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kenjiro yume
Crew

PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 5:26 am


So this is a new topic for the specific purpose of teaching our fellow members some important lessons. Sure, we all love throwing down our favorite replays of us owning our opponents in league games, but if we post replays of our us playing against our very own, won't we be that much more able to help our fellows grow in skill and confidence? So the idea behind this topic is to post replays of us playing against our own group and the winner doing a write-up of the game, complete with how our opponent could have beaten us.

I take pride in this guild as a place where we can sacrifice our own strategies and builds (because others can always study our replays to see how we play) in order to help improve the group as a whole.

So that being said, I'd like to add that I am not a competitive player. Sure, the game is fun, and more so the higher skill you gain, but the most fun I've had is helping others get better and watching them reach the same level as myself (mid platinum, which is lame to them diamond proz0rz, but it's okay). So I'd like to use this thread to post some replays I've played vs our other members and explain how they can beat me.

Sounds like a solid plan to me, but then again, I often come up with ideas that I think are amazing and they turn out to be not so great at all. I hope this catches on, because this has the potential to be a very helpful guide in the replays forum.

Note: if I or anyone posts a replay that one of our players does not want shown, I will delete that post as soon as possible. I don't intend to step over any bounds of privacy here; the only goal is growth and improvement. Also, after much consideration, I decided to put this in the Strategy section rather than the replay section. Possibly just because of the reasoning behind the posting of the replays. The main point isn't the replay but the discussion and commentary behind it.
PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 5:30 am


http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=174710

Embedded: User Image - Blocked by "Display Image" Settings. Click to show.

The game starts off fairly normal. I start in the 12 O'clock position and DarekKhort in the 6. Darek uses a 4-2 split, and I use my normal 3-3. If there are any new players out there, that means that he selected 4 workers and ordered them to mine first, transitioning to the last two miners and ordering them to a new mineral patch next, while I grabbed three first and the other three second. I'd also like to note that Darek uses the CORRECT method of queuing his first worker before he starts his existing workers mining. This method only requires two quick hotkeys before he starts mining with his first few SCVs, which means his first 50 minerals are used before he starts to mine more. A good habit for any player to be in.

I choose the normal scouting path on Lost Temple, which for Zerg is to send the Overlord to the nearest spawn point. Unfortunately for me, he isn't there, which means the Zerg scouting will generally come later than the Terran's. (Note: Darek seems to be thrown off from the Faster speed of gameplay, so any minor early game mistakes should be completely forgiven in this case. However, anyone who does league play should be practicing on the Faster game setting).

Khort scouts to the 3 O'clock position first, barely missing my scouting overlord. If he had seen it, he would have instantly known what position I had started in. From there he sends his SCV towards the 9 O'clock main, seeing my OL for only a brief moment, which is an understandable miss. The only way to save that would have been to keep a keen eye on the minimap.

Meanwhile, I've just made my first expansion on a 15 drone count, before my spawning pool. At 16 my SP goes down, and Kurt starts to build an Orbital Command on 15. My drone manages to get inside his base after scouting directly to the 6 O'clock position, but I try, and fail, to steal his gas and my scout is destroyed. This gives him the scouting advantage, especially considering my late Pool. And here is my first concern regarding Darek's play. He pulls his scout back to his own base to mine some more when he could have stayed in my base longer. Now granted, running my first OL right into his Marines was a stupid move (as seen in the in-game text), but he still would have gained more sight from staying in my base longer with that first scouting SCV.

And here the first major Zerg mistake is noticed. I had totally forgotten about Vespene Gas, and while waiting to make my Baneling Nest, I had made two queens but ignored the Geysers. Big mistake on my part. The best thing that Darek could have done would have been to put early pressure on my natural expansion here. I had my queens, but my Spine Crawlers were only just started, and he had four Marines. Possibly enough to force me to make zerglings and thus waste minerals on less economic units. Meanwhile, at around the 6 minute mark, he creates his first Starport and I finally get around to making my Baneling nest.

Now, at around 6:30 you notice I had a more econ-centric build, with about 25 drones, whereas he had 20 SCVs and a MULE. I also had a good defense of Spines with 10 zerglings. He only has 6 Marines so far, but the potential of Banshees soon as well as Hellions with the thermal upgrade.

At 7:40 Darek has the stim upgrades being researched as well as Siege tech, and a superior army composition. But I have a large advantage with the worker amount and economy. 4 banelings and 6 zerglings are pretty close to 8 Marines, 1 Marauder, and a tank in strength. But the econ advantage remains, with the Z at 49/60 supply and T at 34/35. Here, the best bet for Terran is to move out and put some pressure on the Zerg. Once siege and stim are finished, there can be a temporary contain put on Z easily.

