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 Posted: Thu Feb 04, 2010 12:02 pm
...transgendered people? And by that, I mean people who think they should have been born the opposite gender, but are not necessarily gay. More importantly, what do you think about medical care (whether paid for by government, private insurers, or whatever) taking care of the operations? I ask this because of the events that recently occured. My best friend recently decided she wanted to become a man. She's been depressed for a long time, and after she finally let this off of her chest, she's been much happier. I recently started... lurking... around one of the threads where lots of transgendered people talk about their issues. ...Anwyay, back to my questions. I think medical care should cover a large part of the medical care (the therapy, the hormones, the actual... reassignment surgery...) but maybe not all of it. (like, say, chest reductions and such) I love my sis - er, brother, to death, and I want nothing more than her-er, his happiness... Though it's certainly strange and tought to remember to refer to her as a boy, now... I hope I haven't asked something inappropriate for the site, but I'd like to hear people's opinion.
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Posted: Thu Feb 04, 2010 11:10 pm
I'm cool with it.
If someone really believes they'll be happier as the opposite gender then let them.
(to be honest, I think I should have been a man at times but I'd still like guys so it doesn't really matter to me, haha.)
I do also believe that if someone has insurance they should cover at least a part of the bill.
It is a mental issue, not to sound mean.
Insurance covers therapy for dumber reasons, why not cover transgendered patients?
The surgery is a different issue though, it's hard for me to decide whether it should be considered a cosmetic surgery, because cosmetic surgery should not be covered by the government.
(private insurers can cover what they want)
But the real liberal part of me says we should let people do whatever the hell they want and we should help them do it.
So I'd probably be in the "we should help but not pay for it entirely" boat.
I think I've asked more controversial questions
(abortion)
So don't sweat it.
It's an interesting topic and if you get people posting I'm sure an equally interesting discussion would come.
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Moonlight_HuangHou Captain
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Posted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 6:38 am
Debates n' controversial questions are all fine so no worries! 3nodding
That's a good question but I'm the same way. I don't mind it in the least. Someone elses decision to make themselves happy so why not?
For the insurance thing...that's a good question. I never thought of it..Maybe at least a little bit ...even if it's for beauty issues....
Zizzy is right it can be argued as a mental issue... Something like....increasing your eyelashes should NOT be covered by insurance. Now that's a real beauty issue someone should pay out of their pocket (at least that's what I think). >_>
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Posted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 1:54 pm
That's what I think, too. I want my friend to be happy and stuff, but when it comes to getting insurance and stuff, I doubt things like face lifts and stuff to make her/him look more masculine should be considered "necessary". (again, I'm new to the situation, so besides the required surgeries, I'm not sure what else a transgendered person will want.) @Zizzy: My friend STILL likes guys, and still wants to be with men, which is what really shocks me the most about this whole situation. Just because they want to be the opposite sex doesn't necessarily mean they want to be in a... "straight?" relationship... you know, boy/girl couples. I've talk to some online who still like men even while becoming a man. Just because you're transgendered doesn't mean you're gay, and vise versa... apparently... Guess I'll look up some stuff online and see what else I can learn about transgendered issues...
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Posted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 3:08 pm
Yeah, that does confuse me about trans gendered people.
It doesn't depress me or, as far as I can tell, doesn't cause me any issues.
So I'm not going to bother with it.
If I were depressed and that was the route of the issue than I would.
It's one of those things that drifts through my head sometimes, I'm not fixated on it or anything.
*shrug*
I dunno, it's just one of those things.
That reminded me I watched a show a while ago about trans gender people.
There was this couple where the woman who used to be a man was with a woman who wanted to be a man.
They were both afraid that after the woman who wanted to be a man got the surgery that the woman who used to be a man wouldn't be attracted to her/him(?) anymore.
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Posted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 3:42 pm
I think insurence should cover some part of it,
of course hoping it to cover the whole process is highly impractical,
but part of it I say yes. Mostly since no one can get those
surgeries without being 100% sure, which is more then can be said for most chosen surgeries.
And it's not like this is just some small issue, just seeing what people seem to go through when having too live life in the wrong body makes me hurt for them, seriously.
I cannot imagine how horrible it must be too feel like your body isnt supposed to be your every day of your life.
So honestly thank every holy being that those surgeries are possible.
And of course peoples sexuality don't change with this,
sexuality and gender ihave absolutely nothing to do with one another
....
Well that sounds wrong.
But if you're a chick the likes the fellas
you're still going to like them guys if you turn into one yourself.
I know a guy (not a friend more of a friend of a friend I sometime talk too)
That's going through the process.
