|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
 Posted: Thu Dec 24, 2009 12:01 pm
First of all, I am posting this here because I think it is fair for the entire guild to see it and not just the mods
So here it is, I have decided to quit the guild. For a while I have felt that the founders of this guild have run it like a clubhouse (fair enough since they are the founders) but without telling all of the members what it is they do not agree with or why they kick members out or deny certain members re-admittance. Which turns it more into a very exclusive club where the wrong impression or misunderstanding turns you into an outcast.
There is also the part that says that no drama is allowed except the drama that belongs to the mods. If a member does not like another member, why force them to play nice? Why take one side over another? As long as the two members can be adults about it there should be no issue- that is the exact message I was given when I disagreed with Artea in the past. So now that we have a member that disagreed with a mod, its a different story?
The funny part about being a member of this guild is that we know each other rather well, most of us have talked in person or over the phone even if we live far away from each other. So when I say that our moderators know how to hold a grudge, I can say it with experience.
The sad part is that I no longer care if the moderators never say another word to me, after knowing them for 3 years and the past year being a whole year with no contact except in the forum it does not bother me. I have made every effort to be a friend even though my life has moved past the part where I saw them every day and hung out together on a regular basis. A true friend does not put limitations on the relationship: they call when they need help and show up when you need help.
I am quitting the guild not because of its members, I appreciate and like each of the members for whom they are and if they want, will stay in contact with them. But I no longer wish to have anything to do with the moderators in their selective morals and criticisms. I feel that the moderators moved from being friends to being acquaintances and now to people I no longer know at all.
It is not just about the online world of the 13th Floor, I am well aware of the things that are said behind my back. You may not be aware of it but I have heard several times from other people about conversations our mods have had about me and my personality. If you have an issue- say it to my face and stop whining about it behind my back. Much easier to say it out loud then to waste a year wondering if I got the hint yet while you laugh behind my back. Beyond the treatment of the moderators both online and IRL, I have to say I will miss the rest of the guild and the friendships built here.
|
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Dec 24, 2009 12:20 pm
I love oki.
Passive aggressive needs cured, agreed.
heart
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Dec 24, 2009 12:33 pm
Outlaw Stride I love oki. Passive aggressive needs cured, agreed. heart love ya too outlaw, see ya in the new guild
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Dec 24, 2009 1:28 pm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Malevolent Conversationalist
|
Posted: Thu Dec 24, 2009 5:21 pm
With all due respect Oki, Outlaw never was kicked out of the guild. He left after being very insulting and cruel to myself and Dawn Arrow. We preferred to let him leave in peace rather then drag the whole mess all over the guild.
I see it as something that happened between three people, and was a private affair no one else needed to weigh in on. I find it quite immature and insidious of him to go complaining to other members about something he refused to address with us.
As for weighing in on who is allowed in the guild or not, there are clear and concise rules set forth by the guild founders as to what behavior is allowed and what isn't. Outlaw violated several of these rules, and continued to harass certain members of the guild.
As for your personal issues with myself and the other moderators I wasn't under the impression there was a problem, and if there is one I'd be happy to address it with you in a less public fashion. Better to discuss the problem like adults, as you said, rather then smear it all over the guild and make other members uncomfortable.
As it is,I wish you well in the future, and am sorry things worked out the way they did.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Dec 24, 2009 7:03 pm
That never happened, I offered apologies to everyone.
Several times over months of time and received no responses.
Save your charity for yourself. And, your assumption that I did anything underhanded is revealing in itself.
I once again extended peace and goodwill this time, so your stories are splitting their seams.
You never intended to either address this issue nor my apologies as referenced in the PM I have received.
My re-admittance and subsequent ability to discuss what happened was accidental per Renton, according to you.
I am not rehashing anything, I made my statement of goodwill.
If you choose to throw it back in my face, that's on you.
Enjoy yourselves, this could have ended with a simple goodbye many months ago. Sadly, those keystrokes never did get struck.
Until now,'
Goodbye and best wishes.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Malevolent Conversationalist
|
Posted: Thu Dec 24, 2009 7:19 pm
Yes Outlaw, you apologized and then did the same thing, you apologized and then acted rude and abusive, you apologized again and we accepted you, you then accused me of administrator abuse and cussed me out, after which I assumed we had nothing left to say.
