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 Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2010 6:47 pm
So, I've just gotten off the phone with this guy. Some of you may know him.
He's Ivan the Surf Punk, GDriver's resident critic.
Now, it's been brought to my attention that some of you are displeased with his conduct as of recently. It is my understanding that it has to do with his cynical nature and his unwavering tendency to tease people.
Most of you, I'm sure, feel that I've been too lenient with him. With this, however, I disagree.
I feel that Gaian Driver benefits from a bit of satirical attitude. Yes, we're all mature and we're all about professionalism - but who ever said we can't be professional and critical? Sometimes, we need to be critical. Sometimes, those of you who aren't critical should be critical.
Why? Because when it comes right down to it, none of us are your typical car fan. We're not a bunch of know-nothing punk kids controlled my the popular media... We're not a group of [insert appropriate racial stereotype here] that have wet dreams over 24" chrome wheels. We're not the sort of tasteless barbarians that light up their windshield washers and wheel wells with LEDs!
We're genuine, true-blue automotive enthusiasts - and that goes hand in hand with being elitists. We deserve to exude a degree of pompousness. To those that are open to ridicule, I adhere to the philosophy of the Fantastic Four and say FLAME ON.
Be proud of who we are. Be proud of who you are. Don't be afraid to slight others if you know you're better than them! I'm sure that every last one of you, like minded to myself, understands this.
That said, I will not instruct Ivan - or anyone - to back down when they really don't have to.
Respect, however, is another matter. Between members whose credibility is on equal terms, and when nothing less than sophisticated and gentlemanly conduct is acceptable, no one should partake in mindless disrespect of others.
Have your educated debates in an orderly fashion! Don't take a crack at your brothers and sisters when they deserve your utmost respect, despite their disagreeing with you. You're men of the world... Don't be caught dead bickering and having catfights.
For this, I have reprimanded Ivan and I assure you, he will conduct himself with more respect toward others from now on - but only those that deserve it. Those that don't should expect criticism, not only (although most certainly) from Ivan but from all of us.
In the recent quarrel about automatics vs. manuals, Ivan was indeed wrong. He didn't do enough research before mounting his attack on the OP, and for that, he deserved your disapproval. He also earned my disapproval, so much that I invested time in calling him to express my disappointment.
Yet, his eventual apology in that thread should have been the end of the battle. It wasn't. Many of you continued to retaliate against him, saying that his general attitude is unacceptable.
On the contrary, his general attitude is welcome in a club full of supercilious but exceptionally knowledgeable enthusiasts. Once again, we're not the Proletariat in the world of cars, we're the Bourgeois. If you know a person is deserving of Ivan's criticism, don't defend that person. Join Ivan. In doing so, you will cause the criticized to see the error of their ways.
If you catch Ivan disrespecting someone that isn't deserving of such, yes... Go ahead and speak your mind. Defend that person and tell Ivan why he is wrong. If it gets into a heated argument, seek my intervention.
As for Millefune, I don't feel you were in the wrong for disapproving of Ivan's behavior in the particular instance (automatics vs. manuals) but I do not feel that any of us with administrative powers should be editing others' posts, regardless of the reasoning behind doing so. I'm making that an official rule among moderators - edit your own posts, no one else's.
That is all.
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Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 8:06 am
Translation: Quote: Enough with the high school drama, you can't force everyone to agree and "be nice" like an afterschool special or something. People are not always going to like your ride, so don't get all butthurt about it and then play victim when you don't like being called out on acting butthurt. You wanna be an a*****e, you deserve to be treated like one. And on my own note. Yes, I crack jokes on people, and act like a smartass. But seriously, toughen up. Act like big boys and toughen the ******** up. That's just my idea of being friendly. No, I don't care that you're 'extra sensative' about being teased cuz you were the fat kid in elementry. I really don't. And just to abuse my new favorite animated gif, if you don't like getting ******** with ON THE INTERWEBS, then 
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Ivan The Somekinda-Punk Crew
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Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 8:28 am
Well I attempt to give respect to the older ones who know much more then myself. I am a newb in a sort and get better with knowledge everyday thanks to you guys, and Ivan's smart a**. smile Hell I've learned more here then from my own peers, mostly because they're all THIS VS THESE!!! RANT and RAVE!!
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Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 9:04 am
*Post about how I agree and that those with balls should use them in a non-sexual way*
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Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 10:31 am
My stance on unnecessary and meaningless negativity directed at member's rides is firm. I'm sorry that you don't like his ride. I'm sorry that momma never taught you good manners. If I see it, I will take measures to moderate it. Ivan can go ahead and act the way he does in Gaian Driver, no one cares. There's quite a few of us that just glaze over and ignore his posts when he starts "acting up" like an internet tough guy with his "tough guy talk". But, when he starts that in the Member's Ride section, you can count on me stepping in.
