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Skreemer

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 16, 2010 11:10 am


As it says, I see the Vatican as evil, harmful and that it has chosen to ignore the teachings of the Christian god, if he ever spoke to the pope in the first place.
heres my reasoning.
1. Opposition to homosexuality.
This is pretty obvious. The popes thoughout history have always referred to homosexuals as evil, vile, refused to acknowledge them, opposed their basic human rights and so on and so forth. There are several gay Catholic organisations around the world. To ignore their wishes and to condemn them, thats not the act of anyone or anything good.
2.Covering up and denying sex abuse.
We've seen this for a long time. Yes the current pontiff has made some apologies, but that isnt good enough. Most the people who comitted the abuse are still at large, protected by the Vatican's system. A system that protects the abusers over the abused, on threat of excommunication. By the way, this system was brought in by none other than the current pope.
3. Self serving.
The Vatican is a system unto itself, that exists only to keep itself rich and to build huge, expensive churches in the poorest places, to safeguard its ridiculous amounts of treasures, as well as its huge monetary reserves. And as I mentioned before, the church also has horrible methods of self preservation, to keep itself from scandal.
4. Attempts at social control.
This is rife in places like Italy, Mexico, Brazil, Spain, the Africas. But they also try it anywhere they can. The popes edicts on social issues, on issues of sex, morality, life issues that he's never had to deal with, its ridiculous. And to make it worse, he's immune from any sort of civil action in the U.S.A. at least. In Italy as an example, those who speak out against the pope or the vatican in a public manner are often persecuted, threatened legally in an attempt to make an example of them.
5.Opposition to contraception.
My final point here is the Popes hatred of condoms and other family planning methods that arent the rhythm method. Damn Thomas Aquinas and his natural law. Its just not relelvant anymore. We've got a world thats got a rising population that we might not be able to support, huge problems with AIDS, parents who cant support a child or who've been raped and he wont break rank with what his predecessor in the 30s thought? These people arent allowed to have sex, if they have they shouldnt be in office, so they should not be telling people who are allowed and do what theyre allowed.

I'm not attacking Catholicism here, indeed I support the religious belief as I would hope theyd support mine. I just think they need to completely raze the Vatican as it is now and replace it with people who are a little more familiar with the issues they get into. And take away a lot of the power.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 16, 2010 2:06 pm


The vatican has made more than enough mistakes, BUT
http://www.libchrist.com/other/homosexual/gaymarriagerite.html they didn't always hate gays.

Missy Murderess

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Missy Murderess

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 16, 2010 2:07 pm


PostPosted: Wed Oct 20, 2010 5:26 am


Military Grade Chocolate
it has chosen to ignore the teachings of the Christian god

1. Opposition to homosexuality.
What?
This is IN the bible.
It may not be moral, but it IS christian

2.Covering up and denying sex abuse.
"the current pontiff has made some apologies, but that isnt good enough."
What would you have him do?
Personally guarantee that it will not happen again?
He's already made a statement that had he any knowledge of harboured/sheltered sex-offenders, he would do all in his power to have them trialed

3. Self serving.
"exists only to keep itself rich"

Then why "build huge, expensive churches in the poorest places"? Surely to spread salvation and the word of god?

"safeguard its ridiculous amounts of treasures" has no purpose in itself at all.

"as well as its huge monetary reserves" ...S'called a bank... Jus' sayin'.

4. Attempts at social control.
They would of course claim that this is not at all the pope or the church trying to create a layer of social control, but simply promoting gods will.

5.Opposition to contraception.
Every sperm is sacred
Every sperm is great
If a sperm is wasted
God would be quite irate razz

Once again, promotion of an ideal that is within the bible...
Might be unreasonable and illogical, but it is Christian.

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iKnighty

PostPosted: Fri Nov 19, 2010 1:57 pm


Skreemer

1. Opposition to homosexuality.
This is pretty obvious. The popes thoughout history have always referred to homosexuals as evil, vile, refused to acknowledge them, opposed their basic human rights and so on and so forth. There are several gay Catholic organisations around the world. To ignore their wishes and to condemn them, thats not the act of anyone or anything good.

Taking heed of their wishes would be ignoring centuries of Sacred Tradition, and that would put into jeopardy all the dogmas and the orthodoxy.

