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So, a woman gets raped and then pregnant. Adoption is a perfectly viable option. However, the woman still has to endure nine months of pregnancy.

Think about it for a moment. The entire concept of rape goes as follows: something was put inside of you that you were powerless to remove. The resulting mental scarring (oh yes, there WILL be mental scarring) will focus on a complex based on control/power, due to the fact that when she was raped, the woman had none.

Now think about pregnancy. Inside that very same space is something alien, something the woman cannot control, something put there by the man who stole her power and self-esteem, that she is powerless to remove.

Imagine being raped for nine months solid. I know it's not the same thing, but in the ruins of the woman's mind, it might as well be. It could drive her rather permanently insane.

So what's more important? The life of a woman who's already grown and lived and loved and developed a full and rich personality, or the life of a wad of cells? Would you prefer that the cells die and the woman eventually recovers, or that the cells live and mature into a baby while the woman is so heavily mentally impacted that she will probably never recover?

I'd say it is far, far more important to preserve a life that already exists rather than ruin it, and create a new one. That's like saying that it's okay to chop down a 2000-year-old sequoia and plant a sapling in its place. Yes, that sapling might POTENTIALLY become a 2000-year-old giant ... but then again, it might not. And we've already got this beautiful tree.

And then you get the tricky dilemma of a woman who was raped or otherwise abused in the past, and still traumatized from the experience.

A common behavior pattern of a victim suffering from Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder induced by rape is to become promiscuous as a self-defense mechanism; she has "proof" that both she and her body are worthless, so therefore there's no harm to be had in having lots of sex. She sleeps around as a form of self-validation, attempting to support what little remains of her self-esteem but failing each time because she puts herself into a situaiton where she is only used. Since she is unable to form emotional connections, any time a benevolent partner might enter her life with the possibility of love, she ups and runs and tries again. It's a cycle that most never break out of. She repeats the pattern over and over, each time trying to make it work right and failing. For an example, in the movie "Forrest Gump," the history is inaccurate but the behavior patterns of the character Jenny, who was abused by her father, are a classic case.

It's very likely that a woman in such a pattern might become pregnant, since she'll often have so little regard for herself that protection seems unimportant. And so even though that particular sexual act was 'consensual,' she'll probably be just as unable to carry a baby as the aforementioned pregnancy-from-rape case, even if it's years later.

eek Wow. Long post. Sorry, everyone, but here comes another!

The life has already been created; you yourself admitted earlier that it was a "life."

Fallacious analogy. Your analogous adult dies for the child; the woman is not killed by going through pregnancy and delivering the baby.

I'm not sure I understand the direction you are taking this argument... sweatdrop

I'm also confused about why your hypothetical woman isn't seeking counseling, help from others, or even a shoulder to cry on! Any one of these would help her over the trauma, and she wouldn't have to resort to selling herself.

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And, yet, some women not only would, they do.

If a woman does want that, would you force her to do otherwise? When imagining how you'd feel if you were FORCED to have an abortion, can you imagine how another woman might feel if she were forced to bear a child?

Because that's what we're talking about - compulsion.

Why will the woman feel okay, might I ask? Why will bringing the son/daughter of someone who took everything from her make everything okey dokey? I don't see where you are coming from at all with this, especially you're idea of 'saving two lives instead of killing one'. How will the woman's life be saved?




What is WRONG with you that makes you say something like that? How can you be so casual about something as harsh as rape? And on top of it all, what in your right mind makes you believe that (once more) this woman will be happy being forced to bring this child into the world, which was only conceived because she was FORCED to give herself up to a man.



This is irrevelant. You need to stop using personal analogies, because the chances of them happening are slim, and not only that, but "what if" scenerios do not apply well to an argument.



Once more, your choice of words disgusts me. 'Sure, the woman's life was destroyed'. Your casual approach to the topic of rape has no place in this discussion, since you obviouly have no idea what you're talking about. If this woman's life is destroyed, as even you put it, not only will she need time to come to grips with the situation, but then she will need to rebuild everything she had before the incident. And why not just throw a child in there, the fruit growing inside of her with the blood flowing through it of the one who desroyed her life.



Excuse me? Feel guilty about being raped? You're right, to an extent. Most rape cases involve the woman feeling as if it was her fault that the situation ever happened, but for you to use that as an excuse as to why she shouldn't have an abortion is absurd. Truly. You have no idea what is going through that woman's head, what she feels, the trauma and memories she must cope with for the rest of her life. Why does she need yet another burden? Yes, a BURDEN - not a blessing.



It actually is a very good analogy, had you the ability the open your eyes and look at the whole picture. This is not comparing a tree to a woman who is simply having a baby. It is comparing the murder of a grown, mature, and beautiful life who was only destroyed because of the young that may possibly grow to be just as great. When a woman is raped, she often loses most self-respect, is deeply traumatized, has little confidence, and deals with many other pains. This is, in essence, chopping her down. And by forcing her to have a child after all she has gone through, it is more than likely that this will completely destroy her.



Why is it okay for something like this to happen to a woman, and then the case is followed up by yet another prevention of choice for her?

There is no definite as to what a woman will feel after she is raped, nor is there as to what would happen if she was impregnated because of it.
That is WHY abortion in the case of rape should be allowed, as well as abortion is general. To murder possible babies? No, but to give every woman and their partner a choice as to what they want, and what they will do with their future. It is not just a baby's life involved, it is also the life (lives) of everyone around it.

