Pianos!

[Septomor]

Welcome to the piano section!

I'm sure if you're reading this, it's because you're interested in piano, if not...then what's wrong with you? But it's okay, we can learn slowly to apertiate and soon love the insturment.

First thing first. You're going to abide by all the rules, I don't want our section to look like this.

Second, get to know eachother. Wasn't it true that all the musicians even in the past all knew eachother and became friends? Well that is if they didn't have tragic deaths at a young age sweatdrop but don't let that stop you from being one!

Third, if you want to learn the how to play piano, then that'll be later on. I'm sure that if you're here you already know, but this will actually have a selection of pieces for practice that will take you to the next level! Or maybe not if you're some Liszt/Rachmaniov God. eek

Fourth, respect other's, even if they play an 'inferior' instrument, forgive them and become friends. I don't really want people to be fighting here, or anywhere either ><

Fifth, please post here with your history on piano. We will be glad to help any newbies with playing. I also want to do it to list all the piano players we have, shown in the second post.

Table Of Contents
So here's what's in this thread:

Part 1: Intro/Rules
Part 2: Fellow Piano Players
Part 3: Learning Piano
Part 4: Practice/Etudes for maximum preformence


So that's it, hope you have fun here. blaugh  

[Septomor]

Fellow Piano Players:

Septomor: 2-1/2 years  

[Septomor]

Learning Piano:

OK, this is the hardest thing for most players, but after it's done, you'll be champion of players! Mr./Mrs. Chopin! blaugh

First of all, it's most important that you learn how to read music. Of course many of you who play another insturment already know at least one clef, but the other one might not be so well known. But don't fear! It's simple to learn!

The note shown below is middle C. It's not actually the middle-most note on the piano (I've checked before, there is no exact middle). But it's refered to such since it's the middle-most C and therefore usually the first note every played by pianist.


Now while there are several clefs up there, only the top 3 are used in piano (though I'm sure rarely there are excuses). It should also be noted that the 'Great Staff' is how most piano music is written, and it is where you play the top part with the right hand and the bottom part with the left hand. The times when this is most confusing is during the late romantic period music, such as:

Rachmaninoff's Prelude in C# minor

Although there are two great stave's going on at the same time, the same rule applies to both stave's. Personally I'm not sure why he did this, it was possible to write it all on one staff *shurg*

Anyways back to middle C. The note right above it is C# and below it B. On a piano, C and B would be white keys and C# black. The next thing to know is that All notes have a sharp and flat, but commonly E and B have no sharp and F and C have no flat. However they can have flats and sharps

For more on reading, go here.

Once you begin to read, then this next section will be specifically for you. blaugh  

[Septomor]

Practice/Etudes

Alright, probably the best post blaugh

First off, assuming you have basic music knowledge for piano, these should protest little problems at sight. I hope however you find many of them to be tougher than you thought.

The listing will going from Beginner to Virtuoso ^^

For Beginners:
Czerny Piano Study for Beginners
Ole Olsen Norwegian Serenade
Beethoven 19th Sonata
Look at # 20 Chopin Preludes

Middle-People:
Beethoven 20th Sonata
Mozart Fantasy in D minor
Chopin Fugue in A minor
Chopin First Impromptu (this can be a tough-ie, consider it your garduation from middle-people if you master it)

Virtuoso:
This will burn >< Liszts (ahh! Its already hurting!) Three little Sonatas.
Omg feeling it yet? Ravels Jeux dEau
You might like the original, but wait for this one! Rachmaninovs Variations on a Chopin Theme

Wow that took forever to get all those. By the way, the point is not to learn every piece perfectly, but rather practice certain parts with both hands and try to build up strength within your fingers.

So I hope we all do our best!  

[I Cosmo I]

D: piano is a percussion .-. not string  

[Septomor]

It's either I say. But seeing as it can't be played without the strings, and you can kick the strings to make them work, I say it's more a string.  

[I Cosmo I]

read resons why in the looking 4 leaders thing  

[Geograce]

I'd honestly have to agree with septemor. It is considered a string instrument. It's rythym, but not percussion. Especially because it can be a solo instrument quite often. I've been playing piano for maybe 7 years now. I'm pretty good but not the best at all.  

[Keakealani]

Man is condemned to be free. ~Jean-Paul Sartre

Hmm, I thought I might as well ask here - I'm trying to teach myself some basic piano skills in anticipation of applying to college, and I was wondering if anyone had any tips - for some background, I did take private piano for about a year and a half back in middle school, and I have a lot of background in singing (so music theory/reading isn't a problem), but I admit my technique is absolutely atrocious. I know the basics, like that the fingers should be curved and relaxed when I play, but other than that I wonder if you guys have any thoughts for where I should begin? Right now I just finished (sorta) learning the accompaniment for one of the songs I sang in honour choir, and I sort of revived my old piano books to practice some of those exercises; but my main concern is avoiding learning bad habits because I don't have a teacher or anyone to correct me. It doesn't help that my piano is really not the greatest thing on the planet, as it's really old, slightly out-of-tune, and has basically one dynamic, which is mf.

Okay, yeah. So if you know of anything to help self-teacher, I'd be most obliged ^.^

A fashion is nothing but an induced epidemic. ~George Bernard Shaw

 

[Septomor]

What I do, is not worry about technique or anything of the sort. I know you can call me a piano idiot for that, but I prefer 'rebel' XD

I say play how you think it sounds, unless you're really like me then you play how you think the composer wanted it to sound. Even when it doesn't sound right to you or anyone else. For instance the Liszt sonata has (^) everywhere and I hear everybody playing them really staccato while I believe he meant it as in 'give it a shove' as in make the note last longer than others, have the same amount of energy, but be quieter. Hard to explain really. But I think if you really want to train your fingers, the best thing you can do is train your finger strength. The idea is that while you hold down one key you play others with your other fingers. And you train them to play louder and softer than your held down finger. It's also good for dexterity. I would really suggest Hanon or Czerny for these practices. I wouldn't worry about learning scales first. While it is important, learning your dexterity first will allow you to maneuver the scales a lot better.

