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Posted: Mon Aug 13, 2012 9:45 am
This is somewhat inspired by Facebook Debate Number...Five, I believe. The one with the bloke with the chalkboard listing mostly Levetical laws.
Cherry-picker, vanity Christian, fake Christian, fair weather Christian...I'm pretty sure all of us have at least heard these terms thrown around. Many of you have probably used one or more or them to describe someone, or had someone else use one of those terms to describe you. I know they've all been directed at me somewhat frequently, by many different people.
Now, the latter three I take some exception to. They might even offend me if I'm having a bad day, because they imply that I do not take my faith seriously, which couldn't be further from the truth.
But yes boys and girls, I am a cherry-picker. Blame my Catholic upbringing (where sola scriptura is not supported), blame my bleeding-heart liberal socialist political views, blame the fact that I have first-hand experience translating dead languages and know that it is in some cases impossible to come up with a literal, accurate translation that makes sense and is not disputed by someone else working on their own translation, blame the fact that I'm gay, blame my cat, I don't care. I choose to believe that some of the Bible is figurative and not literal, and also that it needs to be kept in historical context. Society has changed a great deal in over 2000 years and I think that's vital to keep in mind when interpreting the Bible. What was acceptable practises back then may not be so acceptable now. Some things that were relevant then are not relevant now. So yes, I do some cherry-picking based on the reasons listed, as well as others that are escaping my sleep-deprived brain. And is my cherry-picking influenced by my own personal biases and experiences? Of course it is. Not on purpose, of course, but I'm human. It's impossible for me to be completely objective, as it is for every human being.
So yes, I'm a cherry-picker. And you know what? You probably are, too. Every opinion we as human beings have is going to be coloured by our own unique personalities and experiences. I have never encountered, online, offline, or even in my dreams, a person who follows the Bible to a T, or even believes every word of the Bible wholly and literally and completely, because no matter how hard one may try, there is no absolute, universally agreed-upon way of interpreting the Bible. Someone, somewhere, is going to see you as a Cafeteria Christian (hey, I just thought of another thing I've been called!)
Calling someone a "cherry-picker" usually implies that the person in question is arrogant, stubborn, and weak in faith because of their inability to "truly" give themselves over to God. And in some cases that may very well be true, but before making such accusations, I think we all need to take a good hard look at ourselves first.
Anyway, thoughts? Agree or disagree? Why or why not? Have I offended you deeply?
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Posted: Mon Aug 13, 2012 9:39 pm
I have been described by others as a cherry picker. I do take some aspects of the Bible literally and others figuratively. I completely agree that change in society is extremely relevant to the application of the gospel in our live today. There are so many different ways to interpret the Bible, and unless God directly told us which interpretation was correct, there would be no way for us to know how much of the Bible should be stuck to, and how much is out of date for the modern era.
I however, do not see myself as a cherry picker when it comes to interpreting the Bible, because I believe in a modern prophet who receives direct revelation from God that applies to this modern age. I believe some things have changed with time while other commandments stand firm, and I base this not on my own bias, but on what I believe to be the most recent direction from a prophet of God.
Yup, I'm Mormon
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Posted: Tue Aug 14, 2012 1:49 am
Ever since I was a middle schooler, I've held the opinion that even if the bible came from God, it's been in man's hands. And man has free-will, which includes making a bad or wrong decision. So, I wouldn't be surprised if it was altered when it was put together.
Although I think what gets me are the christians that are very much against homosexuality, but at the same time are okay with divorce, and are divorced themselves.
I feel like they would rather focus on flaws that don't belong to them, which is very annoying.
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Posted: Tue Aug 14, 2012 1:46 pm
It is uncool regardless. Doesn't matter if everyone does it. Not saying this to rag on anyone but God doesn't want us to pick and chose what we like while disregarding things that don't agree with our personal opinions. We are all fallible here, but I don't think any excuse would be acceptable to God.
John 14:15 “If you love me, you will keep my commandments.
