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Posted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 10:50 pm
Soooo, it's Ramadan (Muslim holiday for those that don't know, involves fasting). I was curious if Jews were allowed to celebrate this. It is Muslim, but as far as I know, there's nothing in Islam that would preclude a Jew from taking part in the celebration, since it's aimed at worshiping G-d. Can anyone answer?
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Posted: Mon Sep 08, 2008 7:20 am
Ramadan celebrates the month in which, according to Islam, Allah/Hashem gave Muhammad the holy Quran. It is similar to our Simchat Torah, on which we celebrate the giving of the Torah to Moshe.
I am NOT a rav, nor a scholar, so I highly encourage you to seek the advice of your rav about this. However, there are two views that I think would be espoused by a rav.
1. The Talmud says that every nation on earth has its own holy book, its own Torah, which Hashem gives them in order that they should understand what is expected of them and how they are to serve and relate to Hashem, and the history of their people. Ours was given at Sinai; other nations get their scriptures in their own time and place. Perhaps the Quran is the true Torah of Islam, in which case a Jew can certainly celebrate that Muslims have received it, recorded it, and continue to keep it. There is also Talmudic opinion that Islam is the true Noachide faith, and therefore should be honored, because they will bring non-Jews to the knowledge and worship of Hashem.
2. Or... because the Jews have a special heritage as the religious leaders/priesthood of the world, other nations' Torahs have a different mission in the world, not a religious one. This view would hold, therefore, that the Quran is not a holy scripture, but instead a man-invented religion, and therefore it is anti-Torah, and therefore a Jew should not celebrate it in any fashion.
I really don't know what your individual rav would say, so I think it would be far better to ask him and then do what he says.
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Eloquent Conversationalist
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Posted: Mon Sep 08, 2008 8:29 am
I'll ask, though I most certainly agree with view number one. Belief wise, I've considered Islam to be a Noachide (not the only one, but one that does follow the rules) religion, and have found most of their beliefs agreeable. There was a time, a year or two ago, that I considered converting to Islam. I, obviously, remain a Jew. I do tend to blend traditions and beliefs (going with Jewish stuff if there's a conflict) though.
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Posted: Mon Sep 08, 2008 8:34 am
I look at it this way...
Again, not qualified to be a rav, rabbi or any other ideal Jewish leader.
The way I see it is... unless you're invited by a Muslim to take part in some festivities or religious activities, then you might want to stay out of it.
From what I've experienced from others in the world, it looks bad when someone shows up uninvited to a party. Ramadan is a month long fast to show an act of discipline and devotion.
There's nothing that says that a Jew cannot go to a Christening, or a Beltaine festival, or some celebration of pasta involving the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. But you have to remember that these different groups have different ways to show their faith, just as we Jews do.
It would be in bad form for a Jew to kneel before a Catholic altar and take communion. It would also be in bad form for a Jew to pray 5 times a day towards mecca and sing out Allah Ackbah.
Those listed above are two examples of acts of devotions, and we have our own act of devotion.
Now imagine if you would... a Cherokee, wearing Tefillin and Davining.
Now imagine a Chassidic Jew doing a dance to White Buffalo Woman.
see what I'm getting at?
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darkphoenix1247 Vice Captain
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Posted: Mon Sep 08, 2008 3:42 pm
LordNeuf There's nothing that says that a Jew cannot go to a Christening, or a Beltaine festival, or some celebration of pasta involving the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. But you have to remember that these different groups have different ways to show their faith, just as we Jews do. It would be in bad form for a Jew to kneel before a Catholic altar and take communion. It would also be in bad form for a Jew to pray 5 times a day towards mecca and sing out Allah Ackbah. I agree.
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Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 4:11 pm
LordNeuf Now imagine if you would... a Cherokee, wearing Tefillin and Davining. Now imagine a Chassidic Jew doing a dance to White Buffalo Woman. see what I'm getting at? Well I'm part native american and I partipate in what I can with other Inuits and part Inuits, mainly to learn about my heritage on that side of my family. And Cherokee is a tribe, so you can have a Cherokee Jew. I have met Jewish Native Americans that converted. So you never know. The Jewish world is really big. And also in some parts of the world Judaism has been influenced by other religions a bit. China and India for example. But truthfully we do not celebrate ramadan. Not at all. Now if you are half Jewish/half-Muslim then yeah. You would have to celebrate all the holidays due to family. lol. But stick to the main religion. I know a few people that are half-half. They chose one religion and believe in it, but they still celebrate the other holidays with their family that is the other religion. Now if you want to understand it, and gain insight to the religon then yeah celebrate it with a family of that religion. And yes Islam is the true Noachide religion, but the fact is that many muslims today don't really read the Quran and just follow Wahhabists and Jihadists mindlessly. Those that do truthfully follow Islam are the ones that must be respected.
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