|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
 Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 6:25 pm
I was having this discussion with my friend yesterday and thought I would see what the rest of you think. My friend says Harry Potter is simply a great fantasy story that is good to entertain but not good for much else. I, however, disagree. I think its amazing in that it teaches great lessons and the child doesn't even realize that they're learning them.
We discussed the following quotes. Let me know what you think of them and then state if you agree with my point of view or my friend's.
Quotes:
1. "The truth. It is a beautiful and terrible thing, and should therefore be treated with great caution."
2. "It takes a great deal of bravery to stand up to our enemies, but just as much to stand up to our friends."
3. "It is our choices, Harry, that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities."
4. "You place too much importance...on the so-called purity of blood! You fail to recognize that it matters not what someone is born, but what they grow to be!"
5. "You think the dead we loved ever truly leave us? You think that we don't recall them more clearly than ever in times of great trouble?....You know, Harry, in a way, you did see your father last night....You found him inside yourself."
|
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 6:38 pm
Here's what I think:
1. The truth is in fact beautiful and terrible and I'm sure we've all encountered both of those facets. I think this is an important quote. It teaches tact and prudence. The truth can be liberating or hurtful depending on how you choose to use it. It's important to really think about the consequences of our actions. The old saying "Sticks and stones will break my bones but words can never hurt me"is absolutely incorrect and this quote illustrates that perfectly. We can hurt people with the truth of our words just as surely as we can hurt them with "sticks and stones".
2. In my opinion it takes much more bravery to stand up to our friends. Although it's difficult to stand up to our enemies, it's much more so to stand up to our friends. We care about them and care about what they think and how they feel. Because of this, we often don't stand up to them out of fear. Not fear that we'll be hurt but fear that we'll be rejected or maybe even fear that we'll hurt them. This part shows that even though it was difficult to stand up to his friends, Neville did what was correct and was rewarded in the long run.
3 & 4. These two go hand in hand for me. It doesn't matter what we were born or what we can do, the important thing is what we choose to do with our abilities. This means that your destiny is ultimately up to you. You choose what you want to be with every choice you make. It matters not what you are today. The only thing that matters is what you make of yourself. This is a lesson I think we should all teach children. It's the Harry Potter version of "Be all you can be".
5. This was very important in my opinion. It teaches of loss and offers a certain measure of comfort. It says that love is everlasting and that the ones we love leave footprints on our hearts. They impact our lives and that can never be forgotten. They live in us through our memories and our continued love for them.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 10:16 pm
 These are interesting concepts you bring up, and I have heard from my friends and others, opinions and arguments all linked to the famed Harry Potter series. I love the series, I have always loved them all, but I do not think that Harry Potter is merely a fantasy to be enjoyed and absorbed greedily like a dish of ice cream. (I love ice cream...)
They are indeed filled with excitement and joy, but they are equally filled with trial, error, pain and sadness. Not only that, but we can learn from the characters and how they act. I talked with someone who said that they hated Harry Potter, not necessarily the books, but Harry Potter himself. He said that Harry was increasingly arrogant and stupid, he couldn't make the right choices and all of that stuff. It annoyed me that his shallow opinion of him might scar other's outlook on the books, and I seriously wanted to smack him upside the head. (okay, not that bad, but a piece of me was very sad.) Honestly, it was as if he expected the Hero of the novels to be perfect! What fun would that be if Harry had never fallen, lost a great deal but somehow stood back up again? You would lose the entire thread that builds up the collage of pieces sewn together to MAKE Harry Potter.
My favorite quote of the five is the third. That is extremely true. Harry never CHOSE to be "The Boy Who Lived" in fact, he would have very much liked if Voldemort left him alone, and he could have a normal life with his friends at Hogwarts. He COULD have used his strength for the wrong reasons. Harry was his father's son, but he was NOT his father. Harry was who he chose to be, even if it hurt to love and care and do what he should and wanted to do. Not only is Harry a symbol of Heroism, but there are so many other characters within the novels that portray trust, friendship and bravery. (Yay Neville in the 7th book!) I can't help but agree with you, the books have more than they lead on to.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 11:42 pm
Absolutely agree. I do believe that Harry Potter, unlike books such as Twilight etc, can be read on several levels. There are deep messages to be interpreted and the books have important things to say on a range of issues. JK Rowling is a very passionate woman, and a very intelligent woman, and her ideals come through.