I really don't feel the need to justify my point any further. You are wrong.

Now I remember what I originally thought...In your post, you mentioned something along the lines of 'She'd be happy to have the child so that she could prevent the same thing happening to her.'
How is it a preventable situation? Sure, if you're a girl, you could *not* walk around Harlem at night, or *not* prance around provocatively, but most cases aren't like that. In most situations, it just happens, so I don't see how great a length the mother could take to prevent her child from being raped.



You know what would be funny? What if they took a bunch of chimpanzees, dressed half of them in space suits, the other half as ballerinas and made them form an army against terrorism.


I have extremely personal experience in the topic of rape, more than you'll ever know, and I'd like to leave the statement at that if you don't mind.



I am well aware of this fact, and understand it. However, you don't seem to understand both sides like I do. The way you make your position out to be comes across as if you care ONLY for the baby's life, and not for the mother's as well.


One more thing I'd like to mention, if you are so close to the topic of rape, how is it that it is a casual thing for you? Does it not make you feel more strongly towards the situation, rather than just brush it off?

I see where you are coming from, but how much can you tell a girl to avoid her being abused?
'Don't trust men.'
'Don't walk around at night'
'Don't...go outside, or leave your doors unlocked, and be alone inside of your fortress you've created...'



Actually, I feel it's definately the other way around. Most people tend to solely see an abortion as 'murder' and do not take the time to think that this baby may NOT cure cancer, or be an olympist. I don't understand why why Pro-Lifers (no offense) constantly state things such as:
"You don't know what that child could have done. They could have stopped global warming!"
Yes...it *could* have, but chances are, it won't.
I also don't see many people other than the constants belonging to Pro-Choice groups standing up and saying things like "That baby could have killed the mother, in more ways than one."
Sure, I understand that the chances of it hurting a woman are almost as slim (but not quite stare ) as it winning the gold medal, but if she's considering an abortion, there's uaully a good reason. That's why we believe in CHOICE. Pro-CHOICE, not Pro-Abortion. We don't try to push abortion on people, we simply believe that everyone has a right to choose what they want to do with their life (and, I understand what you'll probably respond with, "The baby didn't choose what they got to do with their life! scream ", but you know what? Too damn bad for the clod of cells. It's leeching off of a woman who doesn't want it, and it's damn better that she remove it now, rather than dump t in a trash can when she has it because it's costing her too much money, grief, relationship issues, and halting her life.)



I understand things like this as well... Over the past two years, my school district has been in the papers about 10 times...For academic achievement? Not quite. For things like containing the '5th most violent school in NY', and for 'wars' between groups, scandals, etc. I get a Sex Offender notice in my mailbox every three days. Sure, they take the time to send them, but my general area doesn't really care about things like rape, molestation, and any kind of abuse in general. It's just a normal thing here, and I think that's sad.

Those who have not experienced being raped can not even begin to imagine the emotional pain and terror that those who have go through.
Whenever I hear people say things like "People who get raped shouldn't have abortions because it's not the baby's fault" I just want to scream. People that say this kind of thing don't even seem to be thinking about the girl who got raped.

When I was fifteen years old I hung out with a group of friends that ranged in age from 15 to 25. I started hanging out with a guy who was about 22 at the time. What was supposed to just be a friendship turned into a controlling physically abusive pseudo-romance. This guy was popular and had a lot of social power in my group of friends, and being fifteen I was terribly afraid of social rejection. For about nine months this guy manipulated me, using guilt and threats of violence to control me. I had never had a sexual relationship or even a romantic relationship before, so I was very uncomfortable with his sexual advances but if I refused to give him what he wanted he became physically violent. For nine months I managed to dodge "going all the way", but got a lot of bruises in the process. I guess he finally got tired of not getting his way, because eventually he found a way to get me completely isolated and in a place where I could not escape for cry for help and then he raped me.
Afterwards I was in complete shock. For a long time I couldn't even comprehend what had happened. In my mind rape was something that happened when strangers attacked you in the night, not something that someone who was supposed to be your friend would do. I felt that because I had not fought back enough that it couldn't be rape, and that it was my fault. I was so scared and I felt so guilty that I didn't tell anyone about what happened. Even if I had told anyone, I would never have been able to get him convicted. I had no evidence. He had actually forced me to bathe and get rid of any physical evidence before he would let me leave. To avoid him and anyone who might ask questions I isolated myself from everyone.
For over two months I lived with the terror and fear that I might be pregnant. I was throwing up nearly every day and had many of the other early symptoms of pregnancy. I even missed several periods. Just thinking about the possibility that there was something growing inside of me that he had put there would make me throw up. As the initially shock began to wear off I finally got up the courage to go to my doctor. I still couldn't comprehend the reality of what had happened, so I did not tell my doctor that I had been raped. I just told him that I had had sex and that I needed birth control. I had no intentions of having sex, but I wanted birth control because I was afraid I would be raped again. It was only then that I found out I wasn't pregnant. All the symptoms that had looked like signs of pregnancy were actually just reactions to the stress and trauma.
I only lived with the fear of being pregnant for two months and that was enough to make me suicidal. I know that if I had been forced to live with the knowledge of being pregnant by him for nine months I would have taken my own life. To me that thing growing inside of me would have been nothing more than a monster reminding me every day of what he had done and how pathetic and worthless I was.