Should we have kids?

[ElenaMason]

This is actually based off of something during a debate in some pm's i had with a friend of mine.

And it got me thinking.....as time draws nearer to the end of times and as the world worsens....should we really have kids at a time like this?

I mean...okay...yes we all suffer during our life time....but compare us to 1950...or 1930....look how much worse it's gotten. The world we have today....whats it gonna be 20 years from now? or 30? its gonna get worse according to the bible and i dont want kids living in a world thats bad enough as it is...and then to suffer through it 20 or so years from now.  

[Guacamole-kun]

I'd say.. no. I don't want kids, anyway. And one of the main reasons is because so many other people are having them, and you could just adopt them instead. But actually, I recently heard that in America, there are less than two kids per couple at the moment. But that doesn't mean we should be all lax about it and start having too many again, since we really are still way overpopulated. ^^;;;

So, basically.. No. I don't think it's a very good idea to have kids unless you can completely justify it. Adopting would be a much better idea.

Although I really don't see what you mean about the badness and the suffering. I think you might want to start looking at the cup as half full, because so far, the world seems pretty cool, to me. And there are a ton of people working to make it an even better place to live.  

[mahjqa]

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As time draws nearer to the end of times and as the world worsens....should we really have kids at a time like this?
I mean...okay...yes we all suffer during our life time....but compare us to 1950...or 1930....look how much worse it's gotten.

Ah yes. So much worse. Cribdeath is way down, we've got antibiotics, improved medical care, the blacks are even allowed their own bus seats now!

(For those who can't tell: that was sarcasm. You think in the 1930s it was better? Don't be silly. Sanitary conditions were below the bar, pneumonia would kill you, your boss could fire you any day he wanted, and more than half of the kids didn't make it through childhood.)

We've been living at the end of times for quite a while now. Ever since Jesus died we've been waiting. Yes, we should be ready for when He returns. But that doesn't mean we should cower in a corner in fear. It means we should have our business together.

That also means that you shouldn't have kids until you're absolutely sure you're able to provide for them. It's estimated that raising a kid 'til he or she is 18 is more than half a million dollars, and that's not counting all the time you'll invest either.

Sure, I'm not saying that everything is peachy-keen in the world. Far from it. There's plenty of things that could and should be improved. But how bad is your life, really? You've got food in your stomach, an education, a place to sleep, and plenty of free time to waste on Gaia.

But does the world need more kiddies? Nah. Adopt one that's already there, if you really feel the need. Most kiddies are born for the selfishness of the parents, who think it'll be fun, or that it'll enrich their life. Most of the rest of them are 'accidents'.  

[LifeAngel]

When someone asks me that question I say do you love the man/women you are with? Can you support a family right now? Will you still love God? They really think when I ask them those questions and they say "your smart!" I just tell them I look at what come with having a child.  

[Guacamole-kun]

LifeAngel

When someone asks me that question I say do you love the man/women you are with? Can you support a family right now? Will you still love God? They really think when I ask them those questions and they say "your smart!" I just tell them I look at what come with having a child.

Ack... those are pretty basic things. sweatdrop Or you would think so, anyway. I wonder what they do think about, if not stuff like that?  

[Ginger Snapple]

I personally think that we should have kids.
We don't know that this is the end of times. The end of times has drawn near for human society ever since Jesus died on the cross. No one has ever known when he is coming, and we don't know that he will.
And what happens if none of us do? What if he doesnt come in our life time? How many people would be raised as Christians if Christians decided to stop having children?
I plan on making a family once I cross that little invisible line into adulthood. I'll raise my kids right, and that way when the end of times comes, they're ready, or their kids are ready, or so on and so forth.  

[ElenaMason]

I'm not saying the end of tiems is now or any time soon as in the near future, but the world is worse wether people realize it or not. it isn't entirely irradicated there will alway be a problem of racism in the world. (since the example was given eariler).

because of so much premarital sex there is the giant spread of STD's. prices are LARGELY higher than back then, we have more problems with other countries especially with the racism, there's abortion, homosexuality, higher crime rates, media on tv is worse....

its not just the big things that add up, its the little things too. its ALL worse. MY life is just fine as it is right NOW.....but it was rare to see a homeless person back in the 50's...just look at all the homeless people now...everything is worse and it will only worsen as time goes on.

and to answer the question...what does this have to do with having kids? if i have kids say 10 yrs from now (ill be 30 by then) my kids will grow up not only in this state of the world, but they'll be dealing with the world as it worsens even more than it is now...

i mean it doesnt take much ti IMAGINE the world being much worse than it is now. and i dont care what people say, our justice system SUCKS...that too has downgraded over time.  

[mahjqa]

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it isn't entirely irradicated there will alway be a problem of racism in the world.

But, y'know, having abolished slavery, equal rights (at least in theory), we're going ahead. My local wal-mart is run entirely by hispanics, turks and moroccans. The boss of our local bank is black. (excuse me, european-african-american.)

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because of so much premarital sex there is the giant spread of STD's.

As a practicing Christian who's not planning to do that, I don't see how that has any effect on you.

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prices are LARGELY higher than back then

Numero uno: inflation. A dollar now is hardly as much as a dollar then. Dos; how long did you think your grandparents had to save before they could buy a car or a TV? Right now anyone bagging groceries can do that.

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we have more problems with other countries

Nah, I doubt that Bush will be president once you've spawned little ones.
(though, his son may be... they've pulled one like that already...)

But who am I kidding. I don't think anyone on Gaia is fit to raise children by default.  

[jamesthelittle]

Yes, you should have children if you want children. We are called to be fruitful and multiply.  