John 14:21 Whoever has my commands and obeys them, he is the one who loves me. He who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love him and show myself to him."
Sure there are things we don't understand, but we are in a fantastic position with all kinds of knowledge at the tip of our fingers. We are supposed to be set apart from the world, not be affected by political ideas or human philosophies. Who our families are, or what upbringing we have is not valid excuses. We have the Bible as a guide because God knows better. The Bible is both figurative. and literal depending on what parts you read. We can understand the culture and morals of the time the stories, and it is applicable to today. It is all just depends on a willingness to understand and apply. Ideally this is how we are are supposed to be. Yes, we all fail at some points adapting our views to the world, but we should be striving not to. Not brushing our mistakes off and finding excuses to continue in them.
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Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 5:18 pm
Digital Fiend Ever since I was a middle schooler, I've held the opinion that even if the bible came from God, it's been in man's hands. And man has free-will, which includes making a bad or wrong decision. So, I wouldn't be surprised if it was altered when it was put together. Although I think what gets me are the christians that are very much against homosexuality, but at the same time are okay with divorce, and are divorced themselves. I feel like they would rather focus on flaws that don't belong to them, which is very annoying. First off divorce is ok according to scripture by one condition. One of the spouses has to commit adultery for it to lawful acording to God. "All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;" (2 Timothy 3:16) The word inspired in the orginal language means God breathed. It's only used here any when God breathed life into Adam. Thus why some Bibles are called The Living Bible. Now the scripture we have does have flaws due to the translation issues, but the orginal Scripture is perfect. Out of all the mistakes in the Bible not a single one has to do with doctrine. If one denies that it is the same as denying the fact that God breathed life into us for it is the same thing. If you deny parts of it then you must deny it all due to the fact that scripture supports itself in several places.
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Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 6:54 pm
emorhconom esor Digital Fiend Ever since I was a middle schooler, I've held the opinion that even if the bible came from God, it's been in man's hands. And man has free-will, which includes making a bad or wrong decision. So, I wouldn't be surprised if it was altered when it was put together. Although I think what gets me are the christians that are very much against homosexuality, but at the same time are okay with divorce, and are divorced themselves. I feel like they would rather focus on flaws that don't belong to them, which is very annoying. First off divorce is ok according to scripture by one condition. One of the spouses has to commit adultery for it to lawful acording to God. "All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;" (2 Timothy 3:16) The word inspired in the orginal language means God breathed. It's only used here any when God breathed life into Adam. Thus why some Bibles are called The Living Bible. Now the scripture we have does have flaws due to the translation issues, but the orginal Scripture is perfect. Out of all the mistakes in the Bible not a single one has to do with doctrine. If one denies that it is the same as denying the fact that God breathed life into us for it is the same thing. If you deny parts of it then you must deny it all due to the fact that scripture supports itself in several places. All the people I know that are divorced haven't divorced because of that. And most of them are very homophobic.
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Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 8:09 pm
Digital Fiend emorhconom esor Digital Fiend Ever since I was a middle schooler, I've held the opinion that even if the bible came from God, it's been in man's hands. And man has free-will, which includes making a bad or wrong decision. So, I wouldn't be surprised if it was altered when it was put together. Although I think what gets me are the christians that are very much against homosexuality, but at the same time are okay with divorce, and are divorced themselves. I feel like they would rather focus on flaws that don't belong to them, which is very annoying. First off divorce is ok according to scripture by one condition. One of the spouses has to commit adultery for it to lawful acording to God. "All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;" (2 Timothy 3:16) The word inspired in the orginal language means God breathed. It's only used here any when God breathed life into Adam. Thus why some Bibles are called The Living Bible. Now the scripture we have does have flaws due to the translation issues, but the orginal Scripture is perfect. Out of all the mistakes in the Bible not a single one has to do with doctrine. If one denies that it is the same as denying the fact that God breathed life into us for it is the same thing. If you deny parts of it then you must deny it all due to the fact that scripture supports itself in several places. All the people I know that are divorced haven't divorced because of that. And most of them are very homophobic. Stereotyping people isn't cool. Plus the word homophobic is completely misused the way you using it now. To have a phobia one must have an unreasonable fear, when they are around what it is they are afraid of they completely freak out. By misusing that word the way you are it ruins the validity of people that actually have phobias. It's practically like calling someone a retard. I suggest you think before you put labels on people.