At 9:30, however, Darek puts his army in Medivacs and goes for drop tactics, a very useful ability in T's arsenal. The first drop goes down at 10:30, and even though the Z army seems superior, they are completely out of position and the Terran units do some good damage, which includes the destruction of the Z Spire. The only unit Darek loses in this exchange is the siege tank. Quite a good move on his part.

There is only one downside to his play right now. He lacks an expansion and has only half as many peons mining as the Zerg. If he used this opportunity to expand and also attack the other mineral line he could have gained a good advantage on workers and econ. He does have another CC building, but it seems like it's a little bit late, and he builds it toward the back of his base as if to expand to the other Main spawn area. A critical move in the game, as the time it takes to fly over to his Natural is precious. However, the next Zerg attack is spectacularly unsuccessful, so the time could be considered negated.

At 14:35 another Terran drop comes at the natural, but most drones move toward the third expo at the 3 O'clock expo. DarekKhort rakes in a few drone kills with no unit losses of his own as he moves out.

This, in my opinion, is where the game is lost. Darek's OC has still not lifted off and Zerg's third expo is about to go up with drones ready to start populating it. The disparity in workers is the main reason for the tactical difference. Terran's army is ahead in unit cost, but the Zerg economic machine is just too much to handle. At 16:45 Terran maekes a critical attack on the third Zerg expansion, but even after the attack the worker disparity remains at 40 to 26, a very tough number to catch up to.

The final nail in the coffin occurs at about 17:40, where the Terran drop is placed right in the main base's mineral line, but the Zerg army is there and ready to defend it. The rest is a downhill battle for the Terran defense.

Overall, I think there was some solid drop play here, but Darek's main weakness was his macro/ worker count. With a stronger economy it would have been a very different game. The army composition was good, with the exception of the late game Thors (since the Z army never had any muta play, even though the spire was there). I believe with more bases and higher production, the Terran would have had this game without teching higher than an MMM build.

It was a satisfying game, and I hope this game summary helped. I'm still new to the strategy write-ups, so let me know what you all thought, if there were any differences of opinion. Most of all, I hope this topic catches on and helps us all improve.

kenjiro yume
Crew


Nerdoid

O.G. Noob

PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 8:03 am


User Image - Blocked by "Display Image" Settings. Click to show.
i am so confused
PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 6:08 pm


Kurteee
User Image - Blocked by "Display Image" Settings. Click to show.
i am so confused


Oh, wow, I put the wrong name in there.
Rightfully so, my friend. Rightfully so.

I'll fix that with a re-upload.

EDIT: Or maybe I won't, because I can't find the delete option for replays! Ugh. Maybe I should have not been on Gaia and looking at the guild's members page while I was uploading this in the first place. It was bound to happen.

ANOTHER EDIT: Okay, so I reuploaded and I'm changing the links provided on this thread, but I still don't know how to delete things off of the site, so I'll work on that.

kenjiro yume
Crew


Immortal Nobody
Crew

PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 7:29 pm


You know you can just edit the description, right? >.>
PostPosted: Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:26 am


Immortal Nobody
You know you can just edit the description, right? >.>


I looked and couldn't find it, and then realized I was going to be late for something and rushed out. Oh well.

kenjiro yume
Crew


JrSuper

PostPosted: Sat Dec 18, 2010 8:05 pm


http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/117959-1v1-terran-protoss-metalopolis

Kurtee vs JrSuper (Boo JrSuper, no one likes you)

Game starts off with a LAGGY start
but it became all well 2-3 seconds later, Kurteee at the 9 O'clock position and me at the 6. Kurteee queued his 7th worker MUCH later than mine at the beginning, which is pretty bad (blame the stupid lag)

I send my scout on +90% 10th worker and Kurteee uses his scout probe to build his pylon on the front and scout with it.

The possibly best opening for terran is to build a supply depot IMMEDIATELY at 10. Once the supply depot is done, build a barracks at 12. If your going to a tech build unit like marauder, then build a refinery the same time your building your barracks. If its going to be a mass-marine build, then dont build the refinery (duh)

Now, im NOT a pro, not even a decent toss player. But Kurteee should build a gateway at 12 and then an assimilator at 14. Then build another pylon at 16.

If Kurteee played with that plan, he probably could've gotten the cybernetic core out already and could already be queing up a stalker.

Anyways, my strategy was to go 2 Rax FE (Fast Expand), but I always end up queuing up more units or forgetting it... And then it ends up being a 3 Rax.The point of the strat is to FE and use the reaper as a harass and scouting. Only 1 reaper was nessasary for this strategy. Anyways, when my reaper was at 50%, I built another Rax and then added a reactor.

