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Fresh Porn

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 19, 2011 12:23 pm


Creating this thread for the sole purpose of generating input on sideboard cards and information on how to correctly use your side board. what cards to use against what deck, how to use them will also be given

EDIT: Please note suggestions ARE NOT ordered in anyway of preference, just listed.

EDIT2: This document is meant to be everliving constantly updated.

Side Board Categories:

Generic(General Side Board Cards):

*Starlight Road: Everyone hates a multi card Destroyer. Why not negate their effect and get some stardust McLovin

*Skill Drain: I'll pay a grand to Negate annoying effects > razz

*Compulsory Evacuation Device: Goodbye Stardust you rat b*****d, bounce back to the damn extra deck and stay there dammit!

*Threatening Roar: Best way to avoid getting your arse gang banged. Also Cuts Glads though not so hard

*Gorz the Emissary of Darkness: With the whole Field Wiping and Heavy hitter / Otking going on nowadays, it's nice to have this guy handy to say BAMF.

*Battle Fader: Just as good as Gorz except no beat stick-ability

*legendary Jiu Jitsu Master: 1800 Defender that bounces monster that attacks it to the top of the deck.

*Prohibition: Target a key mass played card to limit opponents playing options (Not reccomended but good to have for the surprise against minor decks)

*Thunder King Rai-Oh: Can be tributed to negate a Special Summon. Prevents opponent from adding cards to hand outside of drawing them such as sangan.

*Doomcaliber Knight: Must be tributed to negate the activation of an opponent's Monster effect and destroy it.


Against Machina:

*System Down: pay 1 grand LP. RFP all Machines on your opponents side of the field and graveyard. Epic

*Chimeratech Fortress Dragon: Use to clear the field of monsters from opponent by securing your own Cyber Dragon's Special Summon to use their monsters to Special Summon Chimeratech Fortress Dragon from your extra deck using their monsters to make it, clearing their monsters and giving you a beater to use.

*D.D. Crow: Discard to target Machina Fortress, although won't stop it's summoning you can hit it if it's used for a cost for another or after you get it in the grave. Target a key monster to cut off Pot of Avarice by removing a target so that it cannot resolve

*Crevice in the Different Dimension: Does same thing as D.D. Crow only hits 2 monsters of the same attribute with the same limitation.

*Cyber Dragon: Baits responses and gets out Chimeratech Fortress.

*Doomcaliber Knight: Stops a gadget and beats down

*Thunder King Rai-Oh: Stomps Gadgets, Fortress, oh the love.

Against Gravekeepers:

*Closed Forest: Takes Necrovalley out of the scene. Cannot be overlayed by another Field spell and opponent must wait a turn before they may play another Necro valley.

*Shadow Imprisoning Mirror: Negates Dark Monster Effects

*Cyber Dragon: Beater and baits

*Nobleman of Crossout: Screw you Spy/Recruiter/Guard

Against Blackwings:

*Trap Stun / Royal Decree: because everyone hates that damned Icarus Attack

*Consecrated Light: Shuts down Dark Monster attacks as well as preventing Dark Monster Normal and Special Summons. Setting and Flipping Dark Monsters still works though

* Blackwing - Sirroco the Dawn: Stomps it's own kind and boosts itself from ALL blackwings on field for the stomp. Neat huh?

Against Debris Plants / Quickdraw Variants:

*Summon Limit: Neither player can summon more than twice per turn. Screws over opponent before they spam the synchros.

*Different Dimension Ground: RFP during turn it's activated. Surprise Surprise Surprise >;3

*D.D. Fissure / Macro Cosmos: Removes graveyard from playability forcing the opponent to be severely handicapped playing around it, waste resources to stop it

*D.D. Crow: Discard to target Dandylion when debris Dragon targets the monster. Target a key monster to cut off Pot of Avarice by removing a target so that it cannot resolve.

*Banisher of the Radiance: Removes the graveyard from the equation.

Against Six Samurai:

*Puppet Plant: Discard it to Nab one of their warrior/spellcaster monsters for the turn

*Warrior Elimination: Nukes all Warriors on the field

*Gozen Match: Can only control 1 Attribute of Monster severely limiting Six Samurai Useage and spam.

