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wolf-larsen
Crew

PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2005 7:54 pm


Humans are born into a world that was against them in a thousand little ways, and then devote most of their energies to making it worse.

Once again Terry Pratchett but isn't it so very true?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2005 9:40 pm


I think this quote needs some expansion. It strikes me oddly, mostly because it is so vauge in what it's talking about. Oversimplified sayings like this usually don't strike me well (heh).

What things are against us?
Are these things against us, truly, in little ways?
What about the things that are towards us?
Why the assumption that most energies make things worse?
How can you claim to know that?

Starlock


ImNotaFashionStatment

PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2005 11:24 am


Yea that is pretty vauge(sp?), and its not universaly true i belive. The way it sounds to me its as if were all one big team or somthing. Every one is against eachother so all the "energy" that is being used might be helping some people but hurtiong others. But then that makes me think that the quote says we should unite and create peace. I guess thats whathe wanted then?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2005 3:53 pm


Well first of all when it says humanity, of course it means generally because each person is different. But to address your points starlock, just think about the world. The completely natural obstacles to life include but are not limited to, earthquake, tornado, volcano, drought, flood, and a multitude of other things that mother nature throws at us. Now that we have a small part of that before us lets consider what is for us. Not a whole hell of a lot. Have you ever seen a deer or other prey animal walk up to a hunter and say"Please shoot me?" Have you ever seen plants just pop up out of nowhere, ready to be harvested? Have you ever seen fabric sew itself into clothes? NO. We have to work and slave for everything. If not you then someone else does, to sell it to you.

Now have you seen an invention lately that saves lives and nothing else? Of course you have. Its called Plastic, and there is a multitude of other things like it. Now with that in mind, how many invetions have you seen soley to destroy life? More than life saving ones I can tell you that. And as far as that goes, how many people do you meet that would save a persons life rather than take it? I can tell you, I can walk out of my room into the street and ask an average, or if you prefer, random person, and they can probaly list anywhere from three to fifteen people they would like to see dead, ranging from the president to that crazy woman down the street with the cats. And I don't claim to know this, but from my knowledge of various people and specific cases, the majority of it supports the qoute.

wolf-larsen
Crew


Starlock

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 9:06 pm


Well, if you choose to look at the glass as half-empty, that is a choice. One says Earth throws at us evils, and another says that Earth also gives us the gift of life, throwing at us a chance at survival and the tools to do so. Humans are so self-centered. They think everything has to serve them, or its against them. The Earth isn't against us any more than it is for us. You're only slaving if that's how you choose to see it.
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 4:20 pm


I think this discussion is leaning closer and closer back towards the ever popular, "What is the meaning of life?" debate.

I think that some people look at it as...
A:"Why do I bother when nothing will ever change?"
B: "Maybe I can't change everything, but I can make it a little better and at least live my life."
Then there are the crazy ones like me who say C: "Lets stop bitching and do something about it." These people are looked at strangely by type A and B and are highly disliked.

Point blank, of course there are things working against us. But we have to deal with them and get over ourselves. Those crazy type C people are the enviromentalists and scientists and select politicials who actually DO want to make a difference. And if more people could understand that then maybe we COULD make the world a little better so there aren't as many things working against us, and more working with us.

bonkiep


Pyro_wished_it

PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2005 12:07 am


Time for my analysis of what you have said/typed wolf-larsen.
First, lets look at this:
wolf-larsen
Not a whole hell of a lot. Have you ever seen a deer or other prey animal walk up to a hunter and say"Please shoot me?" Have you ever seen plants just pop up out of nowhere, ready to be harvested? Have you ever seen fabric sew itself into clothes?


1: Lets look at the deer statement. Here's my question to you, Would you like to go to a predator and lie down ready and willing for it to kill and eat you?

2: As for the plant, i'm so sorry nature has to be logical and have things grow by gathering things they need and living and just not spontaniously creating themselves out of thin air. (sarcasm)

Simple truth is things won't manage themselves. If you want it then you have to get it. Food can be easily gotten if you actually consider this(for purposes of this please think of this in a forest). In nature animals just eat the fruit, which usually contain seeds or just one seed. They usually eat the seeds and they become planted elsewhere where they grow and produce more. But us being the human race as we are don't go around and pick food. We stay in located areas and grow our own because it is conveniant to us. Food would be easily accessible if we were more like regular animals that don't depend on located vegetation supplied by other humans with our agriculture techniques.

Second:
wolf-larsen
Now have you seen an invention lately that saves lives and nothing else? Of course you have. Its called Plastic, and there is a multitude of other things like it. Now with that in mind, how many invetions have you seen soley to destroy life? More than life saving ones I can tell you that.