Skreemer
2.Covering up and denying sex abuse.
We've seen this for a long time. Yes the current pontiff has made some apologies, but that isnt good enough. Most the people who comitted the abuse are still at large, protected by the Vatican's system. A system that protects the abusers over the abused, on threat of excommunication. By the way, this system was brought in by none other than the current pope.

Doesn't make the Vatican evil.
The system worked on the Christian values of forgiveness and the possibility of repentance.

Skreemer
3. Self serving.
The Vatican is a system unto itself, that exists only to keep itself rich and to build huge, expensive churches in the poorest places, to safeguard its ridiculous amounts of treasures, as well as its huge monetary reserves. And as I mentioned before, the church also has horrible methods of self preservation, to keep itself from scandal.

Tell me, when was the last time the Vatican itself gave money to build large expensive churches?
Any sources?
They seem like empty claims to me.

Skreemer
4. Attempts at social control.
This is rife in places like Italy, Mexico, Brazil, Spain, the Africas. But they also try it anywhere they can. The popes edicts on social issues, on issues of sex, morality, life issues that he's never had to deal with, its ridiculous. And to make it worse, he's immune from any sort of civil action in the U.S.A. at least. In Italy as an example, those who speak out against the pope or the vatican in a public manner are often persecuted, threatened legally in an attempt to make an example of them.

Sources on your claim about Italy?
The popes can't have opinions?

Skreemer
5.Opposition to contraception.
My final point here is the Popes hatred of condoms and other family planning methods that arent the rhythm method. Damn Thomas Aquinas and his natural law. Its just not relelvant anymore. We've got a world thats got a rising population that we might not be able to support, huge problems with AIDS, parents who cant support a child or who've been raped and he wont break rank with what his predecessor in the 30s thought? These people arent allowed to have sex, if they have they shouldnt be in office, so they should not be telling people who are allowed and do what theyre allowed.

Yes, the Roman Catholic Church doesn't endorse condom use, but it also doesn't endorse sex out of marriage and endorses monogamy. So it's 'hatred' of condoms is only reflective of it's disagreement with a pleasure seeking mentality.
PostPosted: Fri Nov 19, 2010 1:59 pm


Midnight Magyk
The vatican has made more than enough mistakes, BUT
http://www.libchrist.com/other/homosexual/gaymarriagerite.html they didn't always hate gays.

They never hated gays. They only hate homosexual sex. Which is different.

iKnighty


Reticence

PostPosted: Fri Nov 19, 2010 3:03 pm


I already knew that religion heeded outdated, selfish and utterly-daft bylaws, all of which have slowly turned away from the homosexual agenda. What I fail to understand is why so many adhere to such hypocrisy and withhold Vatican City and all those who dwell within its walls as a true sign of God's wisdom.

Even if I were not and Atheist, I could easily see that 'holy city' is a sign at this point that God is dead.
PostPosted: Fri Nov 19, 2010 4:06 pm


Skreemer
Doesn't make the Vatican evil.
The system worked on the Christian values of forgiveness and the possibility of repentance.


Actually the current pope issued an edict in 2001 when he was a Cardinal telling all church staff involved in an allegation of abuse to hide this from the authorities, and move the preist away from the abused persons(s).

Not only is this breaking local laws, it is putting more vulnerable young people at risk evil

Maybe the Vatican isn't evil, but evil is rife in its "rulers"

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PostPosted: Wed May 11, 2011 11:10 pm


iKnighty
Midnight Magyk
The vatican has made more than enough mistakes, BUT
http://www.libchrist.com/other/homosexual/gaymarriagerite.html they didn't always hate gays.

They never hated gays. They only hate homosexual sex. Which is different.

and yet they don't even bat an eye over straight a**l sex.
PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2011 4:22 am


Shilberu Erikku
iKnighty
Midnight Magyk
The vatican has made more than enough mistakes, BUT
http://www.libchrist.com/other/homosexual/gaymarriagerite.html they didn't always hate gays.

They never hated gays. They only hate homosexual sex. Which is different.

and yet they don't even bat an eye over straight a**l sex.