*Threatening Roar: stops an otk and buys time for a comeback

*Kinetic Soldier: Pumps up against Warriors. Good beatstick

*Chain Disappearance: Hits 1000 atk or less monster(s) when it's summoned, RFP it and all copies in their hand and deck.

*Summon Limit: Neither player can summon more than two times per turn. If played right can stop their comboing for a turn depending on your set up. Not very good against them but can hurt.

Against Glad Beasts:

*Summon Limit: Played right they can't combo out to fetch bestiari

*Corridor of Agony: Straight up F-U to Glads

*Swallow Flip: Takes out their monsters when special summoned.

*Mirror Of Oaths: Destroys a monster special summoned from the deck, and allows you to draw one card. Does not negate the effect so not as good as swallow flip.

*Thunder King Rai-Oh: nut shots em.

*Doomcaliber Knight: Does what Rai-oh can't

Against Monarchs:

*Pulling the Rug: Great as it makes them waste the tribute and then kills them.

*Mask of Restrict: prevents all tributes, completely shutting down monarchs.

Against X Sabers / XX Sabers:

*Gottoms Emergency Call: Because taking their targets for their Gottoms Emergency Call is just damn funny as well as breaking their faultroll useage and stealing their tuners

*Thunder King Rai-Oh: Stops Darksoul Search and pops a Special Summon

*Doomcaliber Knight: Painus to their a**s

*Banisher of Radiance: Cuts out X Saber grave abuse.

*Nobleman of Crossout: Gotta love that RFP loving

*Spirit Reaper / Marshmallon: because I have yet to see an X saber that pops a monster. Great stall until the Saber hole hits.

*Summon Limit: Neither player can summon more than twice per turn. Severely shats on X-Sabers

Against Remove From Play Decks(aka D.D. / Macro Decks):

*Imperial Iron Wall: Stops all RFP but easily cut out of the equation

*Necrovalley: cuts out removing from play as well as locking some grave useage.
PostPosted: Wed Jan 19, 2011 1:18 pm


I commend this thread and will poke at your choices in a second. In the mean time, I'll post what I posted on YFaG.
Gravekeeper's - How to Beat Them
Closed Forest
First and foremost, it's obvious that the main amount of control that GKs hold is their field card, Necrovalley. Almost all competitive decks focus on using recursion effects to synchro swarm and beat face and Necrovalley obliterates it.

Of course, that's not all Necrovalley gives the GK deck. It gives them a plethora of 2k+ walls and attackers, a deck thin (Commandant), enables Assailant's ability AND allows Royal Tribute.

Needless to say, Necrovalley is a key part of their strength. So, shutting that down would be good... no?

Well, the typical sidedeck against them is two Mysticals, Dust Tornados, blah de blah. Basically MT destruction. Well, this isn't going to help against the Malefic Stardust Dragon or the sided third Necrovalley. This also isn't exactly the fastest answer. You have to draw that destruction.

This brings us to Closed Forest. A field spell out of Duelist Transer, the new Wii game. Playing it gets around Malefic Stardust Dragon and forces GKs to use a Descendant tribute just to destroy a turn BEFORE they use Necrovalley again.

My suggestion, if you choose to go this route in your counter-GK design is to devote three slots in your sidedeck to:
2 Closed Forest
1 Terraforming

Shadow-Imprisoning Mirror
This should be a no brainer. With the exception of their ridiculous attack and Commandant (being Earth), the GK deck is completely dependent on their abilities. Recruiter and Spy to continue to self replace, Descendant to clear the opponent's defenses and Assailant to take down the bigger monsters without needing another GK for Descendant's ability.

Shadow Imprisoning Mirror shuts down the deck pretty effectively. Obviously though, don't depend on this if you run darks yourself. Also, a good GK player will side two MSTs. They'll be running triple Duality which makes the MSTs very accessible. I'll get into more weaknesses and a suggestion at the end of my next section...

Skill Drain
This thing is killer. Unlike Mirror it won't stop Recruiter BUT it does shut everything else down. I had this sided against me when my opponent was using Blackwings. It devastated me. I wasn't able to draw an out to it at all.

Which brings up my next point, the outs to both Skill Drain and Shadow-Imprisoning Mirror.