Said goodbye? A simple Goodbye? Outlaw, you stalked the guild, demanding attention, demanding we accept you and your attitude, if we disagreed with you, you hemmed and hawed, whined and cussed, I'm sorry, but your behavior was contemptuous and I see nothing much has changed.
Yes Renton accepted you back into the guild by accident, he wouldn't have done it intentionally as you'd already proven you were not true to your word, or gracious as a member of the guild.
My assumption that you did something underhanded? Harassment in the form of erotic poetry to the guild leader as well as misusing the Legion thread as a means to take out your frustration on fellow guild members are just two of the ways you harassed the mods.
I tell you, and you as well Oki, many guild members from other guilds have been banned for much less. Though Outlaw was only banned after multiple requests of his own to do so.
This comes down to one man's word against another, so I won't bother trying to argue with you, I merely want to state what I saw happening. You Outlaw have succeeded in turning this disagreement into a smear campaign to satisfy your own selfish need for attention, I'm sorry to dignify it with this much type, but if its a matter of two stories,it'd be best if both were heard. I'm sorry to see you confirm the misgivings I had about allowing you back on the guild, but glad I won't have to worry about trusting you again.
Goodbye Outlaw, I see no point in banning you, better to ignore you and take away the fuel for your frustrated flames.
Again Oki, I'm sorry you feel the way you do, and I wish you well elsewhere on Gaia, your always welcome here.
I'm saddened that this is what we have reduced this meeting place to, a forum board on which to shake fists or spit venom at each other. This is Perverse, Inexcusable, and Unnecessary. These are my final words on the events that transpired I feel sorry they needed to be said at all.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Dec 24, 2009 8:08 pm
Well.. I turn around for one munite and everything falls apart.
This place always had to hunt for new members.. or buy.. I remember offering 1000 gold prizes for contests and bugging a bunch of friends on my list by the droves only to sporadically get one who posts once and then never again..
That's why they were deleted.. they didn't come back for half a year, or only posted once - the older threads have proof..
Outlaw's was the only one we've had all year!.. and.. then this happens..
It's cool that we get people when we do, but not many bother staying.. I've tried coming up with addictive games to suck people in long enough to know each other, but .... doesn't seem to be everyone's cup of tea.
Idk.. I should be in church.. 6.6..
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Malevolent Conversationalist
|
Posted: Thu Dec 24, 2009 8:14 pm
Honestly shadow, I never felt the need to play games to stay entertained on the guild, and I hope you've never felt the need to perform to bring in new members...That's never been the focus,nor should it be.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Fri Dec 25, 2009 11:34 am
....what happened? sweatdrop
edit: on second thought it's probably best I don't know
I can be very opinionated about the way moderators should (in my own opinion) act and I'd hate to cause more drama
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 1:21 am
I know I’m probably kicking a dead horse by addressing Oki and Outlaw when they’ve already left, but as Guild Captain I feel it’s still my responsibility to respond to any outstanding issues, no matter how late I arrive. I hope these next few posts provide a clear view of how I analyze and handle issues brought to my attention, and provide each of you with a sense of comfort at having me lead this Guild.
Please, if I’ve ever done anything to make you feel personally uncomfortable or angry here on the 13th Floor, let me know, or tell someone who you feel can bring about necessary changes here. This Guild was created to grow and adapt with its Members, but we can only make it better if someone stands up and says something.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 1:23 am
To address your first statement, Oki, I’d like to point out that the Room Service sub-forum is and has always been public, not a place for Moderators to keep issues conveniently covered from the public eye. However, I understand you wanted to have your say by the most visible means, and so you posted this in the main forum to grab the attention of our active Guildmates. That’s fine, but once I’ve finished my responses and the issue is considered resolved (by all, not just myself), I will move this thread to its proper place. Anyone who wishes to will be able to check this thread at any time.
You claim that the Moderators kick people out unfairly, using their power whimsically rather than with logic and a sense of justice. To narrow things down a bit, I’m the only Moderator here who has ever banned members, and I can list every time I banned a person and give you the exact reason for his/her dismissal.