They do. It's not acceptable for a catholic to engage in oral and a**l sex! Only sexual intercourse that could have some potential for procreation is allowable.
In my opinion that diminishes the value of sex in it's affectionate and intimate qualities.

iKnighty


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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2011 6:55 am


iKnighty
Shilberu Erikku
iKnighty
Midnight Magyk
The vatican has made more than enough mistakes, BUT
http://www.libchrist.com/other/homosexual/gaymarriagerite.html they didn't always hate gays.

They never hated gays. They only hate homosexual sex. Which is different.

and yet they don't even bat an eye over straight a**l sex.

They do. It's not acceptable for a catholic to engage in oral and a**l sex! Only sexual intercourse that could have some potential for procreation is allowable.
In my opinion that diminishes the value of sex in it's affectionate and intimate qualities.

Yeah, what to they expect us to do? Become a priest and rape an alter boy? Why are they so sexphobic anyways? It's like they're trying to deny their own humanity.
PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2011 8:12 am


Shilberu Erikku
iKnighty
Shilberu Erikku
iKnighty
Midnight Magyk
The vatican has made more than enough mistakes, BUT
http://www.libchrist.com/other/homosexual/gaymarriagerite.html they didn't always hate gays.

They never hated gays. They only hate homosexual sex. Which is different.

and yet they don't even bat an eye over straight a**l sex.

They do. It's not acceptable for a catholic to engage in oral and a**l sex! Only sexual intercourse that could have some potential for procreation is allowable.
In my opinion that diminishes the value of sex in it's affectionate and intimate qualities.

Yeah, what to they expect us to do? Become a priest and rape an alter boy? Why are they so sexphobic anyways? It's like they're trying to deny their own humanity.


its just what they believe. they expect you to keep it in your pants. there is nothing wrong with it

also i personally dont believe that our humanity is based around sex. people dont have to have sex to be happy and wonderful people

Shanna66

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PostPosted: Sun May 15, 2011 2:45 pm


Shanna66
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iKnighty
Shilberu Erikku
iKnighty
Midnight Magyk
The vatican has made more than enough mistakes, BUT
http://www.libchrist.com/other/homosexual/gaymarriagerite.html they didn't always hate gays.

They never hated gays. They only hate homosexual sex. Which is different.

and yet they don't even bat an eye over straight a**l sex.

They do. It's not acceptable for a catholic to engage in oral and a**l sex! Only sexual intercourse that could have some potential for procreation is allowable.
In my opinion that diminishes the value of sex in it's affectionate and intimate qualities.

Yeah, what to they expect us to do? Become a priest and rape an alter boy? Why are they so sexphobic anyways? It's like they're trying to deny their own humanity.


its just what they believe. they expect you to keep it in your pants. there is nothing wrong with it

also i personally dont believe that our humanity is based around sex. people dont have to have sex to be happy and wonderful people

It's not just their sexphobia that makes them deny their humanity though.....
PostPosted: Sun May 15, 2011 3:52 pm


Numbers 3 and 4 are normal in this day and age mostly because... well that's what EVERY company does.

Oh, and numbers 1 and 5 are apart of number 4.

Also let it be noted that there is a difference between the Vatican and the religion itself.

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PostPosted: Sun May 15, 2011 11:41 pm


Shanna66
Shilberu Erikku
iKnighty
Shilberu Erikku
iKnighty
Midnight Magyk
The vatican has made more than enough mistakes, BUT
http://www.libchrist.com/other/homosexual/gaymarriagerite.html they didn't always hate gays.

They never hated gays. They only hate homosexual sex. Which is different.

and yet they don't even bat an eye over straight a**l sex.

They do. It's not acceptable for a catholic to engage in oral and a**l sex! Only sexual intercourse that could have some potential for procreation is allowable.
In my opinion that diminishes the value of sex in it's affectionate and intimate qualities.

Yeah, what to they expect us to do? Become a priest and rape an alter boy? Why are they so sexphobic anyways? It's like they're trying to deny their own humanity.


its just what they believe. they expect you to keep it in your pants. there is nothing wrong with it

also i personally dont believe that our humanity is based around sex. people dont have to have sex to be happy and wonderful people

Yes, they do. After all, the only points in life are to eat and to ******** blaugh .
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