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 Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 12:32 am
As someone who studies history, there are many weird events that historians cannot explain. Some are easy. We can explain the cause and effects of the Revolutionary war. We can't explain why America and Japan went to war. Yes, Pear Harbor is what caused it, but there were many events leading to the attack. Japan gets angry at the oil embargo, the US cuts oil because of their aggression, Japan gets aggressive with the Pacific, it's not just an event that happened in the 1930's, relations between the US and Japan deteriorated decades before Pearl Harbor. Even before the Russo-Japanese War, it seemed like the US and Japan agreed to go to war long before. By the time Pearl Harbor was attacked, people knew war was inevitable. They just didn't know the time and location.
What are your thoughts?
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Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 6:49 am
America needed a place to test the nukes they had created. A place that couldn't retaliate with similar force.
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Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 9:04 am
Quinz J Morro America needed a place to test the nukes they had created. A place that couldn't retaliate with similar force. America wasn't the only aggressor. Japan hated the US without a cause as well.
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Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 7:28 pm
Wasn't there knowledge of the attack on Pearl Harbor before it happened? The leadership just chose not to act?
I guess I could point out that war is generally good for an industrialized nation's economy.
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Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:01 pm
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Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:08 pm
America was provoking Japan into a war... in fact there is a lot of evidence out there supporting this. America used economic tactics to cause Japan too act as the "Aggressor". Don't get me wrong though, Japan did have a thing against America, a whole lot of reason, but I like to think its because US bases were in strategic locations... and Japan wanted them. For more info of Americas Economic Warfare Here it is.
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Posted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:13 pm
Obscurus Wasn't there knowledge of the attack on Pearl Harbor before it happened? The leadership just chose not to act? I guess I could point out that war is generally good for an industrialized nation's economy. Leadership did know of the eminent attack at Pearl Harbor... in fact they were counting on it. 3 Days before the attack the carriers (The main target and reason real reason for striking PH) were ordered to immediately leave... a very strange order at the time. Merchant ships reported something out in the waters north of Hawaii... the Japanese fleet (Though they never went to investigate)... who were also "missing" from there bases back in the Western Pacific. Lots of signals were intercepted from the Japanese fleet and told/hinted of an attack.
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Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2010 2:22 pm
X02WyvernLord America was provoking Japan into a war... in fact there is a lot of evidence out there supporting this. America used economic tactics to cause Japan too act as the "Aggressor". Don't get me wrong though, Japan did have a thing against America, a whole lot of reason, but I like to think its because US bases were in strategic locations... and Japan wanted them. For more info of Americas Economic Warfare Here it is.You don't understand. The very first contact between the 2 and it was hostile.
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Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 7:37 pm
God Emperor Akhenaton X02WyvernLord America was provoking Japan into a war... in fact there is a lot of evidence out there supporting this. America used economic tactics to cause Japan too act as the "Aggressor". Don't get me wrong though, Japan did have a thing against America, a whole lot of reason, but I like to think its because US bases were in strategic locations... and Japan wanted them. For more info of Americas Economic Warfare Here it is.You don't understand. The very first contact between the 2 and it was hostile. Pearl Harbor? Yes, that was merely the event that gave America the good reason to fight this war. The people enraged over the deaths would support a war against Japan and allow America to look like a victim. Not only that, Japan hated American society with all its "gangsters" and "crime" as they believed (Still) in a code of honor, Samurais code. Many gov't officials and military officers followed the Samurai code, everyone else followed with the code too. Japanese society and American society were very different and had conflicting views about one another in many ways. We the US were provoking the Japanese for sometime... or do you mean something else cause your qoute is confusing to say the least.
