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 Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2005 3:42 pm
After watching this gruesome videos about the hells...I am scared of them. Well not in a way that theyre under my bed or in my closet I mean that I dont want to chant Amitabha out of fear or want to be kind to others just because "I have to" or because "You will go to hell" and all that crap.
Any advice?
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Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 12:54 pm
I think it's wise to keep in mind that the idea of the Hells in Buddhism can be viewed in either a literal sense, or a psychological sense, and both are equally valid. Hell as a hungry ghost would be one of a substance abuser, or someone addicted sexually. Hell as an animal would be as someone who gave into every impulse, every emotion, every thought - allowing their egoes to consume them. We can see how these different hells can be immediately present in our lives, if we choose to create them.
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Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 2:23 pm
[ Jizo Bosatsu ] I think it's wise to keep in mind that the idea of the Hells in Buddhism can be viewed in either a literal sense, or a psychological sense, and both are equally valid. Hell as a hungry ghost would be one of a substance abuser, or someone addicted sexually. Hell as an animal would be as someone who gave into every impulse, every emotion, every thought - allowing their egoes to consume them. We can see how these different hells can be immediately present in our lives, if we choose to create them. So you mean that this fear of the hells...I created it..not because of the hells but I created my own hell in my mind...built from my own fear?
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Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2005 11:07 am
Shokai So you mean that this fear of the hells...I created it..not because of the hells but I created my own hell in my mind...built from my own fear? * nods* Of course, such is only my opinion on the matter, so you're free to reject it if you find it implausible. We tend to create for ourselves, ever moment and without disruption, our own Hells or our own Celestial Realms. Nirvana and Samsara exist side by side, simultaneously. They are not separate "places."
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Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2005 1:33 pm
What do you mean "Places"? >_< But then...is there a way I can get out of my own hell? or out of it somehow?
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Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2005 8:51 pm
Shokai What do you mean "Places"? I mean that Nirvana isn't like some other physical place that you go to once you reach enlightenment. It's not like getting in a boat and going to another country. biggrin Shokai But then...is there a way I can get out of my own hell? or out of it somehow? Here's a nice koan which I feel answers your question: "A high-ranking officer in the T'ang dynasty presented a famous Ch'an master the following riddle: 'A long time ago, a man kept a goose in a bottle. The goose grew larger and larger until it couldn't get out of the bottle anymore. He didn't want to break the bottle, nor did he wish to harm the goose. How would you get it out?' "The Ch'an master was silent for a few moments, then suddenly shouted, 'Oh, Officer!' "'Yes?' "'It's out!'"
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Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 2:49 pm
[ Jizo Bosatsu ] Shokai What do you mean "Places"? I mean that Nirvana isn't like some other physical place that you go to once you reach enlightenment. It's not like getting in a boat and going to another country. biggrin Shokai But then...is there a way I can get out of my own hell? or out of it somehow? Here's a nice koan which I feel answers your question: "A high-ranking officer in the T'ang dynasty presented a famous Ch'an master the following riddle: 'A long time ago, a man kept a goose in a bottle. The goose grew larger and larger until it couldn't get out of the bottle anymore. He didn't want to break the bottle, nor did he wish to harm the goose. How would you get it out?' "The Ch'an master was silent for a few moments, then suddenly shouted, 'Oh, Officer!' "'Yes?' "'It's out!'" *sigh* I sort of understand about the Goose...keyword..sort of....Koans arent really my thing >_<"
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Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2005 7:55 am
We could re-word the koan like this: "There is a Gaian named Shokai inside his own hell. He wants to get out but doesn't want to injure himself, and can't break hell. How would you get him out?" "Oh, Officer!" "Yes?" "He's out!" ================================ What I mean to say is: Be yourself. You are already perfect. If you try to improve your situation you have fundamentally misunderstood your situation. You haven't yet recognized the innate, effortless perfection of the present moment. I don't mean this to be a "quick! Do nothing!" suggestion, however. What I'm saying is that if you always grasp for a Pure Land, or Nirvana, or some other place, thinking that the current situation you find yourself in is Hell, then you miss out. You're always grasping for something else, and you've failed to notice what is happening right here, right now. Try to make friends with yourself and your circumstances. Slow down, breathe, and just relax into what is, as it is happening. Then you'll see that you're not trapped in the bottle at all. You've been outside of it the entire time! biggrin
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Akanishi Makoto Vice Captain
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Posted: Sun Dec 25, 2005 10:36 am
Quote: Once upon a time, a man with a certain military bearing approached the Zen master Hakuin and asked: "Master, do Heaven and Hell actually exist?" The master wanted to answer in the affirmative, but knew that this would give the man a false impression. In all likelihood the man operated under the mundane paradigm that Heaven and Hell exist as places for souls in the afterlife. The master knew what he must do to break through that false preconception. "What is your occupation?" He asked. "I'm a general." This explained the military bearing about him. The master burst out laughing. "What idiot would ask you to command an army? You look more like a butcher to me!" This enraged the general. With a roar he drew his sword. He could cut down this defenseless old man in an instant. "Here lie the gates of Hell," said the master. These simple words stopped the powerful general dead in his tracks. Realization flooded in. The general sudden understood that the master had risked his life in order to teach him a great truth in the most effective way imaginable. "Forgive me, master, for what I was able to do." He felt all at once gratitude, amazement, and shame. "Here lie the gates of Heaven," said the master. All things are constructs of mind. Mind creates, and mind destroys. To see mind as what it truly is, is to see the Buddha in the Lotus. Heaven and Hell, Man and Woman, Life, Death, Night, Day - these are all constructs of Mind. We must break down these constructs and strike at their roots to percieve and to pierce their existence, and to understant our own.