- The first time I banned two members was due to their disruptive bickering around other members. They’d been given fair warning beforehand, and after a short probation period were readmitted into the Guild and offered reimbursement for the joining fee.
- The second time I banned members was during a Guild Clean-Up, to make sure that people who didn’t have the time or interest to participate on the 13th Floor were taken off of the Guild Roster. Before I went through with this, I posted an announcement thread to gather the opinions of my fellow Guildmates, and to give those who lurk but post little a chance to make their voices heard. After my proposal was approved, I went through with it and made sure to tell every dismissed member the reason for their banning, and to let them know that they were welcome to return at any time with a full reimbursement from my personal funds.
- The third (and currently last) time that I’ve banned a member was at Outlaw Stride’s own request. His reasons are his own.
Next, you said that I have prohibited all “drama” but that which belongs to the Mods, here on the 13th Floor. Nowhere in this Guild have I or any other Moderators decreed such, and to expect complete compliance and complacence in any community would be unrealistic and inane. I have set rules in place only to encourage smooth interactions, and to help handle any arising issues. I have asked each member to Respect one another, Write Legibly enough so that we can communicate comfortably, and to have Decency when posting comments or interests that may be uncomfortable or offensive to their fellow Guildmates. You can find all of these on the ever-present 13th Floor’s Terms of Participation thread.
Rules were established to handle conflict, Oki, not to ignore it. If I believed that only my “drama” was relevant and that no one had the right to stand against me, why didn’t I just ban you and Outlaw, delete this thread and any related posts, and return to my dictatorial club-house regime? Instead, I intend to thoroughly respond to every poster here, and do my best to answer or fix everything called into question. If a change needs to be made, it will be.
Also, a few words of advice: Be careful when you say that you’re leaving because of the unfair treatment of the Moderators, as Shin-Maruku, Renton Noah, and Shadowmanxp are listed as Mods as well, and I’m almost certain that you only meant me and KiraFaithful when you posted your complaint. So, unless you do mean to lob them into the same category you’ve set for us, please be more specific.
You say that I’ve chosen to run this Guild as a club-house, that I am secretive, even underhanded, when dealing with the Guild’s issues, and am obtuse when it comes to others’ concerns and feelings. I was honestly not aware that I had such failings as Guild Captain.
I have always made it a point to ask the opinions and advice of my fellow Guildmates, to participate as a friend and not as some superior with a fancy title, and to be fair with my judgments when any issues arose. I have also asked that people come and tell me if they feel I’m wronging them or someone else (and not just on this thread), so thank you for taking your time to explain your feelings about how you think I’ve abused this Guild.
However, more personal issues deserve personal attention and treatment; they should not be slathered across a public forum. If you believe there’s a problem between you and the Moderators, particularly in the back-stabbing, name-smearing, irl sense, I’d prefer if you’d contact me and talk about it rather than leaving vague and cryptic hints lying about the Guild.
To close, I’d like to remind you that no one asked you to quit the Guild and leave, Oki. You say that you “will miss the rest of the Guild and the friendships built here” as if those bonds can only be maintained here on the 13th Floor. If that is the extent of your friendship, then it should be clear that you are the only one who’s cutting ties. I guess this is good-bye.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 1:24 am
Kira, now that I’ve found the time to address this thread, I’d like to discuss your posts privately when we get the chance.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 1:25 am
Outlaw, I only have one thing to address with you. You said “this could have ended with a simple good-bye months ago.” I did say good-bye, but I also said that I was finished talking with you after several days of fruitless conversation and fighting.
If my lack of a response to your PMs thereafter came as a surprise, allow me to explain my shocking behavior one last time: Our friendship came to an end long ago, and I will not waste my time or energy on speaking with you any longer. Good-bye.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 1:26 am
Shadow, I fail to see the relevance your post holds in this thread. There was neither call nor need to coerce or bribe Gaians to become members of this Guild. My searches for new members were only ever conducted in the hopes of meeting interesting new people who were looking to join a fun guild and interact with other members.
What, if anything, are you implying?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Reply
