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Creationism - A lose-lose situation?

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TANSTAAFL

PostPosted: Fri Jun 10, 2005 12:33 pm


In a rather in depth debate on another site, a creationist just lead me to this realisation;
TANSTAAFL
...and would like to add that the formation of any empirical theory upon a abstract philosophical, theological or metaphysical theory is asking for trouble, as it makes the theory impossible to truely prove, while it is possible to disprove it by removing the other evidence that it relies upon. So, while evolutionists can't prove that God didn't create the world, we can show that it didn't happen as Creationism says. And Creationists can't ever truely prove that he did create it. It is a lose-lose situation, due to the poor science used to base the theory.
The language is a bit flowery because it is a rather formal debate using lots of philosophy and other topics in the mix, but the gist of it is below;

Creationism is based up on a philosophical and theological abstractation, ie, that God exists and created the world. It also includes a good amount of empirical evidence, albeit weak evidence in comparison to that we have for evolution.

A philosophical abstractation can never truely be proven or disproven, so long as it is logicaly sound. So, as long as no-one can find a logical proof for the non-existance or existance of God, that remains uncertain. It must be assumed by the indervidual, and so it is a matter of belief, not science.

However, the empirical evidence that works alongside that assumption is subject to normal science, and can be disproven by scientific study. This is what most evolutionists, including those of us in this guild, tend to do most of the time, and is relativly simply most of the time.

With its empirical evidence removed, Creationism is left as a meer belief, with no more evidence or grounding in fact than any other abstract idea. And so creationism can never by used in a true scientific sense.

And, what is more, because the founding principle of creationism can never be proven, there is no way that it can become a definate theory, as the evidence is too tenuous without that cornerstone. Only those who have sufficient faith in the existance of God to ignore scientific procedure could ever think of it as a viable theory, even if evolution turns out to be false.

And so, any attempts for people to defend Creationism, either by attacking evolution or by building up a shield of evidence, is doomed, because they are building on, or prepairing the way for, a rotten foundation.


I want to get some opinions and constructive criticism before I take this to the main forums, and confront the Creationists themselfs with it. I don't realy want to have it torn apart because of some flaw in my logic.
PostPosted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 12:31 pm


Young Earth creationism is really just a camp of people who insist on saying that they believe in a literal interpretation of Genesis, primarly because they have been told that faith in the literal truth of the Bible is a good thing.

Creationists can't win a rational argument because they don't want to win. If they cared about being right, then they wouldn't be creationists.

At best, we can prove them wrong. Though creationists may have little interest in rationality, as human beings, they are still rational. The ability to reason is one of the defining traits of a person. With the perpetual provision of flawless arguments, you can gradually erode faith in the irrational, and thus defeat creationism.

gigacannon
Crew

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The Anti-Creationism Guild

 
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