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 Posted: Sat Aug 05, 2006 6:56 pm
Alright, we've all gone through it. A period where we hit the proverbial brick wall in soloing. When we see those changes and go blank. Here's the place to get the help to get out of that rut. Post any question you might have about improvisation in general... Whether it be chord related or otherwise. I (and hopefully other people) will give you any help we can gather.
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Posted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 2:01 pm
my teacher has been strongly encouraging licks for me now. i understand with 251´s but i´d like to stick it free with other changes. what do you guys think?
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Posted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 2:09 pm
Well... I waas once told, by my instructor as well as several clinitians (I heard Charlie Parkerr said this as well), "Learn licks, patterns, anything you can... One you memorize them and they feel nice under your fingers, forget about them..."
And froget about them as in don't think about playing them when you solo, it'll come naturall.
I find this works exquisetly well. I'll be playing a solo, and I'll realize that the lick I just played was something I memorized awhile ago.
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Posted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 2:52 pm
That's how I do it too. It's really useful, and if Bird swore so much by it, it has to be worth at least looking into it.
The only problem, and incidently the reason so many people insist that they're better off just 'winging it', is the amount of time it takes to memorize all those little ideas not only in your head but in your fingers-- in all twelve keys.
If you don't do it in all twelve keys, then they won't be nearly as useful.
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Posted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 3:39 pm
trying memorising licks on a piano sometime.
then in twelve different keys.
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Posted: Mon Aug 07, 2006 3:59 pm
i´ll try all of your suggestions; thanks!
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Posted: Mon Aug 07, 2006 11:29 pm
Is there any key centre in Coltrane's Giant Steps? The chords don't seem to have any pattern to what I can see...
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Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 10:00 am
^ ^ That's the whole idea of the song. It's also why some people consider it to be one of the most harmonically complex songs out there.
The changes are unusual.
That's why Coltrane even wrote it. It was originally just an "etude" for him to work on odd changes, but at some point it found its way into his repetoire.
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Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 12:14 pm
Well, actually... It has a shape, but it's complex.
Now, for now, ignore the first change (Concert Bmaj7).
The second change in the progression is the V7 of the next chord (So D7 to Gmaj7).
From there, it drops down a third (Gmaj7 to Bb7). After the Bb7 to the Ebmaj7, it does a ii-V7-I turnaround and strarts the progression again a minor third down (Gmaj7 instead of Bmaj7).
The progression repeats itself for a third time and returns back to the top with the last V7 leading into the begging Maj Chord (F#7 to Bmaj7)
See, everything has a pattern, you just gotta think sometimes...
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Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 3:35 pm
Tenor_Guru Well, actually... It has a shape, but it's complex. Now, for now, ignore the first change (Concert Bmaj7). The second change in the progression is the V7 of the next chord (So D7 to Gmaj7). From there, it drops down a third (Gmaj7 to Bb7). After the Bb7 to the Ebmaj7, it does a ii-V7-I turnaround and strarts the progression again a minor third down (Gmaj7 instead of Bmaj7). The progression repeats itself for a third time and returns back to the top with the last V7 leading into the begging Maj Chord (F#7 to Bmaj7) See, everything has a pattern, you just gotta think sometimes... but thinking hurts!!! nah, just kidding. that´s great that you can figure it all out, though.
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Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 10:50 pm
Tenor_Guru Well, actually... It has a shape, but it's complex. Now, for now, ignore the first change (Concert Bmaj7). The second change in the progression is the V7 of the next chord (So D7 to Gmaj7). From there, it drops down a third (Gmaj7 to Bb7). After the Bb7 to the Ebmaj7, it does a ii-V7-I turnaround and strarts the progression again a minor third down (Gmaj7 instead of Bmaj7). The progression repeats itself for a third time and returns back to the top with the last V7 leading into the begging Maj Chord (F#7 to Bmaj7) See, everything has a pattern, you just gotta think sometimes... I think my occipital lobe just exploded....
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Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 11:08 pm
MagicKnightKenshin I think my occipital lobe just exploded.... I try! Just remeber, there's only three main tonal bases within the song. I belive Bmaj, Gmaj, and Ebmaj!
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Posted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 3:24 pm
Tenor_Guru MagicKnightKenshin I think my occipital lobe just exploded.... I try! Just remeber, there's only three main tonal bases within the song. I belive Bmaj, Gmaj, and Ebmaj! okay *calms down a bit*
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Posted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 7:28 pm
doc.hyphae Tenor_Guru MagicKnightKenshin I think my occipital lobe just exploded.... I try! Just remeber, there's only three main tonal bases within the song. I belive Bmaj, Gmaj, and Ebmaj! okay *calms down a bit* WHat's funny is I didn't really see that untill I analized it yesterday.
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Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 2:33 pm
Tenor_Guru doc.hyphae Tenor_Guru MagicKnightKenshin I think my occipital lobe just exploded.... I try! Just remeber, there's only three main tonal bases within the song. I belive Bmaj, Gmaj, and Ebmaj! okay *calms down a bit* WHat's funny is I didn't really see that untill I analized it yesterday. oh, okay. i have a Coltrane book in my room so i´ll check out Giant Steps in a while.
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