stand up to him without the Lord’s help (Jude 9). Satan fell because of pride. He did not like being “second best”. He wanted to be God: “You said in your heart, ‘I will ascend to heaven; I will raise my throne above the stars of God; I will sit enthroned on the mount of assembly, on the utmost heights of the sacred mountain’” (Isaiah 14:13). Was Satan the head musician? I cannot answer that. Scripture does not say enough about what his duties were in heaven. Considering the fact that the angels constantly worship God (Isaiah 6:3; Revelation 4: cool , it is possible that Satan led in worship. For Satan to rebel despite having such an exalted position and close relationship with God – the devil is surely due his eternal destiny (Revelation 20:10). Recommended Resource: Angels: Elect & Evil by C. Fred Dickason.
I dunno, makes sense to me.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Reply