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Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 8:14 pm
emorhconom esor Digital Fiend emorhconom esor Digital Fiend Ever since I was a middle schooler, I've held the opinion that even if the bible came from God, it's been in man's hands. And man has free-will, which includes making a bad or wrong decision. So, I wouldn't be surprised if it was altered when it was put together. Although I think what gets me are the christians that are very much against homosexuality, but at the same time are okay with divorce, and are divorced themselves. I feel like they would rather focus on flaws that don't belong to them, which is very annoying. First off divorce is ok according to scripture by one condition. One of the spouses has to commit adultery for it to lawful acording to God. "All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;" (2 Timothy 3:16) The word inspired in the orginal language means God breathed. It's only used here any when God breathed life into Adam. Thus why some Bibles are called The Living Bible. Now the scripture we have does have flaws due to the translation issues, but the orginal Scripture is perfect. Out of all the mistakes in the Bible not a single one has to do with doctrine. If one denies that it is the same as denying the fact that God breathed life into us for it is the same thing. If you deny parts of it then you must deny it all due to the fact that scripture supports itself in several places. All the people I know that are divorced haven't divorced because of that. And most of them are very homophobic. Stereotyping people isn't cool. Plus the word homophobic is completely misused the way you using it now. To have a phobia one must have an unreasonable fear, when they are around what it is they are afraid of they completely freak out. By misusing that word the way you are it ruins the validity of people that actually have phobias. It's practically like calling someone a retard. I suggest you think before you put labels on people. Fine. Gaters. I used the popular term that everyone else uses. They are against the act of being gay and having gay love. They preach against it and some of them even have the audacity to stoop so low as to call them names and spout hate against them. I'm talking about people I know in real life. They claim they are people of God, yet have divorced without adultery being the cause and are disgusting when it comes to homosexuals. I'm not grouping anyone together. If you want, I can be more specific. It bothers me when people who claim to be Christian spout ugliness when it comes to gay people, yet they themselves take no fault in their own sins, the most common ones that are around me being divorced.
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Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 8:22 pm
Digital Fiend emorhconom esor Digital Fiend emorhconom esor Digital Fiend Ever since I was a middle schooler, I've held the opinion that even if the bible came from God, it's been in man's hands. And man has free-will, which includes making a bad or wrong decision. So, I wouldn't be surprised if it was altered when it was put together. Although I think what gets me are the christians that are very much against homosexuality, but at the same time are okay with divorce, and are divorced themselves. I feel like they would rather focus on flaws that don't belong to them, which is very annoying. First off divorce is ok according to scripture by one condition. One of the spouses has to commit adultery for it to lawful acording to God. "All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;" (2 Timothy 3:16) The word inspired in the orginal language means God breathed. It's only used here any when God breathed life into Adam. Thus why some Bibles are called The Living Bible. Now the scripture we have does have flaws due to the translation issues, but the orginal Scripture is perfect. Out of all the mistakes in the Bible not a single one has to do with doctrine. If one denies that it is the same as denying the fact that God breathed life into us for it is the same thing. If you deny parts of it then you must deny it all due to the fact that scripture supports itself in several places. All the people I know that are divorced haven't divorced because of that. And most of them are very homophobic. Stereotyping people isn't cool. Plus the word homophobic is completely misused the way you using it now. To have a phobia one must have an unreasonable fear, when they are around what it is they are afraid of they completely freak out. By misusing that word the way you are it ruins the validity of people that actually have phobias. It's practically like calling someone a retard. I suggest you think before you put labels on people. Fine. Gay haters. I use the popular term that everyone else uses. They are against the act of being gay and having gay love. They preach against it and some of them even have the audacity to stoop so low as to call them names and spout hate against them. I'm talking about people I know in real life. They claim they are people of God, yet have divorced without adultery being the cause and are disgusting when it comes to homosexuals. I'm not grouping anyone together. If you want, I can be more specific. It bothers me when people who claim to be Christian spout ugliness when it comes to gay people, yet they themselves take no fault in their own sins, the most common ones that are around me being divorced. Just because someone doesn't agree with something doesn't mean they hate it. Anyways, you say they spout ugliness but you are saying hateful things about them righ now. So, please think about what you are doing before you point fingers. "Why do you look at the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?" Luke 6:41
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Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2012 3:07 am
I don't think this has anything to do with "cherry picking" but maybe it does. I was raised a southern Baptist and converted to Catholicism. Either way I'm a cherry picker at times. Back in the day, as a protestant I was almost "taught " to be a cherry picker without reading what came before or after particuar verses. I have since learned to get the whole story before I go and make a decision on what this verse or that verse actually means.