As already mentioned, a good GK player will side double MST in. But there are two other tricks you need to watch out for when trying to counter GKs with either Skill Drain or Shadow-Imprisoning Mirror. Those are their double or triple Book of Moons and their Compulsory Evacuation Device. Given that both Skill Drain needs to have the monster face-up on the field to stop it and Shadow-Imprisoning Mirror needs to be able to identify the attribute of the monster activating the effect, both Book and Compulsory will dodge their negation effects.

If you choose to side these, which I would not (I'm a very big fan of Forest), I would run two of one or the other, depending on YOUR decklist.

Nobleman of Crossout
This is a typical response to Gravekeeper's. People see Spies and Recruiters and figure the deck will constantly set monsters to feed itself. So, they figure, side Nobleman of Crossout. This is a good choice but, you have to understand that GKs will side My Body as a Shield in and probably a Spy and Recruiter out as a counter to the Nobleman side in.

It's a good counter but I would not suggest siding two of the things in against GKs or in general. I prefer a one of for general siding.

Thunder King Rai-Oh and Doomcaliber Knight
Both of these are VERY good sidedeck choices in general. I side them when I'm playing GKs and basically when I'm playing -anything- these days. It's a simple matter of knowing when your opponent will use X card in their deck that each of these STUN elements can counter.

Against GKs, Rai-Oh will stop the Commandants, Pots of Duality and Recruiters. DCK will hit basically everything else and will force GKs to attack before activating effects to try to push you down.

Both of these creatures, with 1900 attack, are no joking matter to GK players. While DCK might be easier to play around on turn one (an extra Commandant, a Recruiter suicide, whatever else), Thunder King on turn one can be crushing to the GK player.

I would side both of them at two in your sidedeck NOT just to counter Gravekeeper's, they are amazing universally.

Consecrated Light
I cannot stress how much of a bad idea siding this card is. Against GKs it's really just not worth the slots. A good GK player will see the possibility coming and will have a Descendant or Commandant in reserve to obliterate it. It really does nothing but keep them from attacking for a turn or two.

Terrible, terrible choice, do not run it.

Dark World Monsters
This is a VERY tempting choice. They counter, hard, the Royal Tribute that devastates so many players in game one. Most GK players I've talked to haven't even thought of these things yet, it's a legitimate thing to be feared.

However, as more people catch on, GK players, universally, will start siding out the Royal Tributes more and more. Currently, I side out of one every game. Duels two and three I usually only have two in the maindeck. Soon that will be lowered to one. Why?

It's not necessary for GKs to win. It's VERY good, no doubt but, if you do side into DW monsters and I side out of Royal Tributes, they're more likely to stay dead in hand than do anything else. Not one of the DW monsters can stand up to a Necrovalley'd Assailant and all of them are just beaters if their effects are not activated.

I wouldn't side them unless you know the GK player in your meta is new to the deck and hasn't thought about the risk yet.

Cyber Dragon
While it has the same risk to it of Assailant that the DW monsters do, Cyber Dragon is ridiculously a better choice.

A self summoning 2100 beater is nothing to scoff at for a GK player. It will require a Descendant, a Commandant, or an Assailant to take down if it hits the field and lives through its summon. Descendant, obviously, requires another monster which is easy with Spy (I know you're thinking this already). That's why you wait on the Cyber Dragon play. Don't just throw it out there willy nilly if you can't first handle the facedown monster the have or can't prove it's not a Spy. Otherwise Cyber Dragon just becomes a one for one that dealt you 400 damage and thinned the GK deck.

This isn't to say that summoning Cyber Dragon right away is bad.

After Necrovalley, a GK player relies on the utter control they have with their double or triple Solemn Warnings, the Judgment, the Books of Moon, and the Bottomlesses. Anything their 2k beaters can't handle forces the activation of one of the aforementioned cards. Cyber Dragon is one of those things. It's a very good baiter for the GK prime trap line up. It does this job better than any other monster. In fact, it's so good at this, it is universally good as a side against other decks with heavy trap control.

Because of this, I highly recommend siding two of these buggers.

Delta Four Sicilian
Captain


Delta Four Sicilian
Captain

PostPosted: Wed Jan 19, 2011 1:29 pm


Fresh Porn
Generic(General Side Board Cards):
*Prohibition: Target a key mass played card to limit opponents playing options

*Thunder King Rai-Oh: Can be tributed to negate a Special Summon. Prevents opponent from adding cards to hand outside of drawing them such as sangan.

