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 Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 12:01 am
I'm a Christian, Presbyterian, but evangelicals and other zealot-like Christian groups/people REALLY bother me! I don't like their overall attitude or how some of them want to convert just about EVERY non-Christian they meet. I am a firm believer in letting everyone decide for themselves what path they want to walk in life. I will ask questions on why someone believes a certain thing and perhaps discuss it with them, but I will NEVER try to convert anyone unless, for some odd reason, they want to be converted (still haven't met anyone who has wanted to be converted and don't think I ever will).
Anyone else want to add their thoughts?
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 12:20 am
They believe that the only way to have everlasting life is to be Christian so they try to save others.
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 12:22 am
Thank you for that piece of information.
And would you mind if I asked for your honest opinion, what you truly of evangelicals and their "customs"?
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 12:31 am
I don't condone it. I think it's a disgusting practise.
Proselytising should be illegal.
Knocking on doors should be illegal.
Protesting on the street should be illegal.
Preaching in public should be illegal.
I absolutely 100% do not believe you need Jesus to be a good person and have a place in the afterlife, if there is one. If G-d is all loving then there is no way that he would condemn someone to hell simply for not believing in him.
That, IMHO, is narcissistic, demanding, hatred, and intolerance.
HaShem did not create us all the same. We have different races, cultures, traditions, customs and laws for a reason, why the hell should be assume that HaShem expects us to all be Christian?
If G-d wanted us all to be Christian we wouldn't have so much diversity in our world.
Free-will is not a good excuse for this one. We're simply not all meant to be the same and be able to understand the same things. We're not clones.
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 12:37 am
Well IMR, there goes Civil liberties and tolerance right there. I'd think about what you are saying from a secular view rather than a religious view before you make such sweeping generalizations there.
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 12:47 am
rmcdra has a point there. Freedom of speech. It is a narrow-minded, almost stupid thing to go around trying to get people to abandon their beliefs, but people have a right to express their beliefs. On a moral level, I strongly believe it shouldn't be done. But on a human rights level (from an American standpoint here) it must be allowed, lest the Bill of Rights be submerged into hypocrisy.
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 12:50 am
rmcdra Well IMR, there goes Civil liberties and tolerance right there. I'd think about what you are saying from a secular view rather than a religious view before you make such sweeping generalizations there. I really don't think it's right to be preaching. I don't. Have you seen all the hate that gets posted on youtube? All the videos of people throwing insults at one another? What about a Phelps demonstration? rmcdra, it depends, you have to be bringing positive energy into this world. From a religious view, if you follow the Abrahamic G-d, you are a righteous person.
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 1:10 am
Blanket statements are so much fun....
I am an Evangelical, and I do not try and convert people. I am pretty firm in believing that only God can call people to Himself. However, if I am talking to my friends, Jesus or the Gospel does sometimes come up, and I will talk to my friends about both, just like they talk to me about whatever it is they believe in and structure their lives around.
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 1:16 am
In Medias Res IV I really don't think it's right to be preaching. I don't Then how can new information in the public be presented. By the technical definition of preaching, any from of advertising is preaching. Quote: Have you seen all the hate that gets posted on youtube? I don't look for that stuff. I have no desire to because I just give such things one more "point" of popularity. Yes I hear some pretty nasty things about gnosticism but I find it useful because I learn how others view my sect and am able to provide information on what is misconception and what is fact. Without feedback, negative or positive, there is no way for one to measure. Quote: All the videos of people throwing insults at one another? What about a Phelps demonstration? I've seen but I don't go actively looking for that garbage. The best way to protest against an ideology is to not give it any attention. The worst kind of publicity is no publicity. Quote: rmcdra, it depends, you have to be bringing positive energy into this world. One doesn't have to do anything. I agree with being positive and encouraging others to be positive but where does draw the line of being a teacher or a dictator. Quote: From a religious view, if you follow the Abrahamic G-d, you are a righteous person. Then what of your pagan or atheist friends, are they not righteous? I'm not attacking you here but asking you to think about what you are saying. I know you don't think about them that way based on our previous encounters in the forums but what you have posted here can be... misconstrued as such.
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 1:22 am
comfortably_dumb Blanket statements are so much fun.... I am an Evangelical, and I do not try and convert people. I am pretty firm in believing that only God can call people to Himself. However, if I am talking to my friends, Jesus or the Gospel does sometimes come up, and I will talk to my friends about both, just like they talk to me about whatever it is they believe in and structure their lives around. Well then you're not the kind of evangelical I'm talking about, now are you? You know I just joined this guild all of an hour ago and I've noticed that most people are extremely technical with these topics and seem to just look at the text rather than the meaning. Not attacking anyone, but that's how I see it. And I'd appreciate it if you explained how you have been "taught", so to speak, about religion as an evangelical.