Need anymore or something else?  

[Keakealani]

Man is condemned to be free. ~Jean-Paul Sartre

Heh. I'm not sure I can ever subscribe to the "screw technique" theory...and honestly, you haven't seen how BAD my technique is, or you might have a different opinion xD But nevertheless, that's good advice.

Part of what I'm worried about is that I have a hard time doing fast passages accurately, like I tend to speed up or slow down a little when I'm doing quicker runs. And actually in general I've found it really difficult to control the tempo just right so that I don't end up speeding through the easy stuff and the slowing down a little to get through a harder part of the song. I guess that comes with practise, but any thoughts on exactly how to practise that best?

I've heard recommendations for the Hanon exercises before, and I've considered them, but I'm worried that practising those kinds of technique exercises without a teacher might just make my bad form worse by drilling it in...do you think that's a huge problem?

Other than "curve your fingers" and "sit up straight", are there any other basic technique elements for piano that will be helpful to a beginner? Like, I know for singing, the basics are always things like "use your diaphragm for breath support" and "don't put too much tension on the larynx" - are there comparable instructions for piano? I guess what I'm asking is what common errors are most likely to occur with an untrained pianist, and what's the best way to avoid those problems?

Also, do you think it's possible to really significantly improve my piano enough for it to make a difference when I'm auditioning for colleges in the beginning of next year? I'm not planning on calling piano a secondary instrument, but most music schools I've looked at have some sort of keyboard audition component just to see where you're at and judge whether or not you have some musical background, and I'm wondering whether it's possible to improve in that short a time so that I don't completely embarrass myself if I have to play piano.

Also, any tips on improving my sight reading? My reading is fine for singing, but I have a hard time reading piano without stopping at every note or chord to figure it out...is that just another case of "practise makes perfect"?

Thanks for putting up with all my questions...and I hope other pianists will chime in, too, if they pop in here.

A fashion is nothing but an induced epidemic. ~George Bernard Shaw

 

[Septomor]

Here's some of the best music for practicing your fingers and your sight reading: link. (just scroll down the page to the piano collections)

For tempos and all, I had the same problem. And I don't suggest using a metronome really. I can never hear mine when I play anyways. I'm not sure, but I think when you completely memorize a piece, then it's a lot easier to control tempo. I think the reason is because you hear it in your mind what it's suppose to sound like, so you then know how it's going to be played.

I wouldn't worry about practicing without a teacher on anything. They'll probably only tell you to do different styles or dynamics on different notes.

ummm.....my teacher said when doing piano scales never put your thumb on a black key except at certain times. I think it's because when you do that it's harder to stretch your index finger to the next white key. Or do you mean like take a deep breath when your about to play quick passages because then you'll have more control in your fingers?

I don't really know what collages will look for. If you want to make it your first instrument then you probably will want to play something not completely world known. Which can be difficult to find. I'd try the third mvnt. to Chopin's 3rd sonata, if they ask for a slow piece, and for a fast piece, you don't have to chose something outrageously fast. I would try the first mvnt. to Chopin's 2nd sonata. Those are the easiest for collage recommendations I can think of on the spot.

I hope that helps.  

[Keakealani]

Man is condemned to be free. ~Jean-Paul Sartre

Wow, I didn't know that about the deep breath giving better control, that might actually really help me. I guess because I'm a singer I'm used to controlling my breath, but it didn't occur to me that I should probably be doing so when I play piano, too.

But yeah...I'm not planning on having piano be a primary instrument - I'm a vocalist and have a way better chance of singing my way into college than playing anything. I'm mostly just worried because colleges seem to require some sort of "keyboard proficiency" in order to get into the music program, and I don't want to embarrass myself by not being able to play a single thing.

But thank you for all the tips, they're really helpful ^_^ I'll look at that music and hopefully I'll be able to develop my piano technique a bit before auditions...

A fashion is nothing but an induced epidemic. ~George Bernard Shaw

 

[APenguinRawr]

Can you help me with reading? I read that bit at the top, but it's all too confusing for me.

I hate playing piano and not being able to read music. It's as if, there's an obstacle in the way of where I need to be. I was playing in school, and miss gave me a book to play while she went to eat. I was like... sweatdrop I can't read this sweatdrop

Please Help!  

[Septomor]

OK. So you get where middle C is?

If so, then follow these:

1. The next white key is D, then E, then F, then G, then A, then B, then C.

2. In the Treble Staff, the Middle C is located on the first line below the staff (known as a ledger line) and C above it is located in the third space, as in in between the third and fourth lines.

3. Every line and space above Middle C corresponds with the white keys mentioned above.

4. The only time there will be a black key involved is when there is a flat or sharp (b or #), no exceptions.

5. Flats or Sharps don't have to be in the measures of music, but they can appear in the key signature, which is located on the left side of the music right after the cleft. The key sig. tells you which notes need to be played on their corresponding black key. A flat means play one half-step down and a sharp means play one half-step up.

6. The only times where flats and sharps don't have to relate to a black key is when there is a C-flat, F-flat, B-sharp, or E-sharp. In which case you play the corresponding white keys which would be where the black keys would be.


Tell me if you need more info. These are absolute basics.