*Doomcaliber Knight: Must be tributed to negate the activation of an opponent's Monster effect and destroy it.
Agree to an extent. I do NOT agree with Prohibition. It's only an inhibitor that's easier to take down than Consecrated Light AND only stops one item. Most decks these days can play around the use of Prohibition or play through it. I wouldn't side Prohibition this format, though I do suggest keeping a playset.

Fresh Pron
Against Machina:
*Prohibition: Target Machina Gearframe / Machina Fortress / Solidarity

*Chimeratech Fortress Dragon: Use to clear the field of monsters from opponent by securing your own Cyber Dragon's Special Summon to use their monsters to Special Summon Chimeratech Fortress Dragon from your extra deck using their monsters to make it, clearing their monsters and giving you a beater to use.

*D.D. Crow: Discard to target Machina Fortress. Target a key monster to cut off Pot of Avarice by removing a target so that it cannot resolve.
First, Crow. I'll make a point to say that Crow will not work during Fortress' summon. It doesn't make a chain, it simply happens. Otherwise, Chimeratech, Thunder King Rai-Oh, Doomcaliber Knight, and Cyber Dragons have all worked beautifully for me. Prohibition, I still dislike it.

Fresh Porn
Against Gravekeepers:

*Prohibition: Target Descendant / Recruite

*Closed Forest: Takes Necrovalley out of the scene. Cannot be overlayed by another Field spell and opponent must wait a turn before they may play another Necro valley.

*Shadow Imprisoning Mirror: Negates Dark Monster Effects
See above.

Fresh Porn
Against Blackwings:

*Shadow Imprisoning Mirror: Negates all Dark Monster Effects

*Consecrated Light: Shuts down Dark Monster attacks as well as preventing Dark Monster Normal and Special Summons. Setting and Flipping Dark Monsters still works
Shadow Imprisoning Mirror is the biggest mistake on your list. Blackwings have consistently sided Skill Drain since their release. It's not exactly the most popular choice but it is proven to work and doesn't touch them. In general though, Trap Stuns are good to shut down the Icarus. Icarus is your BIGGEST threat, never forget it.

Fresh Porn
Against Debris Plants:
*D.D. Fissure / Macro Cosmos: Removes graveyard from playability forcing the opponent to be severely handicapped playing around it, waste resources to stop it

*D.D. Crow: Discard to target Dandylion when debris Dragon targets the monster. Target a key monster to cut off Pot of Avarice by removing a target so that it cannot resolve.

*Banisher of the Radiance: Removes the graveyard from the equation.
Crow is good. Total RFG engines I dislike unless your own deck can play around them with ease. Different Dimension Ground isn't too bad. Banisher of Radiance I adore though. Why that over Macro/Fissure? It has legs and forces the activation of things like Warning, BTH, etc like Cyber Dragon does.

Fresh Porn
Against Quickdraw Variants : :
*D.D. Fissure / Macros Cosmos: Removes graveyard from playability forcing the opponent to be severely handicapped playing around it, waste resources to stop it


*D.D. Crow: Discard to target Dandylion when debris Dragon targets the monster. Target a key monster to cut off Pot of Avarice by removing a target so that it cannot resolve

*Banisher of the Radiance: Cuts off Graveyard
Same thing as Plants as they are, basically, the same deck.

Fresh Porn
Against Six Samurai:

*Gozen Match: Can only control 1 Attribute of Monster severely limiting Six Samurai Useage and spam.
Threatening Roar? Puppet Plant? Chain Disappearance? Kinetic Soldier? There are plenty more options out there.

Fresh Porn
Against Glad Beasts:

*Corridor of Agony: Straight up F-U to Glads

*Swallow Flip: Takes out their monsters when special summoned. Generic enough to hurt X-Sabers as well.

*Mirror Of Oaths: Destroys a monster special summoned from the deck, and allows you to draw one card. Does not negate the effect so not as good as swallow flip.
Plus the generals, yes.

Fresh Porn
Against Monarchs:

*Pulling the Rug: Great as it makes them waste the tribute and then kills them. Generic enough to stop Boggart Knight from xx-sabers.

*Mask of Restrict: prevents all tributes, completely shutting down monarchs.
Yes.