Her books aren't simply fantasy, the themes in them help to shape all that read the books into accepting, liberal people; against discrimination in all forms, realizing the weight of their own actions (choices), selfless and understanding, independent (yet still realizing the importance of having strong networks) acknowledging the power of love and able to cope with death by being spiritual.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 6:33 am
Empress_Cat These are interesting concepts you bring up, and I have heard from my friends and others, opinions and arguments all linked to the famed Harry Potter series. I love the series, I have always loved them all, but I do not think that Harry Potter is merely a fantasy to be enjoyed and absorbed greedily like a dish of ice cream. (I love ice cream...)
They are indeed filled with excitement and joy, but they are equally filled with trial, error, pain and sadness. Not only that, but we can learn from the characters and how they act. I talked with someone who said that they hated Harry Potter, not necessarily the books, but Harry Potter himself. He said that Harry was increasingly arrogant and stupid, he couldn't make the right choices and all of that stuff. It annoyed me that his shallow opinion of him might scar other's outlook on the books, and I seriously wanted to smack him upside the head. (okay, not that bad, but a piece of me was very sad.) Honestly, it was as if he expected the Hero of the novels to be perfect! What fun would that be if Harry had never fallen, lost a great deal but somehow stood back up again? You would lose the entire thread that builds up the collage of pieces sewn together to MAKE Harry Potter.
My favorite quote of the five is the third. That is extremely true. Harry never CHOSE to be "The Boy Who Lived" in fact, he would have very much liked if Voldemort left him alone, and he could have a normal life with his friends at Hogwarts. He COULD have used his strength for the wrong reasons. Harry was his father's son, but he was NOT his father. Harry was who he chose to be, even if it hurt to love and care and do what he should and wanted to do. Not only is Harry a symbol of Heroism, but there are so many other characters within the novels that portray trust, friendship and bravery. (Yay Neville in the 7th book!) I can't help but agree with you, the books have more than they lead on to. I couldn't have said it better. Harry Potter is not a perfect hero and if anything that makes him more believable as a person. No one is perfect and I for one find that the reader grows right along with Harry Potter. Instead of Harry Potter being perfect and unconsciously preaching to the reader about what is right and wrong, the reader learns these lessons with Harry and learns from his mistakes. It is much more effective this way.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 6:58 am
Absolutely! That's part of the beauty of a good author, they aren't afraid to make mistakes-no one wants a perfect character, that is both discouraging and misleading. It isn't true and so many people now days want the character to be this all amazing person that can right all wrongs and solve any problem, the fact is, no one is that way. You CAN make them that way in books, but the point of the author is to make things realistic and believable, like I said, no one would have liked Harry Potter if he killed off Voldemort in the first book...honestly-what a crappy ending.
And another thing. A friend of mine commented that the books got old, that only the third one had some difference. She said that she always knew that Voldemort was behind it all, and it got old that there wasn't any other person. Honestly, in this life it is EXACTLY THE SAME, we just aren't reading between the pages to see it. It's like in history where we read in our books about some horrid war or some disappointing event that we CLAIM we would never do now. We LEARN from history and hopefully apply it in our future so that we DON'T do those things again. But in all reality, we are challenged with a lot of the same things now as always, but in different degrees.