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Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 8:33 am
I would think this term probably more closely applies to people who intentionally use selected verses and scriptures to bolster their own personal views and agendas. If someone is citing scripture out of innocent faith or honest resolve, I don't think that really makes them all that guilty.
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Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2012 10:16 pm
Garland-Green It is uncool regardless. Doesn't matter if everyone does it. Not saying this to rag on anyone but God doesn't want us to pick and chose what we like while disregarding things that don't agree with our personal opinions. We are all fallible here, but I don't think any excuse would be acceptable to God. John 14:15 “If you love me, you will keep my commandments. John 14:21 Whoever has my commands and obeys them, he is the one who loves me. He who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love him and show myself to him." Sure there are things we don't understand, but we are in a fantastic position with all kinds of knowledge at the tip of our fingers. We are supposed to be set apart from the world, not be affected by political ideas or human philosophies. Who our families are, or what upbringing we have is not valid excuses. We have the Bible as a guide because God knows better. The Bible is both figurative. and literal depending on what parts you read. We can understand the culture and morals of the time the stories, and it is applicable to today. It is all just depends on a willingness to understand and apply. Ideally this is how we are are supposed to be. Yes, we all fail at some points adapting our views to the world, but we should be striving not to. Not brushing our mistakes off and finding excuses to continue in them. God is my strength... "Psalms 28:7"
Thank for your post. I agree with this!
...God is my joy "Psalms 96:11-13"
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Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:12 am
I don't usually pick cherries, but when I do,
I make sure I pick the best ones ;}
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Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 11:08 am
Garland-Green It is uncool regardless. Doesn't matter if everyone does it. Not saying this to rag on anyone but God doesn't want us to pick and chose what we like while disregarding things that don't agree with our personal opinions. We are all fallible here, but I don't think any excuse would be acceptable to God. John 14:15 “If you love me, you will keep my commandments. John 14:21 Whoever has my commands and obeys them, he is the one who loves me. He who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love him and show myself to him." Sure there are things we don't understand, but we are in a fantastic position with all kinds of knowledge at the tip of our fingers. We are supposed to be set apart from the world, not be affected by political ideas or human philosophies. Who our families are, or what upbringing we have is not valid excuses. We have the Bible as a guide because God knows better. The Bible is both figurative. and literal depending on what parts you read. We can understand the culture and morals of the time the stories, and it is applicable to today. It is all just depends on a willingness to understand and apply. Ideally this is how we are are supposed to be. Yes, we all fail at some points adapting our views to the world, but we should be striving not to. Not brushing our mistakes off and finding excuses to continue in them. My purpose here wasn't to make any claims about the rightness or wrongness, or to attempt to make excuses to justify the behaviour, but rather to simply point out that very few people are as righteous as they claim to be. In order for any of us to better ourselves, both as Christians and as just decent human beings, we first have to be aware of our own fallibilitiess.
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Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 2:29 pm
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