Fresh Porn
Against X Sabers / XX Sabers:

*Gottoms Emergency Call: Because taking their targets for their Gottoms Emergency Call is just damn funny as well as breaking their faultroll useage and stealing their tuners

*Thunder King Rai-Oh: Stops Darksoul Search and pops a Special Summon

*Swallow Flip: Hits a couple monsters and their Synchros
DCK, Nobleman of Crossout, Banisher of Radiance? Swallow Flip ONLY hits Hyunlei.
PostPosted: Wed Jan 19, 2011 1:40 pm


well the thread is meant to be ever living so Suggestions are much loved for updating. will do the editing now

Fresh Porn

Generous Conventioneer

7,850 Points
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Fresh Porn

Generous Conventioneer

7,850 Points
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 19, 2011 2:07 pm


Fresh Porn
well the thread is meant to be ever living so Suggestions are much loved for updating. will do the editing now

Done Updating from Delta's suggestions
Have to admit I'm the only person in my area who sides prohibition. Fun as s**t to play it and watch their face as they swear when I hit a key card and they have no answer to it at the time.
PostPosted: Wed Jan 19, 2011 8:44 pm


Usually decks that remove from play hurt me pretty bad, so as a rule i like to have two Imperial Iron Wall's side decked. Usually i like to have a couple of blockers on the side as well but you already covered that

shadowkingofgames


Lifisali

PostPosted: Wed Jan 19, 2011 9:59 pm


Poison of the Old Man. For when you're opponent is an a** and forces your match into time. pirate
PostPosted: Wed Jan 19, 2011 11:07 pm


shadowkingofgames
Usually decks that remove from play hurt me pretty bad, so as a rule i like to have two Imperial Iron Wall's side decked. Usually i like to have a couple of blockers on the side as well but you already covered that
What deck do you run? Imperial Iron Wall is too inconsistent :v

Delta Four Sicilian
Captain


shadowkingofgames

PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:18 am


Delta Four Sicilian
shadowkingofgames
Usually decks that remove from play hurt me pretty bad, so as a rule i like to have two Imperial Iron Wall's side decked. Usually i like to have a couple of blockers on the side as well but you already covered that
What deck do you run? Imperial Iron Wall is too inconsistent :v

I'm working on a deck right now, but i only have about half the cards, i'll post it in the deck forum
PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:50 am


Although Slow, End Of Anubis also says ******** you macro but Necrovalley does the job the same way and allows you to use in grave activated effects along with Kycoo the Ghost Destroyer if memory serves

Fresh Porn

Generous Conventioneer

7,850 Points
  • Tycoon 200
  • Money Never Sleeps 200
  • Conventioneer 300

Fresh Porn

Generous Conventioneer

7,850 Points
  • Tycoon 200
  • Money Never Sleeps 200
  • Conventioneer 300
PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 8:45 am


hmm, tottally blew me mind
Need Anti RFP, Suggestions?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 9:04 am


Fresh Porn
hmm, tottally blew me mind
Need Anti RFP, Suggestions?


Imperial Iron Wall- Stops cards from being removed.

RftDD-Half LP to bring back all the monsters your opponent removed for big time payback

Shrink- to take care of Gran Maju de Eiza and other cards who power up based on RFP cards (cuts atk to 0)

Mostly just destruct cards. Most RFP cards have to remain face up. Destroy them and there goes your Problem.

Aka_Saiyaku

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Fresh Porn

Generous Conventioneer

7,850 Points
  • Tycoon 200
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  • Conventioneer 300
PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 10:00 am


Updated
PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 2:30 pm


Aka_Saiyaku
Fresh Porn
hmm, tottally blew me mind
Need Anti RFP, Suggestions?


Imperial Iron Wall- Stops cards from being removed.

RftDD-Half LP to bring back all the monsters your opponent removed for big time payback

Shrink- to take care of Gran Maju de Eiza and other cards who power up based on RFP cards (cuts atk to 0)

Mostly just destruct cards. Most RFP cards have to remain face up. Destroy them and there goes your Problem.
Double Mystical, Fairy Winds, etc.

Shouldn't be too much of an issue for most mainstream decks.

Delta Four Sicilian
Captain


Lifisali

PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 3:10 pm


Lifisali
Poison of the Old Man. For when you're opponent is an a** and forces your match into time. pirate

ninja
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