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 Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 7:56 am
I'm not following the logic behind modern feminism, particularly on the sex issue.
It seems to me that the feminist movement is to not be objectified by men, am I correct on this? And to not be objectified by men, they decide to have rampant sex with almost anyone, in the name of "sexual liberation."
Hold on a minute, something seems off here. Let's parse this a bit.
Woman- "I'm sick of being objectified by men!"
Misogynist- "Uh-oh"
Woman- So I'm going to have sex with a lot of men, and then have an abortion if I get pregnant so neither of us have any responsibility!
Misogynist- ...ok...?
I mean, how is this logical, or reasonable? Why would you logically go from "I'm pissed that men want me only for my body" to "So I'm going to have relationships using only my body"?
It's like being against illegal drug use, but instead of stopping drug use, just legalizing all of the hard drugs so that they're all legal.
Instead of taking part in the objectification and going along with it equally, doesn't it take a stronger person to just say no to the objetfication of a soulless, loveless relationship based solely on the fact that she has a v****a?
I mean, I'm not saying that sexual liberation is wrong. But when the reasoning is so stupid and backwards and counterproductive, I can't accept that.
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Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 7:31 am
It depends on the feminist.
Some feminists believe life style has nothing to do with it. Others believe lifestyle is everything.
The more radical you get, the more it's about:
-asserting what makes you, you (In this case, feminine characteristics)
-doing what you need to do overcome the patriarchy.
The more liberal you get (the moderate end of gender debates) it's more about:
-Changing the "system": socialization, education, and law.
What a Feminist would say to you is that you're being sexist because you're saying women can't ever have sex without being objectified. You're not giving them power.
But I do for the most part agree with you.
Many feminists argue that to assert sexual agency is to assert your equality as a gender. But the problem is: We live in a female objectified society. There is little equilibrium in sexual expression. Because women are already the objectified and minority class, most acts of sexuality, on their part, are seen as submissive.
You both might benefit from sex but who can walk away the better 90% of the time? He can brag about you. He can leave you without signing papers. He doesn't need to get abortions. He can't get pregnant.
And then there's the Freudian view: She's getting impaled with flesh. If that doesn't scream the "Submissive sex" I don't know what does.
(p.s. I support most feminism).
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Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 4:24 pm
I understand the fact that they don't want to be objectified, but taking part in objectifying relationships, being either objectifying the man, the woman, or both, to prove that they can objectify equally, is going about it the wrong way.
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Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 9:47 pm
Agreed, feminism should be about making sex an equal-partners thing, not about objectifying the man in turn. It's like the blacks who want reparations for what happened to their ancestors, 200 years ago. Racism against whites does not make everyone equal, and neither does sexism against men.
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Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 1:51 pm
kp is dcvi And then there's the Freudian view: She's getting impaled with flesh. If that doesn't scream the "Submissive sex" I don't know what does. Or you could think of men as getting eaten by the v****a. surprised
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Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 7:43 pm
La Veuve Zin kp is dcvi And then there's the Freudian view: She's getting impaled with flesh. If that doesn't scream the "Submissive sex" I don't know what does. Or you could think of men as getting eaten by the v****a. surprised
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The Actual Princess Belle
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Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 8:31 pm
E. Coli Pie La Veuve Zin kp is dcvi And then there's the Freudian view: She's getting impaled with flesh. If that doesn't scream the "Submissive sex" I don't know what does. Or you could think of men as getting eaten by the v****a. surprised Stop it! You're too young to talk about this sort of thing! LALALALALALALALA
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Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 9:42 pm
I.Am E. Coli Pie La Veuve Zin kp is dcvi And then there's the Freudian view: She's getting impaled with flesh. If that doesn't scream the "Submissive sex" I don't know what does. Or you could think of men as getting eaten by the v****a. surprised Stop it! You're too young to talk about this sort of thing! LALALALALALALALA
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The Actual Princess Belle
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Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 9:42 pm
E. Coli Pie I.Am E. Coli Pie La Veuve Zin kp is dcvi And then there's the Freudian view: She's getting impaled with flesh. If that doesn't scream the "Submissive sex" I don't know what does. Or you could think of men as getting eaten by the v****a. surprised Stop it! You're too young to talk about this sort of thing! LALALALALALALALA Never! *Waves cane*
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Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 9:25 am
E. Coli Pie La Veuve Zin kp is dcvi And then there's the Freudian view: She's getting impaled with flesh. If that doesn't scream the "Submissive sex" I don't know what does. Or you could think of men as getting eaten by the v****a. surprised Wow this got R quickly.
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Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 10:58 am
kp is dcvi E. Coli Pie La Veuve Zin kp is dcvi And then there's the Freudian view: She's getting impaled with flesh. If that doesn't scream the "Submissive sex" I don't know what does. Or you could think of men as getting eaten by the v****a. surprised Wow this got R quickly. And she's not even allowed to watch R rated movies! crying
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Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 12:36 pm
I.Am kp is dcvi E. Coli Pie La Veuve Zin kp is dcvi And then there's the Freudian view: She's getting impaled with flesh. If that doesn't scream the "Submissive sex" I don't know what does. Or you could think of men as getting eaten by the v****a. surprised Wow this got R quickly. And she's not even allowed to watch R rated movies! crying
Anyway, we got kind of off-topic. ^ ^ My fault, I'm sorry.
About the original post: In my opinion, the idea that women can have sex freely is seen as a, well, freedom, because women are sick of men sleeping around freely and it considered normal, while women are labeled as sluts and whores for doing so. I think that's the idea behind it. It's good that women have that freedom these days, but I don't feel it makes much of a statement.
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Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 6:55 pm
Lorysa In my opinion, the idea that women can have sex freely is seen as a, well, freedom, because women are sick of men sleeping around freely and it considered normal, while women are labeled as sluts and whores for doing so. I think that's the idea behind it. It's good that women have that freedom these days, but I don't feel it makes much of a statement. THIS! Lorysa wins. Go see Saw V with me. You can watch, I can scream and cower. It's not like all feminists do this, but I'm pretty sure that's the reasoning behind the emotion and the statement. I can have sex with who I want, when I want, and I'm not a slut for it, I'm sexually free, just like a man. Even if she's being objectified, he's being objectified too, which is better than just her being objectified because it's equal. Personally, it doesn't appeal to me. The problem is, biologically women risk more. And so abortion is a way to biologically "equalize" it...thus a woman can have sex without risking giving birth, the same way a man can. It creates this idea that abortion makes us equal. The thing is, it's not true equality. There is no man out there who needs to kill to avoid giving birth. And instead of holding men accountable for their actions, everything is placed solely on the woman's shoulders so now she has the power, but also, the entire burden which is not the way it was intended. Men can get out of every obligation. Women are still stuck with them. Nothing's changed except that the price women pay for having sex and getting pregnant has risen.
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Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2008 9:54 am
Yay! I winned! 4laugh I'm not good at watching; I cover my ears, close my eyes and scream. It's fun!
You're right. Women have to go through a lot of crap, just for sex - the cost of abortion, and the cramping afterwards, and even just the decades of period cramps from puberty onward - it pretty much proves that men are sexually able to be free. We have to take pills to be free, and even then we're not.
It makes me sad that people think we love spitting out babies and hate sex and women. I don't want to be burdened by pregnancy myself. I want free sex as much as any choicer, but it just isn't as physically simple for women as it is for men.
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Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2008 11:44 am
Do women think guys are sexually free? That would be...most untrue.
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