What is Voldemort's way of life? Murder, Chaos, criminal acts, inducing fear, etc. Isn't that what terrorists and murderers do on a different scale? We can easily be seduced into becoming that way, embracing evil and forsaking the rest of the world to get our own selfish pleasure in whatever way that is. It is our choice not to-but either way we face the same things every day of our lives. (That is just ONE way, this same concept can be applied to numerous accounts, but seeing as I'm not in the mood to type them out, I'll just leave it at this one.) The fact that Voldemort was behind everything was like saying that the devil is behind everything-it's how life works, get over it. I suppose in a book my friend was expecting the enemies to change every book-that would have been unrealistic and stupid, ruining the classic style in which J.K. Rowling wrote it. I believe that it was more difficult for J.K. Rowling to stick with one villain instead of switching off. If you switched off and killed them off, there is no room for development on that character, and besides, if Voldemort had just LEFT Harry alone for once, what kind of evil would he be?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 8:18 am
Exactly. Even Voldemort's character was amazing. He was so much more than just a villain. JK did the whole history on him which was amazing and took much more effort then if she had just switched villains for every book. She had to delve further into the characters with each book and that is not a simple thing to do. The beauty in Voldemort's character is that he wasn't just some crazy villain out to destroy the world just because he can. He had a purpose, a vision, a back story. I don't know about you but she made it so that even though he is a villain you understand where he is coming from and I completely understood him. I may not have agreed with his methods but Voldemort was by far one of my favorite characters. Even he as a villain was not perfect. People are flawed. That is a reality and JK incorporated that into her story which only made it that much more believable. Each book revealed a different facet of each character. It took you deeper into who they were and why they are the way they are. I think people just get offset because it's a fantasy and they only focus on the surreal aspect of it and they aren't able to make the comparison or see the relationship between the books and our reality.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 2:41 pm
I agree that Harry Potter is not just a simple fantasy story. They are so many different way that it could be taken and so many many deep meanings that I think it would be almost impossible (except for JK Rowling) to find all of the hidden meanings. I think it is a thrilling book that teaches one really good lesson: good vs. evil and that evil is bad. There are these websites that say how bad Harry Potter is because of the "witch-craft" that is in it. They don't grasp the concept that the story is about good vs. evil. I agree that is also shows kids who read it for the first time that no one is perfect and that everyone makes mistakes.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Minerva the Bookwyrm Crew
|
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 5:45 pm
The Harry Poter books are far from simple. They deal with a great number of significant issues, such as prejudice and slavery. I find many of Dumbledore's quotes inspiring, such as the ones you mentioned and:
"As much life and money as you could want! The two things most human beings would choose above all - the trouble is, humans do have a knack for choosing precisely those things that are worst things for them."
I also love this statement by Sirius:
"If you want to know what a man's like take a look at how he treats his inferiours, not his equals."
And this one by Snape:
"Repel me with your brain and you won't have o resort to your wand."
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 2:29 pm
Gina, I agree with you wholeheartedly. I think Harry Potter has a huge amount of themes no one would know about unless they read it. That is what annoys me with adults who assume it's bad. It's not. There are so many life lessons in there that have taught me so much. I think the books are helping improve society to teach the teenagers and children of the world lesson's that will have better way of dealing with all the junk going on. Maybe it will stop this racism crap that is going on in the world.
((Nice topic!))
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 8:32 pm
Gina, you are dead on. I agree.
Harry Potter is not just a series of children's books, good for entertainment and naught else. Does someone actually think that Harry Potter would have caught on so large and for so long? I mean, I discovered the books nine years before the final one came out. And I'm still obsessing over the lessons and lives of the characters.
Those five quotes you presented prove that Rowling wasn't writing this as entertainment. This series teaches, from the trials and errors of Harry and his friends as Empress pointed out, the way to overcome those trials, to choose the right way over the easy, to find the bravery within ourselves to act, to find humor in the most dark and depressing times, and to accept those different than ourselves.
If the series hadn't spoken these truths, I honestly wouldn't be so obsessed with it. I wouldn't have stuck it through to the end. But it did, and so I am left marveling over the life lessons that the series produced. Those quotes, and the ones Minerva the Bookwyrm presented, are among my favorites for the lessons they teach.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Reply