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 1:27 am
Korn On A Stik comfortably_dumb Blanket statements are so much fun.... I am an Evangelical, and I do not try and convert people. I am pretty firm in believing that only God can call people to Himself. However, if I am talking to my friends, Jesus or the Gospel does sometimes come up, and I will talk to my friends about both, just like they talk to me about whatever it is they believe in and structure their lives around. Well then you're not the kind of evangelical I'm talking about, now are you? You know I just joined this guild all of an hour ago and I've noticed that most people are extremely technical with these topics and seem to just look at the text rather than the meaning. Not attacking anyone, but that's how I see it. And I'd appreciate it if you explained how you have been "taught", so to speak, about religion as an evangelical. All I am saying is that not every Evangelical is a Fundamentalist who goes around screaming at everyone to repent of their sins or they will burn forever in hell. And I do not understand your question. Please elaborate on what information you would like from me.
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 1:31 am
In a sense, I'd like you to tell what it means to be an evangelical. What your beliefs are, really.
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 1:34 am
rmcdra In Medias Res IV I really don't think it's right to be preaching. I don't Then how can new information in the public be presented. By the technical definition of preaching, any from of advertising is preaching. Quote: Have you seen all the hate that gets posted on youtube? I don't look for that stuff. I have no desire to because I just give such things one more "point" of popularity. Yes I hear some pretty nasty things about gnosticism but I find it useful because I learn how others view my sect and am able to provide information on what is misconception and what is fact. Without feedback, negative or positive, there is no way for one to measure. Quote: All the videos of people throwing insults at one another? What about a Phelps demonstration? I've seen but I don't go actively looking for that garbage. The best way to protest against an ideology is to not give it any attention. The worst kind of publicity is no publicity. Quote: rmcdra, it depends, you have to be bringing positive energy into this world. One doesn't have to do anything. I agree with being positive and encouraging others to be positive but where does draw the line of being a teacher or a dictator. Quote: From a religious view, if you follow the Abrahamic G-d, you are a righteous person. Then what of your pagan or atheist friends, are they not righteous? I'm not attacking you here but asking you to think about what you are saying. I know you don't think about them that way based on our previous encounters in the forums but what you have posted here can be... misconstrued as such. I'm getting really tired here, let's see if I can fix this fudge up. There should just be guidelines when it comes to preaching. If you go to someone's door and you say no and they persist, that should count as harassment. If you're standing on the street corner, you should wait for people to come to you, not you to them. It's just obtrusive at times. I see the same billboard every.single.day. from a Christian group "We Regret Our Abortions, Do You?", and I can't help but think how a woman driving along the road, who has had an abortion for whatever reason, would feel when they see this everyday. People should preach only to those who actively come to them, if they say "no, go away" then that's what should happen. I have had people call churches multiple times asking them to not send people to their door and they simply don't listen. There should just be limits. Overkill will drive people away. Hrm, as for righteousness, that's only what the Orthodoxy believes, however, it's sketchy.Rabbi Shmuley Boteach personally believes that an atheist who is a good person has a spot in the afterlife before a Christian who schleps his way through life. In any case, I live in the here and now. I don't do good for the promise of rewards, I could care less, all I care about is making my life the best it can be and helping others in the process.
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 1:40 am
Okay, sure.
I believe that the Bible is the inspired word of God, and I believe in what the Bible has to say.
I believe that Jesus is both God and man. God-man.
I believe that it is required to be born again, or regenerated as the Bible calls it, and to be a Christian, you are given a new heart by the grace of God.
I believe in predestination, but I also believe in free will that God gives us.
I believe that we are saved through faith alone, but after we are saved, we must do something with our salvation, i.e. be sanctified.
And lastly, I do believe that the Gospel is good news, and is to be shared, but not to be shared in an imposing way.
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 1:50 am
comfortably_dumb Okay, sure. I believe that the Bible is the inspired word of God, and I believe in what the Bible has to say. I believe that Jesus is both God and man. God-man. I believe that it is required to be born again, or regenerated as the Bible calls it, and to be a Christian, you are given a new heart by the grace of God. I believe in predestination, but I also believe in free will that God gives us. I believe that we are saved through faith alone, but after we are saved, we must do something with our salvation, i.e. be sanctified. And lastly, I do believe that the Gospel is good news, and is to be shared, but not to be shared in an imposing way. Thank you very much for that comfortably_dumb. And (waaaay off topic here) is your name a little spin off from the song "Comfortably Numb" by Pink Flyod?
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