I'm very happy for him, and yet feel somewhat sorry for him since his bone structure is never going too look feminine.
He's got a rather manly face paired of with the fact that he's like, freakishly tall. But he's happy so that's what matters.
Has your friend talked too doctors yet? gotten the psyc-evaluation and all?Hope it goes well for him
:]
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Posted: Sat Feb 06, 2010 6:35 am
@Zizzy:
Yeah, I've heard of stories like that, too. I'm sure that if they love each other, things'll be ok... But, then again, I've heard of stories where someone just does everything he/she can to get the surgery, and then totally disappear when he/she gets what they want. That's really cruel.
@Klikkhaus:
Yeah, last week was her first time at the therapist, and she goes back this week to talk to them again. It's a bit of a bad situation, because she's the ONLY case of FtM that's been there. The therapist has to go and serach up stuff to see if she's even qualified to give her hormonal therapy. sweatdrop
But I go to the same therapist (for other reasons, mind you) and she's really nice, so I'm not too worried.
So you're friend's friend is an...MtF? I'm trying to remember the lingo...
There are such a thing as masculine women, so I'm sure things'll work out.
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Posted: Sun Feb 07, 2010 11:53 pm
Klikk: I can see how sexuality and gender have nothing to do with each other. My logic on the issue, and why I find it odd, are... If you're homosexual, you're a dead end. You can't reproduce, at least in a natural way. Natural instincts pretty much are to keep your race going. So with that in mind, I figured that if you are a woman who feels she should be a man, for example, it would be they feel like they should be a man to continue the race by going after women. I don't know if anyone is going to be offended by me calling gay people a dead end. I have no problem with them. (I may a bit bent myself) But it's true. So yeah, that's why I have trouble wrapping my head around the issue, I guess. Black: Yeah, they were really in love But the other person, I don't remember which, was really afraid they would no longer be attracted to the other physically after they'd had the operation. (the show didn't show how their tale ended so I don't know if they ended up okay or not) That is cruel though. But I can see how they may not be attracted to the person anymore. Even bisexuals, at least the ones I know, can be finicky. I think you'd need to be with a pansexual to be sure to have that same person stick by you after the operation. They pretty much ignore gender so they probably wouldn't care whether you changed yours. (But I don't know, I don't actually know one)
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Posted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 3:12 pm
I can see why you think of that, Zizzy. I always thought that if someone wanted to be a man, they would also want to be with a woman, that way they look more "normal." I always considered that transgenders were simply people who wanted to be considered normal based on their physical appearance (i.e. be seen as a man with a wife), though that certainly sounds wrong with my friend's situation. I've been reading some things about transgendered, and I heard of girlf**s and guyd***s. (I'm not sure if that's the appropriate words for the pair, but that was the only names I was getting, so I'm not trying to offend anyone (Anyone who does know the appropriate words, please tell me!)) Girlf**s are girls who think they are "a gay man in a woman's body". While most women like this don't plan on changing gender anytime soon, there are some instances, such as my friend. Guyd***s are the reversal. Men who believe they are "a gay woman in a man's body". I've also heard of transf**s, people who have gender reassignment surgery, but still want to be with people of the sex they desire to become. It's a little confusing. Gender identity deals simply with what a person feels like he or she should have been born with. Sexual orientation deals with what a person is attracted to. As for bisexuals, I think it would be difficult to be in a relationship with one in the first place, and I'm not trying to be mean or anything. I just don't see how a person can be attracted to both genders, what with our physical and biological appearances. I simply don't understand how a bisexual could be in a longtime relationship, especially if they swing both ways (unless it was... polyamourous in nature). When it comes to transgendered issues, I could see myself with an MtF, but I don't know if I can be with an FtM because I can't see myself with a man for my life... (Personally speaking.) So I can also see the issues among couples where one suddenly decides to change their gender.
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Posted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 3:39 pm
I wasn't thinking it was because they wanted to be "normal" but I suppose that's a much simpler way of saying what I was trying to explain, haha.
I think that was what Klikk was saying, except without those terms.
I've never heard those before but don't take me as an authority on this.
I've never researched it.
Gender identity and sexuality seem like they should be related so I must have just decided that they are.
(Even though they aren't.)
I have a friend that is bisexual and has been in a relationship for close to two years and is planning on much longer.
I'm not saying you're wrong, because I know a lot of very promiscuous bisexuals, but they can be in a long term relationship.
Any sexuality can be difficult to be with or have an open relationship.
I think it depends more on the person than the sexuality.