Ivan, you're a cool guy, and we have our differences and surprisingly we've agreed on a few things. But, as I've stated before. You take that s**t into Member's Ride section and it's over. I will moderate. Count on it.
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Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 2:39 pm
I'm actually cool with you Chronos, despite past arguments. And no, no internet tough guy crap, I'm 100% badass cool
Has nothing to do with good manners. I'm allowed to say I don't like your car and why I don't like it. No, I really am. I have that right, actually. Again, this isn't kindergarten, not everyone has to feel special here. And if someone wants to take it as more than just disagreeing, and see it as a personal attack; don't automatically go right for me like Millefune has been doing lately. I'm sick of being equally attacked and verbally abused, but the only one who is accused and jumped on. That's not moderating, that's bringing your own personal bullshit into it and taking sides. You people can say what you want, but I have NEVER actually STARTED a flame war. No, really, if Millefune didn't f** out and delete just about everything, you could see all I did was crack a joke, or simply state I don't care for the car much or whatever, and you or whoever went apeshit. I'm not an internet tough guy, I just call assholes assholes, it's that simple. I'll gladly tell you off in person, give it a try some time if you don't believe me.
Like I told Millefune, don't mess with my posts or I'm gonna play the game right back. Count on it.
Besides, Six already said that s**t is done with. Just because you disagree with someone, does not give you the right to edit or delete their posts. No, you really don't have that right. That's fascist censorship. That's blatantly disregarding the right to free speech. That makes you more of a jerkoff than the guy saying stupid s**t.
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Ivan The Somekinda-Punk Crew
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Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:47 pm
Ivan The Surf-Punk I'm actually cool with you Chronos, despite past arguments. And no, no internet tough guy crap, I'm 100% badass cool Has nothing to do with good manners. I'm allowed to say I don't like your car and why I don't like it. No, I really am. I have that right, actually. Again, this isn't kindergarten, not everyone has to feel special here. And if someone wants to take it as more than just disagreeing, and see it as a personal attack; don't automatically go right for me like Millefune has been doing lately. I'm sick of being equally attacked and verbally abused, but the only one who is accused and jumped on. That's not moderating, that's bringing your own personal bullshit into it and taking sides. You people can say what you want, but I have NEVER actually STARTED a flame war. No, really, if Millefune didn't f** out and delete just about everything, you could see all I did was crack a joke, or simply state I don't care for the car much or whatever, and you or whoever went apeshit. I'm not an internet tough guy, I just call assholes assholes, it's that simple. I'll gladly tell you off in person, give it a try some time if you don't believe me. Like I told Millefune, don't mess with my posts or I'm gonna play the game right back. Count on it. Besides, Six already said that s**t is done with. Just because you disagree with someone, does not give you the right to edit or delete their posts. No, you really don't have that right. That's fascist censorship. That's blatantly disregarding the right to free speech. That makes you more of a jerkoff than the guy saying stupid s**t. Haha, maybe I wasn't clear. Of course you are allowed to state your opinion of how you disapprove. But, you better have some reason attached to that disapproval. The only cause for me to step in with some moderation is when someone posts something like this: "Ur carz suck d**k dawg!" Just a negative comment with no other reasoning behind it, you can expect me to step in. It's really the principle of the matter of respecting other people's property. If you disapprove of their property or you disapprove of what they're doing to it, that opinion is all yours and you have a right to express it. I express that right on a number of occasions. However, you better have constructive criticism attached to it. Anything less and I'll see that as a blatant attack that serves no purpose and does not help our community here at Gaian Driver grow further. This principle goes to everyone in this community, I'm not just referring to Ivan. Respect other member's and their rides. I hope I made my stance clearer this time. Now, let's have some fun discussing automotives. That's what we're here for, right? wink
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Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 6:34 pm
Oh! Well, THAT'S different. And something I can definitely say I've never done, despite how anyone feels about my idea of "constructive criticism". No, no matter how hard you cry, I never did.
Hell, even I'd act like a mod for 5 minutes to give someone a stern talking to if thats all they had to say.
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Ivan The Somekinda-Punk Crew
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Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 8:11 pm
Chron0s Ivan The Surf-Punk Respect other member's and their rides. I hope I made my stance clearer this time.
Only if they deserve it. Sure, the nice thing to do is be respectful all the time. But this guild isn't looking for punk a** ricer fagots. Criticize them if they are!