1: Yes, i agree there MAY be more inventions to kill than to save with humans nature to dominate. But there are quite a few to save. Lets list some.
To save:
1: Vehicles used to transport people to hospitals or where life saving techniques may be performed.
2: Vaccines of numerous types for numerous diseases.
3: Life support machines
4: Plastic (as you put it)

To kill:
1: Guns of numerous types
2: Mobile arsenal machines
3: Bombs
(i put them in vague descriptions as they are all basically weapons that kill using very similar ways)

It seems to me that even though there are many variations to the technology we use to kill each other there are also many things we use to help each other. You can't just say we kill. I am usually one to go in an argument and point out all the ways the human race is a smoldering race that has many chances of throwing ourselves into deaths row but you are giving us too little credit.

third:
wolf-larsen
And as far as that goes, how many people do you meet that would save a persons life rather than take it? I can tell you, I can walk out of my room into the street and ask an average, or if you prefer, random person, and they can probaly list anywhere from three to fifteen people they would like to see dead, ranging from the president to that crazy woman down the street with the cats."


1: this is just my own opinion but how many people would they REALLY want to see dead. It;s easy to say "i want them dead" because they annoy or anger the heck out of you but whenever i play around with a person who says "I wish they would die" (by saying in response "okay, i can get you a weapon and we'll kill them. I'm serious it's easy and we won't get caught." ((though i will not be serious i may act serious until they come to their senses))) they withdraw what they say and state it was not meant literally and was meant as more of an exspression of how much they dislike them.

2: You do not say of the people that will help to save people. How about the many people that donate blood or organs? What about the doctors that see much blood and many cases of human tragedies and sufferings? What of the people who donate money to organizations and to those on the streets in need of it?(as for the charities it may be for publicity so it may not always be true for big donaters) There are alot of people that may help others and donate a little of them so that the others can have a better life?
Example: There may be many people starving in Africa but there are many people that are willing to help. Such as in my school we raised over 7000 dollars for food for Africa. We even had lunched that would be sparse and just rice and some beans that the starving African people would eat so we can become more sympathetic.


My overall analysis:
Some of my personal opinions is that human corruption is somewhat based off of our need to dominate and our attachment to material things and also out of our dependence on technology. If we were like the animals our air would be cleaner(as our none-existant technology will not be putting a lot of smog and pollutants into out air on a day-to-day basis just so we can produce or do things faster and easier). We wouldn't need to work for things, as food and water would be already available and as we would, in this scenario, be animals we wouldn't need much else. maybe weapons that would be easy to create.(as you made such a big deal of this). We wouldn't be fighting much more if we weren't so attached to material things. We don't need almost any of the things we have. Have you ever seen fear factor? Well they humiliate themselves and create anger amongst them and the other contestants just for materials they don't need. People will do some horrible things for material possesions they just don't need! Yes, i beleive the human race, in general, is very corrupt with little hope thus far. But we are not as horrible as you have put it so.

note: i am sorry if what i say makes me seem like a complete idiot, maybe i should have stayed away and kept my opinions to myself.
PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2005 9:38 pm


Oh Father, deliver us from evil

- Some priest

Any way I just thought of somthing. When that guy says that most people devote themselfs to making it worse. I think that this is untrue. Most people are somewhat if not very religious. That quote above is relevent because people turn to religion to try to make things better. So most of the world has a religion, thus they are trying to make the world better. So, Most of the world is trying to make the world better. I'm not saying that they do a good job, but they try and thats what counts. And as for the things about stuff being made to kill people vs stuff being made to save people. I'm not going to get into it alot. But just a thought, don't you think that people made those things to defend themselfs or other people, so they made it to defend people which is acually the opposite of what you said.

ImNotaFashionStatment


ron-and-mee

PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 9:09 am


wolf-larsen
I can tell you, I can walk out of my room into the street and ask an average, or if you prefer, random person, and they can probaly list anywhere from three to fifteen people they would like to see dead, ranging from the president to that crazy woman down the street with the cats. And I don't claim to know this, but from my knowledge of various people and specific cases, the majority of it supports the qoute.


Simply because I have nothing else to do today, I'm going to try testing this with a few people and I'll get back to you on it.
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2005 9:29 am


"Optimists believe we live in the best world we can possibly live in. Pessimists fear that they're right."

airsswordsman
Crew


Musubi P.

PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2005 1:21 am


wolf-larsen
Humans are born into a world that was against them in a thousand little ways, and then devote most of their energies to making it worse.

Once again Terry Pratchett but isn't it so very true?


Nature was against us. It is still, but it helps in some way. Aids is a population control tool. Global warming is another slower population controll tool, and a form of punishment



If there would be not technology, and we would live in the woods. We wouldn't get depressed, because it is natural invoriment. But as we know from nature, it is hard to bring a coala bear back to nature, once it was taken from it .
The same is with humans.


Why should anyone bother about it? No one can change it, to many people are urbanized. Humanity doesn't need any more worries.
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