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Hebraic Face Veil?

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Call Me Apple

Sparkly Shapeshifter

PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 9:58 am


Found this video: http://youtu.be/cwYwMDb8rXY

It shows supposed Jewish women wearing the Hebraic veil and face veil. Then again these women could easily be Muslims.

I've noticed that most of these women are African, would this be a modern renewal in Africa of Jewish women?
Is the veil compatible with today's Jewish women in Europe, Canada and Israel?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 2:07 pm


Charedi women sometimes wear face veils while in the presence of their husbands who are davening, or if they are etc. They're used for a different purpose than for muslims.

shmully


Call Me Apple

Sparkly Shapeshifter

PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 5:39 pm


catastrofie
Charedi women sometimes wear face veils while in the presence of their husbands who are davening, or if they are etc. They're used for a different purpose than for muslims.


So they dont just go wear them in public?
What is the purpose exactly? I mean i get they use them if their husband or they are davening...is it for modesty? Like to disconnect worldly desires from religious fulfillment?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 10:10 am


Call Me Apple
catastrofie
Charedi women sometimes wear face veils while in the presence of their husbands who are davening, or if they are etc. They're used for a different purpose than for muslims.


So they dont just go wear them in public?
What is the purpose exactly? I mean i get they use them if their husband or they are davening...is it for modesty? Like to disconnect worldly desires from religious fulfillment?


As far as I know muslim women wear them because their husbands or the government want to regard them as second class citizens, correct me if i'm wrong, but they're basically submitting the women and putting them under a type of modesty suppression. For Jews, it wouldn't be EXACLY to disconnect wordily desires from religious fulfillment more so than it would be to fulfill the mitzvah of guarding your eyes, meaning not being tempted by your nefesh hebahames (animal soul) to look off at a billboard or inappropriately dressed women or man and get tempted. If I am a very religious women used to things that are only G-dly, I would not like to walk around and see these things, as much as anyone else in their shoes wouldn't. This is the same reason some men who wear black hats, myself included, when in the streets sometimes pull them down to eye level to guard from looking anywhere not in your few foot proximity. If your a yeshiva bochur and your studying gamara all day and your a good Jew, you dont want to go out into the streets and suddenly see something that may lead you to sin, i've had problems with this many times and so have the men I know.

shmully


Divash
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 4:15 pm


catastrofie
As far as I know muslim women wear them because their husbands or the government want to regard them as second class citizens, correct me if i'm wrong, but they're basically submitting the women and putting them under a type of modesty suppression.


Baruch Hashem, I happen to know that you are very mistaken. The purposes of a veil for a Muslima are the same as the purpose of the rest of her clothing, which is hajaba (modest), and also the same as the purposes for the tzanuah (modest) clothing of a Jewish woman:

(1) It identifies her as belonging to her faith and people;
(2) It shields her from the prying eyes of those who would objectify her;
(3) It marks her as a woman of high status;
(4) It allows her to demonstrate her identity through her actions and words rather than through her physical appearance;
(5) It protects her from the harsh sun (far more relevant in the Middle East, the birthplace of both Judaism and Islam, than in the colder places to which both have spread);
(6) It is more likely that she will be unmolested by those who would seek to subjugate her to their own base desires, because her beauty is not on display;

A Muslima's modest clothing, just like a Jewess's modest clothing, has actually NOTHING to do with denigration, subjugation, or turning a woman into a second-class citizen or an object, but exactly the reverse!

catastrofie
If your a yeshiva bochur and your studying gamara all day and your a good Jew, you dont want to go out into the streets and suddenly see something that may lead you to sin, i've had problems with this many times and so have the men I know.


If you don't like the way a woman looks, look at your shoes or stick your nose in a Chumash. It's YOUR problem as a man, not OURS. Our modesty is for our own benefit. Hashem desires that you learn self-control, not that we imprison ourselves. I say this as a person who chooses to elevate herself, in part, through modest clothing and covered hair: This is for demonstrating modesty before G*D, not before you. The fact that you benefit from it is entirely beside the point. Even if there were no men left on earth, a tzanuah (modest woman) would still be covered -- just as we are at all-woman retreats, vacations, and visits with female-only groups of friends!
PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2011 7:13 pm


Divash
catastrofie
As far as I know muslim women wear them because their husbands or the government want to regard them as second class citizens, correct me if i'm wrong, but they're basically submitting the women and putting them under a type of modesty suppression.


Baruch Hashem, I happen to know that you are very mistaken. The purposes of a veil for a Muslima are the same as the purpose of the rest of her clothing, which is hajaba (modest), and also the same as the purposes for the tzanuah (modest) clothing of a Jewish woman:

(1) It identifies her as belonging to her faith and people;
(2) It shields her from the prying eyes of those who would objectify her;
(3) It marks her as a woman of high status;
(4) It allows her to demonstrate her identity through her actions and words rather than through her physical appearance;
(5) It protects her from the harsh sun (far more relevant in the Middle East, the birthplace of both Judaism and Islam, than in the colder places to which both have spread);
(6) It is more likely that she will be unmolested by those who would seek to subjugate her to their own base desires, because her beauty is not on display;

A Muslima's modest clothing, just like a Jewess's modest clothing, has actually NOTHING to do with denigration, subjugation, or turning a woman into a second-class citizen or an object, but exactly the reverse!

catastrofie
If your a yeshiva bochur and your studying gamara all day and your a good Jew, you dont want to go out into the streets and suddenly see something that may lead you to sin, i've had problems with this many times and so have the men I know.


If you don't like the way a woman looks, look at your shoes or stick your nose in a Chumash. It's YOUR problem as a man, not OURS. Our modesty is for our own benefit. Hashem desires that you learn self-control, not that we imprison ourselves. I say this as a person who chooses to elevate herself, in part, through modest clothing and covered hair: This is for demonstrating modesty before G*D, not before you. The fact that you benefit from it is entirely beside the point. Even if there were no men left on earth, a tzanuah (modest woman) would still be covered -- just as we are at all-woman retreats, vacations, and visits with female-only groups of friends!


Thank you for correcting me.

About the second half, I think you mis-understood what I was referring to. I was not referring to Jewish women dressed modestly, with hair covered etc, I was referring to non-jews and non-religious jews that dress provocatively and may lead them to think thoughts they would rather do without. I do usually look at my shoes or stick my head in a Chumash BH. It is considered the sin of adultery for a man to look at a married women's hair as much as it is to hear her sing, since this both is considered "nakedness".

shmully


Call Me Apple

Sparkly Shapeshifter

PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:12 pm


Divash


We should be interfaith BFF's xd
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