[Haven923]

I'll just state it this way: Would you really want to deprive Heaven of one more person for an eternity? Seriously, not having kids (In a rightful marriage, of course) because you don't want them to go through trial is pointless. We all go through trial anyways. Plus, if you get them to beleive or if they are to young to have a propper understanding of right and wrong(I think), then you have nothing to worry about. It is like telling yourself that you are not going to eat for the rest of your kife because you might get food poisening. It is stupid  

[ElenaMason]

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As a practicing Christian who's not planning to do that, I don't see how that has any effect on you.

i was using that as an EXAMPLE for one of the many problems of the world. even if i wait to have sex until marriage, that doesn't mean my husband will have an STD he doesn't know about and accidentally trasmit to me....and btw fyi, there are STD's that can be transmitted just by skin to skin touch. need i say anything more?

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Numero uno: inflation. A dollar now is hardly as much as a dollar then. Dos; how long did you think your grandparents had to save before they could buy a car or a TV? Right now anyone bagging groceries can do that.

okay as a simple example, an ice cream cone at my work place is 1.39, back then it was 10 cents....10 CENTS.....inflation or not, its still a large difference....especially gas prices....man they've risen.

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Nah, I doubt that Bush will be president once you've spawned little ones.
(though, his son may be... they've pulled one like that already...)

excuse me? but why does everything have to pertain to Bush? I said nothing about Bush. i enjoy him as a president first of all, and second of all we've always had problems with other countries, only recently have they gotten bad again...  

[Tarrou]

If you'd like to enjoy social security when you retire, then the answer is yes. Seriously, look at Japan: as the oldest nation on earth (demographically speaking), their welfare state is in very real danger of keeling over and dying within a couple of decades.
But beyond that, I don't really think that the world is going downhill, so to speak. Quite the contrary, it's entirely possible that we're at the apex of earthly prosperity, what with global warming and peak oil threatening to shred the very foundation of our modern economy. This may be about as good as it gets, folks. But in the end, the question's kind of moot: the instinct to propagate the species is pretty well ingrained in us humans, and so we'll probably keep breeding regardless of what's happening in the world.

SaintChaos

okay as a simple example, an ice cream cone at my work place is 1.39, back then it was 10 cents....10 CENTS.....inflation or not, its still a large difference....especially gas prices....man they've risen.

Yeah, prices are higher, but that really doesn't matter. What's important is wage/price ratios (i.e. real value). Yes, 'back then' prices were lower, but so were wages. As such, our parents and grandparents didn't actually have more buying power than we do today. In fact, quite a few modern items, such as televisions, are less expensive than their latter-day counterparts, although that's largely due to technological and manufacturing advances and not improved purchasing power.
As for gasoline, that's a simply supply/demand problem, one which has been significantly complicated by the fact that much of the world's oil is in the politically volatile Middle East.
See Real versus nominal value.

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But who am I kidding. I don't think anyone on Gaia is fit to raise children by default.

A bit harsh, don't you think? Most of the people on this site are pretty young. Isn't it a bit premature to judge their eventual parenting abilities based on their current behavior? That'd be rather like looking at a toddler and saying, 'Well he'll clearly never be qualified to drive'.  

[mahjqa]

SaintChaos

fyi, there are STD's that can be transmitted just by skin to skin touch. need i say anything more?

No, those are regular diseases, since their transmission doesn't require sex. I do hope you see how you ridiculous you sound; if they can be transmitted by skin contact, they have nothing to do with any sexual behavior we may have or lack, including premarital sex.

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excuse me? but why does everything have to pertain to Bush? I said nothing about Bush. i enjoy him as a president first of all, and second of all we've always had problems with other countries, only recently have they gotten bad again...

Yeah, that was around that time Jeb walked in. Are you old enough to remember the first Persian gulf war? Bush I kicked some Iraqi a** with superior technology and manpower, simply to distract the public from domestic issues.

Bush II tried the same under false pretenses (How many years 'til we find those WMDs?), which horribly backfired. As a result he's got half the world pissed at America.

But we've beaten this dead horse millions of times before. I doubt either one of us will change their opinion on this issue.

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But who am I kidding. I don't think anyone on Gaia is fit to raise children by default.

A bit harsh, don't you think? Most of the people on this site are pretty young. Isn't it a bit premature to judge their eventual parenting abilities based on their current behavior?

I'm sure Gaians can grow to be wonderful parents, given time. However, when most of them are discussing having children here, it seems like they can hardly wait and have no idea what they'd be getting themselves into.
It seems we agree on this point.  

[divineseraph]

it should be a choice of yours wether or not you have kids, but not the the extreme where if you decide not to you feel the need to kill it. if you want kids, go for it. if not, well, avoid sex or otherwise try not to get pregnant.

i am pro-life, so i despise abortion. however, i am not for "mother farms" as some would assume. i just want people to deal with the responsibility that comes with consentual acts of the sexual persuasion, without killing their young.  

[ElenaMason]

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No, those are regular diseases, since their transmission doesn't require sex. I do hope you see how you ridiculous you sound; if they can be transmitted by skin contact, they have nothing to do with any sexual behavior we may have or lack, including premarital sex.

excuse me if i base my knowledge off my human sexuality professor >_> the HPV can be transmitted by simple genital to gential contact...and i believe there was another one that was done in the same way. So if you think "I' sound ridiculous, my knowledge comes from a different source other than my own.

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it should be a choice of yours wether or not you have kids, but not the the extreme where if you decide not to you feel the need to kill it. if you want kids, go for it. if not, well, avoid sex or otherwise try not to get pregnant.

i am pro-life, so i despise abortion. however, i am not for "mother farms" as some would assume. i just want people to deal with the responsibility that comes with consentual acts of the sexual persuasion, without killing their young.

i dont know about other people, but after watching explicit Birth Giving videos in my human sexuality class....i REALLy dont want to go through pregnancy >_> im allergic to pain.