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Posted: Sat May 01, 2010 1:28 am
X02WyvernLord God Emperor Akhenaton X02WyvernLord America was provoking Japan into a war... in fact there is a lot of evidence out there supporting this. America used economic tactics to cause Japan too act as the "Aggressor". Don't get me wrong though, Japan did have a thing against America, a whole lot of reason, but I like to think its because US bases were in strategic locations... and Japan wanted them. For more info of Americas Economic Warfare Here it is.You don't understand. The very first contact between the 2 and it was hostile. Pearl Harbor? Yes, that was merely the event that gave America the good reason to fight this war. The people enraged over the deaths would support a war against Japan and allow America to look like a victim. Not only that, Japan hated American society with all its "gangsters" and "crime" as they believed (Still) in a code of honor, Samurais code. Many gov't officials and military officers followed the Samurai code, everyone else followed with the code too. Japanese society and American society were very different and had conflicting views about one another in many ways. We the US were provoking the Japanese for sometime... or do you mean something else cause your qoute is confusing to say the least. Japan was also provoking the US. They provoked the US into an oil embargo. Pearl Harbor was an attack to make sure that the US Navy couldn't retaliate once they took the Philippines.
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Posted: Sat May 01, 2010 3:54 am
God Emperor Akhenaton Japan never provoked the US with an Oil Embargo... we provoked them with an oil embargo. It took place after France fell and Japan took French Indochina. Pearl Harbor was attacked to try and cripple the American Navy, but... the 3 carriers (The main and juicy targets) were out of harbor, only 2 ships were actually destroyed, every other ship sunk in the shallow harbor could have easily been salvaged and repaired, and most of the crews were on shore leave during the opening phase of the attack... For short term the attack was a small victory, but in the long term it was a complete military failure. The Philippines were to far in Japans Empire to save... we'd have to creep our way in Island from Island.
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Posted: Sat May 01, 2010 12:57 pm
The point is, we provoked them with an embargo and they provoked us by surrounding the Philippines. You need to read up on history a bit more. Also, the Arizona, California, Utah and Oklahoma (I think) were utterly destroyed. So were countless fighters and destroyers. They wanted to make sure the US couldn't retaliate and they pretty much couldn't until Midway.
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Posted: Sat May 01, 2010 1:59 pm
God Emperor Akhenaton The point is, we provoked them with an embargo and they provoked us by surrounding the Philippines. You need to read up on history a bit more. Also, the Arizona, California, Utah and Oklahoma (I think) were utterly destroyed. So were countless fighters and destroyers. They wanted to make sure the US couldn't retaliate and they pretty much couldn't until Midway. Yes 4 Navy battleships were sunk, but 2 were raised and returned to action in the war. Pearl Harbor didn't have many fighters, we mostly lost bombers and recon planes on the airfields along with a couple of assorted fighters. 3 cruisers, 3 destroyers, a minelayer, and a training ship were damaged/sunk. All returned to service after repairs. Yes we couldn't retaliate, but Pearl Harbor isn't why we couldn't. The attack did not affect any of Pearl Harbor's fuel storage, maintenance, submarine, and intelligence facilities.... needless to say it was a tactical blunder. Had they hit our carriers... then the war would have been VERY VERY different...
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Posted: Sat May 01, 2010 2:16 pm
X02WyvernLord God Emperor Akhenaton The point is, we provoked them with an embargo and they provoked us by surrounding the Philippines. You need to read up on history a bit more. Also, the Arizona, California, Utah and Oklahoma (I think) were utterly destroyed. So were countless fighters and destroyers. They wanted to make sure the US couldn't retaliate and they pretty much couldn't until Midway. Yes 4 Navy battleships were sunk, but 2 were raised and returned to action in the war. Pearl Harbor didn't have many fighters, we mostly lost bombers and recon planes on the airfields along with a couple of assorted fighters. 3 cruisers, 3 destroyers, a minelayer, and a training ship were damaged/sunk. All returned to service after repairs. Yes we couldn't retaliate, but Pearl Harbor isn't why we couldn't. The attack did not affect any of Pearl Harbor's fuel storage, maintenance, submarine, and intelligence facilities.... needless to say it was a tactical blunder. Had they hit our carriers... then the war would have been VERY VERY different... You're preaching to someone who knows all of this. I wouldn't say it was a tactical ********. It was very successful, but the outcome of the war mainly depended on air superiority. Something the US planned for when the Japanese did not.
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Posted: Sat May 01, 2010 2:20 pm
Then why do you say "I think" if you know it already?
Yes... we planned for aircraft to fight our war... but it was through the carriers that we were to gain the air superiority... not land-based fighters who have limited range in the pacific.
We provoked the aggressive Japanese military so we could enter WW2 as "Victims" and have the whole of America behind our military.
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