As for Kurteee, when my 2nd Rax was about to be built, he had ALOT of minerals which could be used to build a gateway or 2, instead of queuing up and chrono boosting workers. Idk what Kurteee thinks, but I think he was distracted by my attacking worker and you had to keep the probe moving.

When Kurteee started his warpgate technology, he should've chrono boosted it ALL DA WAY since he had like 75/100 energy. Once again, if he used the good toss opening (9 pylon, 12 gate, 13/14 gas, etc) he could've saved his zealot and possibly kill my reaper.

Good thing for Kurteee is that he put his stalkers at the very cliff, so when I sent my army to attack, i took some hits. But when he put that proxy pylon near my base, it became useless since I attacked his base.

Eventually my macro overpowered him... But he didnt play for 2 weeks -3 -
PostPosted: Sat Dec 18, 2010 8:36 pm


Oh man that was such a bad game.
I messed up on placing the gateway and totally forgot to get some workers up when your scv was being annoying.
I usually go 13 gateway and gas.

Nerdoid

O.G. Noob


JrSuper

PostPosted: Sun Dec 19, 2010 2:49 pm


http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/118121-1v1-terran-zerg-xelnaga-caverns

(THIS IS AN OLD REPLAY)
ReignStoRm vs JrSuper

Starts off pretty good and no lag biggrin
I scout at 8 (Bad) and Reign sends his overlord. Most original openings for us. I go 10 supply, 12 Rax and since i was going mass marine, I build another Rax at 65% Barrack. Reign did 14 pool/gas. Once the pool was done, he immediately went to Roach.

14/15, Reign sends a drone to scout. I think it would've been better if he built his early expansion instead of going to the roach. The zerg's rule is to be a base ahead of your opponent.

Anyways, I killed Reign's drone and overlord which makes him get an extra overlord which could be better used for buildings/army. When my scout SCV saw the roaches, I immediately tried to get marauders since they are the counter against roaches.

Foretunately, I managed to defend the 1st attack but losing 80% of my army :/ Usually, when I see roaches, I try to go for air units like banshees to attack the roaches or medivacs to help my army when its small. In this game, I made medivacs and Rax units with Stim, slow and shield.

It was a smart idea for Reign to get baneling nest and hydralisk den.Banelings can totally wipe out my rax units and hydras can kill the remaining units with a good range.

When I attacked, his banelings managed to kill all of my marines even tho I tried to micro to kill them. Eventually my attack failed, but did quite the damage.

After the attack, we macroed and tired to build up our army. Then I attacked with a drop at the main mineral line and the main army at the front. Maybe if Reign had some banelings with speed, he could've saved his army and stay alive. Anyways, GG

I still love you Reign <3
PostPosted: Sat Dec 25, 2010 9:08 am


JrSuper
http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/118121-1v1-terran-zerg-xelnaga-caverns

(THIS IS AN OLD REPLAY)
ReignStoRm vs JrSuper

Starts off pretty good and no lag biggrin
I scout at 8 (Bad) and Reign sends his overlord. Most original openings for us. I go 10 supply, 12 Rax and since i was going mass marine, I build another Rax at 65% Barrack. Reign did 14 pool/gas. Once the pool was done, he immediately went to Roach.

14/15, Reign sends a drone to scout. I think it would've been better if he built his early expansion instead of going to the roach. The zerg's rule is to be a base ahead of your opponent.

Anyways, I killed Reign's drone and overlord which makes him get an extra overlord which could be better used for buildings/army. When my scout SCV saw the roaches, I immediately tried to get marauders since they are the counter against roaches.

Foretunately, I managed to defend the 1st attack but losing 80% of my army :/ Usually, when I see roaches, I try to go for air units like banshees to attack the roaches or medivacs to help my army when its small. In this game, I made medivacs and Rax units with Stim, slow and shield.

It was a smart idea for Reign to get baneling nest and hydralisk den.Banelings can totally wipe out my rax units and hydras can kill the remaining units with a good range.

When I attacked, his banelings managed to kill all of my marines even tho I tried to micro to kill them. Eventually my attack failed, but did quite the damage.

After the attack, we macroed and tired to build up our army. Then I attacked with a drop at the main mineral line and the main army at the front. Maybe if Reign had some banelings with speed, he could've saved his army and stay alive. Anyways, GG

I still love you Reign <3

Yeah I remember that game. First, I was a bit late with the 7 roach rush. Then later I queued up an attacking force too close to your ledge so you saw my lings. And of course I totally missed that they were being attacked. Ugh. I made so many mistakes that game. The biggest one being that I totally missed the drop in the main until all the drones were dead. One of those days.

kenjiro yume
Crew

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Twilight Council: Game Mechanics, and Strategy Discussions

 
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