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Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 10:14 am
[ Jizo Bosatsu ] A high-ranking officer in the T'ang dynasty presented a famous Ch'an master the following riddle: 'A long time ago, a man kept a goose in a bottle. The goose grew larger and larger until it couldn't get out of the bottle anymore. He didn't want to break the bottle, nor did he wish to harm the goose. How would you get it out?' "The Ch'an master was silent for a few moments, then suddenly shouted, 'Oh, Officer!' "'Yes?' "'It's out!'" Wait a minute....but the goose wouldnt be in the bottle in the first place? and if the goose grew large wouldn't he have broken the bottle already?
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Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 4:18 am
Shokai Jizo Bosatsu A high-ranking officer in the T'ang dynasty presented a famous Ch'an master the following riddle: 'A long time ago, a man kept a goose in a bottle. The goose grew larger and larger until it couldn't get out of the bottle anymore. He didn't want to break the bottle, nor did he wish to harm the goose. How would you get it out?' "The Ch'an master was silent for a few moments, then suddenly shouted, 'Oh, Officer!' "'Yes?' "'It's out!'" Wait a minute....but the goose wouldnt be in the bottle in the first place? and if the goose grew large wouldn't he have broken the bottle already?
You're thinking of it too logically. The goose was in the bottle in the first place, but it did not grow large enough to break it. Try to think about this koan without thinking about it.
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Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 2:13 pm
[ Jizo Bosatsu ] I think it's wise to keep in mind that the idea of the Hells in Buddhism can be viewed in either a literal sense, or a psychological sense, and both are equally valid. Hell as a hungry ghost would be one of a substance abuser, or someone addicted sexually. Hell as an animal would be as someone who gave into every impulse, every emotion, every thought - allowing their egoes to consume them. We can see how these different hells can be immediately present in our lives, if we choose to create them. Wow because of that my entire list (it was a big one) of questions on buddhism are answered. Thank you so much.
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Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 3:45 pm
[ Jizo Bosatsu ] You're thinking of it too logically. The goose was in the bottle in the first place, but it did not grow large enough to break it. Try to think about this koan without thinking about it. Grrr...You and your koans confused
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Posted: Wed Mar 01, 2006 1:41 am
Fearing the Hells ? It sounds like something a Monotheist might say ... sweatdrop Well, I not trying to make a biased remark (since a lot of monotheist that I know, don't really bother about hell much) but well, the stereotypical one (that you see going around with doomsday claims) would. Jizo Bosatsu We could re-word the koan like this: "There is a Gaian named Shokai inside his own hell. He wants to get out but doesn't want to injure himself, and can't break hell. How would you get him out?" "Oh, Officer!" "Yes?" "He's out!" ================================ What I mean to say is: Be yourself. You are already perfect. If you try to improve your situation you have fundamentally misunderstood your situation. You haven't yet recognized the innate, effortless perfection of the present moment. I don't mean this to be a "quick! Do nothing!" suggestion, however. What I'm saying is that if you always grasp for a Pure Land, or Nirvana, or some other place, thinking that the current situation you find yourself in is Hell, then you miss out. You're always grasping for something else, and you've failed to notice what is happening right here, right now. Try to make friends with yourself and your circumstances. Slow down, breathe, and just relax into what is, as it is happening. Then you'll see that you're not trapped in the bottle at all. You've been outside of it the entire time! biggrin Ha ... Jizo is right. ( he is pretty good at koans ... sweatdrop ) He means that you are trying to get out of an illusion that you have created on yourself ... sweatdrop Well, just like being bounded by fear ... which is a product of ignorance, a lot of things that we may fear without knowing its true nature until we really see it as what it is and realise how foolish we were in the past. sweatdrop
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Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2006 5:39 pm
what exactly is the buddhist idea of hell? and are there like multiple hells
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