[/img]
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Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 8:27 pm
I tend to disagree,
In my opinion proving you are better than someone is not going off and making rude childish remarks and insults to make fun of someone. You prove you are better when you give the person sound respective advise. Telling someone off and insulting them because you feel you are better is just childish and makes you look like an immature brat that knows nothing.
No one is going to listen to someone who is batting down on them. It is the people who give the person respect and act like a mature adult in their discussions with them that will prove who the more knowledgeable and mature person is.
This is of course just my opinion.
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Ivan The Somekinda-Punk Crew
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Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 8:52 pm
I kindly and maturely informed you your SC-whatever wasn't as exciting as you may have previously believed and you threw a b***h fit. Yeeeeah xd
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Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 9:03 pm
X C L S I O R I tend to disagree, In my opinion proving you are better than someone is not going off and making rude childish remarks and insults to make fun of someone. You prove you are better when you give the person sound respective advise. Telling someone off and insulting them because you feel you are better is just childish and makes you look like an immature brat that knows nothing. No one is going to listen to someone who is batting down on them. It is the people who give the person respect and act like a mature adult in their discussions with them that will prove who the more knowledgeable and mature person is. This is of course just my opinion.
smile Do whatever you like. I like to combine maturity with contempt.
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Posted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 11:26 pm
I think it's hilarious that first I'm accused by some of letting Ivan go too much while I fix and edit threads to stay on topic (only if it's gone many posts way off, a couple of "by the way" posts is generally fine) and DO MY JOB of stopping harassment of others AS PER THE THEN CURRENT GUILD RULES. I told those people that Ivan hadn't posted anything in his "intarwebz tuff gai" manner since I had returned from my assignments overseas. Then when he did start breaking rules, and I proved to those people that I am being impartial and, again, DOING MY JOB, Ivan complains (at least in this thread) that people are being allowed to attack him and let go. Except... nobody in the instances I took part in moderating ever attacked him personally without his provocation, and even then those such as VK and Chronos only replied in a mature manner asking him to stop, which he then kept trolling on as a child.
NOT TRUE on both sides. Equal treatment was given to all people who offended the rules that Sixspeed put up and assigned for me to keep. If Sixspeed wants to change things and say, "Oh, those rules and general decency guidelines I made up and made you crew/vice-captain to uphold... ******** 'em. Ivan, yourself, and the rest of the crew has immunity." That's fine with me. All he had to do was do what he did here and post what he wanted (I would prefer he edit the Guild's homepage in the rules and guidelines section so that any new members or Gaian passerbys would know what they need to). This is his guild. This isn't a democracy, this is a totalitarian regime, just with a decent ruler. If you don't like it, leave. I know I will if things get to the point where this is basically the Scion board with a better name and more technical words.
People have to just get through their heads that all I was doing was my job, and also stopping the spread of misinformation regarding automotive technologies.
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Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 12:04 am
Millefune I think it's hilarious that first I'm accused by some of letting Ivan go too much while I fix and edit threads to stay on topic (only if it's gone many posts way off, a couple of "by the way" posts is generally fine) and DO MY JOB of stopping harassment of others AS PER THE THEN CURRENT GUILD RULES. I told those people that Ivan hadn't posted anything in his "intarwebz tuff gai" manner since I had returned from my assignments overseas. Then when he did start breaking rules, and I proved to those people that I am being impartial and, again, DOING MY JOB, Ivan complains (at least in this thread) that people are being allowed to attack him and let go. Except... nobody in the instances I took part in moderating ever attacked him personally without his provocation, and even then those such as VK and Chronos only replied in a mature manner asking him to stop, which he then kept trolling on as a child. NOT TRUE on both sides. Equal treatment was given to all people who offended the rules that Sixspeed put up and assigned for me to keep. If Sixspeed wants to change things and say, "Oh, those rules and general decency guidelines I made up and made you crew/vice-captain to uphold... ******** 'em. Ivan, yourself, and the rest of the crew has immunity." That's fine with me. All he had to do was do what he did here and post what he wanted (I would prefer he edit the Guild's homepage in the rules and guidelines section so that any new members or Gaian passerbys would know what they need to). This is his guild. This isn't a democracy, this is a totalitarian regime, just with a decent ruler. If you don't like it, leave. I know I will if things get to the point where this is basically the Scion board with a better name and more technical words. People have to just get through their heads that all I was doing was my job, and also stopping the spread of misinformation regarding automotive technologies. I'd like to personally thank you for what you did in my thread. I appreciate you doing your duty as a moderator here at Gaian Driver. You got my back, that I can be sure of.
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Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 6:20 am
Bloody hell, everyone just have a cup of concrete and HARDEN THE ******** UP! 4laugh 4laugh 4laugh
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