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Posted: Tue Mar 01, 2005 2:07 pm
It is logically impossible for a running man to be hit with an arrow going in the same direction.
In order for things to move, or even change, there must be a smallest increment of time. This increment would be dictated by the amount of time for the smallest thing possible to happen TO happen. Since nothing can move any more or any less than any other object in this increment of time, everything must therefore move at the same rate. And therefore, things travelling in the same direction must be travelling at precisely the same speed. But things don't work that way.
It can be further construed from this that if things do not work in the way described above, there can be no movement, or time. And now, my brain hurts. According to this, all of existance must be the dream of some incomprehensibly complex being. A lot of thought has gone into this, through the ancient greek philosophers, to today. Until someone can come up with a better explanation for the existance of Time itself, it stands that there is, in fact, a God.
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Posted: Tue Mar 01, 2005 2:52 pm
Rene Descartes would be proud...
But using God as the explaination seems to be pushing it in my opinion. Is everything that you cannot explain necessarily god?
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Posted: Tue Mar 01, 2005 4:44 pm
Scorpo In order for things to move, or even change, there must be a smallest increment of time. There is where you logic breaks. Who says that? The smallest unit we use is going to be at the time, that doesn't mean you can't continue to break that down into infinity. If you know what the properties of infinities (be it bounded or not) are, then you know that they don't exactly work like regular numbers since they are not numbers at all, rather an infinite progression or digression of something. On top of that, you are refering to math which though it be very very useful in describing the universe is contained in an abstract universe that doesn't really exist except as thought (although though is a physical thing in a since, that's beyond the point). So, your logic is talking about the abstract realm which is supposed to mimic reality, but is not reality and no matter how good it is at measuring it is still not reality. I'm not sure where you got a being out of all of this except another abstract reality called your imagination...
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Posted: Thu Mar 03, 2005 7:12 am
Like I said, Logic Kinda Sucks.
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Posted: Thu Mar 03, 2005 12:10 pm
Dude, that had to be one of the screwiest things I have ever heard. BUT, I think you have a definite point. Or at least something I can add to. If there is no change in speed or rate, then for the arrow to catch the running man, then it has to start before him. We patently know that the arrow is faster in reality but perhaps the arrow just jumps back in time a second and that would provide more than enough leeway in the time and speed ratio to kill the running man. We also know that no two actions are truly instantaneous, so if we make the assumption that the arrow always starts first then your theory would hold water. But among the many wars and murders in mans history we also know that this is not always the case and the man still dies, so that wiil not support it. But perhaps the man stopped or slowed for the slightest instant, perhaps to look over his shoulder, and the arrow patently did not. My head is buzzzing now so I'm going to quit.
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Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 2:09 pm
Learn about sums to infinity of geometric series where r is between 0 and 1.
Then you will know where your mistake lies.
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Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 3:08 pm
No. There HAS to be a limit. It may be small unto infinity, but the smallest possible increment of time must have a finite duration. Otherwise it would not be an increment. Besides, there are some things that just don't split in nature.
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Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 6:55 pm
Scorpo No. There HAS to be a limit. It may be small unto infinity, but the smallest possible increment of time must have a finite duration. Otherwise it would not be an increment. Besides, there are some things that just don't split in nature. - There is no proof of that either. Just because we can't spit it doesn't mean it can't be split. Remember that there was once logic that there was no way to communicate with Mars because the flag that would have to be built would be too large. Then we find out more about this universe around us and voiala, radio waves...
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Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 10:49 am
jayon Scorpo No. There HAS to be a limit. It may be small unto infinity, but the smallest possible increment of time must have a finite duration. Otherwise it would not be an increment. Besides, there are some things that just don't split in nature. - There is no proof of that either. Just because we can't spit it doesn't mean it can't be split. Remember that there was once logic that there was no way to communicate with Mars because the flag that would have to be built would be too large. Then we find out more about this universe around us and voiala, radio waves... You will note that I didn't say that we couldn't split it. I said that there are some things that dont split IN NATURE.
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Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 12:38 pm
Scorpo You will note that I didn't say that we couldn't split it. I said that there are some things that dont split IN NATURE. Like what? Because I think I'm not interpreting your statement correctly...
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Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 3:37 pm
If I'm not misinterpreting what you're saying, then you are saying that time is divided into increments. Time is not, in fact, divided into increments. Our conception of time involving increments is simply a system to simplify our lives. I'm not sure if time exists as we know it or not - but I do know that everything is simply a series of events - one thing after another.
-Alezunde
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Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 5:19 pm
Alezunde If I'm not misinterpreting what you're saying, then you are saying that time is divided into increments. Time is not, in fact, divided into increments. Our conception of time involving increments is simply a system to simplify our lives. I'm not sure if time exists as we know it or not - but I do know that everything is simply a series of events - one thing after another. -Alezunde - Yes, this sounds similar if not the same to my view on time. Time to me is an abstract concept that is used to measure change in the physical realm. Without some change there is no time, but as you've seen before I also believe that the everything can be broken down infinitely. That means there has always been something in existence to change, hence time is infinite. At the same time, since time is the physical realm, that would make time travel impossible, well improbable, being as the only way to "travel" it would be to rearrange all the peices into the exact configuration that they were before and going in the direction they were before. Seeing as I also view the universe as infinitely large as well as infinitely small, that would make it infinitely improbably or what would qualify to me as impossible... (Not sure how I got on time travel, just get into too many discussions on it...)
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Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 5:21 pm
So you're saying that you believe in an infinite universe, but not infinite time?
-Alezunde
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Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 12:03 pm
Alezunde So you're saying that you believe in an infinite universe, but not infinite time? -Alezunde I think you have misinterpreted what I meant. Time doesn't exist except as a measure of change IMHO, and on top of that I believe the universe is infinite and has always been changing. Does that explain it better?
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Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 12:41 pm
jayon Alezunde So you're saying that you believe in an infinite universe, but not infinite time? -Alezunde I think you have misinterpreted what I meant. Time doesn't exist except as a measure of change IMHO, and on top of that I believe the universe is infinite and has always been changing. Does that explain it better? By this, would you also be saying that: while the universe has always been changing, time has not? -Alezunde
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