I have a friend that's hardcore lesbian, men hold absolutely no interest to her, but her girlfriend and her had an open relationship.
Her girlfriend even had a boyfriend as well, she was bisexual, but my friend was alright with it because she was allowed to sleep with other girls.
And they had a great relationship, they broke up a while ago though because the bisexual girlfriend swung more to the men's side, she was more in love with her boyfriend, but she still wants a "friends with benefits" relationship with my friend.
.......Wait, I just proved your point, didn't I?
Not to sound rude or nosey, but are you bisexual, Black?
I've always assumed you were female because of your avatar.
But I'm just curious because you're talking about being with both genders.
(You don't have to answer me if you don't want to, I am being kind of nosey.)
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Posted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 3:52 pm
Yes that was pretty much what I was trying to say.
c:
I suck at writing my thoughts down.
I honestly couldnt dissagree more with the whole bisexual thing though,
since determination to stay in a commited relationship depends on your personality and not sexuality.
And if it's possible staying in a relationship with one man even if you still find other men attractive I don't see how it should be all that much more difficult being in a commited relationship with a man just because you still find other men and women attractive.
But then that is just my opinion, and I'm straight so I cannot speak from my own personal experience with that,
but I can however say I know severel bisexual people that have been in a commited relationship for a few years and are quite unlikely to be changing that anytime soon.
Hell, a friend of mine is dating a bisexual guy and has been for about 4 years now and pretty much everyone realises thats one relationship that pretty much destined too become a marriage.
Sorry if I sound slightly bitchy but,
it's just some of the people I know who are bi have complained about people throwing that steriotype in their face and well...they found it rather unfair and hurtfull in most cases.
So yah.
I tend to be a bit snappish when I hear that.
Sorry.
=/
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Posted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 4:05 pm
Nah, it's alright klikk.
I can understand what you're saying.
And I can understand why that would be very hurtful to bisexuals.
People really don't trust bisexuals though?
I don't give much stock to stereotypes so I never really considered it.
I just knew it was there.
My ex boyfriend was bisexual and sometimes we'd talk about what guys were cute, haha.
I'm thinking I'm either going through some sexually confused stage or I'm bisexual and I just talk about girls when hanging out with guys, though I've not "come out" because I've got a more scientific/logical mind and want some proof before I do, they've never seemed to think any differently of me.
Maybe it's just my experience.
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Posted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 2:00 pm
... wink lol. I'm not bisexual, Zizzy. I am, IRL, a woman, and I am a lesbian. I have no interest in men when it comes to romantic relationships. Well, perhaps more or less, I'm interested in more feminine types than I am masculine. I can see myself with an MtF, because they are more feminine and they believe that they were supposed to have been born a female, but if it was a FtM.... I don't think I could deal with that. It's been really confusing since my friend started talking to me about this... That was what I was trying to mean... However, unlike my best friend, I feel very comfortable with my body (cept I need a diet rofl ). Therefore, I don't plan on changing my sex. I am a woman who prefers to be with women. And you're not being nosy, Zizzy. blaugh Mayhaps there's something inside me that still wants to become straight. (My family is Pentecoastal Christians, and lots of them don't like gay people. sweatdrop ) But being around my buddy, and seeing how she's upset with her body and believes that she should've been born a male, I've been having a lot of internal debates over my own orientation. It's extremely weird because well... this best friend was also my first girl crush. ( redface ) And, well, I still kinda, sorta... have feelings for her, but I don't. I'm always going to be there for her whenever she needs it, but at the same time... it's tough knowing she's going to be a he. I suppose I've gotten a bit confusing... sweatdrop Well, as for your friends who broke up, I think that is less about being bisexual, and more or less being in a polyamourous relationship, (which, if I'm right, means people who are in a relationship, but still enjoy sleeping with others. Think of it kind of like swingers.) Hmmm... perhaps, I, too am being rather discriminatory to bisexuals. And if so, I apologize. Especially with my own current situation. sweatdrop
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Posted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 3:57 pm
Okay, makes a lot more sense now.
I just feel so awkward poking into people's lives like that. xD
That's cool though.
That's really tough though.
Kind of like a friend I have.
For a while he was in a relationship with another man, but his family is hardcore Mormon, as was he up until then.
I can see how that would be confusing though!
That sounds difficult.
It's good you're still supporting her.
Yeah, probably more the polyamorous nature of the relationship rather than her bisexuality.
But it's cool.
We've all got our hangups.
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Posted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 5:13 pm
lol, nah, you're not prodding. You just want to learn more about the people around you. blaugh
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Reply
