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 Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 8:01 am
Sokka sacrificed his prize possesion(sword and boomerang), his leg, his father, and alomst his life, Toph sacrificed her cozy life, her parents trust, and almost her life, Zuko sacrificed his country, his throne, his "honor", his girlfriend, his mom, and almost his life, Suki sacrificed her freedom(boiling rock), her home life, and almost her life, Iroh sacrificed his freedom(prison) and his home life, Katara sacrificed her innocence(blood bending), her home life, and almost her life, Yue sacrificed her life, Jet sacrificed his life, Zhao sacrificed his life, Ty lee sacrificed her dream and her freedom, Mai sacrificed her freedom, alomst her brother, almost her life, Azula sacrificed her sanity, freedom, throne, and family, Fire lord Oazi sacrificed his bending, his ower, his coutry, his throne, his wife, his freedom. Aang sacrificed............................................................................................
And I would very much like to sacrifice Mike and Bryan to the Zutara god who is dying from a cliche, infurating, confusing, annoying ending.
And if I forgot anything please share.
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 9:12 am
[Voted "I'll get the sacrifical alter" option] (Also spoilers for The Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask in my rant, but it brings up a valid point or two. ;P)
You forgot to mention how entirely stupid that goddamn Lion-Turtle (which should be effin hunted down and made into Zutara soup stare ) and that animal was in fact (as far as I know) taken from The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask, it's a part during the game when Link travel's out west to a place called "The Great Bay," and he helps a singer recover her voice: And the nearby island becomes a talking turtle which will take Link to the temple to help "resolve" the problems that are going on in those waters. (Ironically enough, the main gist of the game [get this] there is a Cursed Moon slowly falling over the period of 3 days, and if Link doesn't wake up the 4 protective spirits to help stop the moon from crushing The World, everyone, including himself, will die in a whirl of fire and ash.)
Hmm, story of a 11 almost 12 year old boy who ventures into a new unknown land. And he has to save the world from being destroyed in 3 days time, by awakening 4 Giant (and I mean GIANT, as they're as tall as the central town in the game) spirits to stop the moon and confront the person who caused all kinds of hell to the various people across the world, and almost destroyed all life as Link has known it, even if he isn't from Termina. (The name of the newer world, Link's birth home is called Hyrule. [Where his love interest was waiting for him. x3 [Zelda])
Difference between Link and Aang. Link, for starters, has gone 7 years into the future in his last game. (Ranging from 10 to 17, and goes back and forth multiple times) So he has seen many things, both the good and the bad. And not only did this make him more mature for his age, he's sacrificed so much. For starters: Link and Zelda don't stay together, Navi (Link's fairy friend who helped guided him through this adventure,) doesn't stay either as he is not a member of the Forest race, the Kokiri. (Link let her fly away, he didn't try to stop her. [In the manga this was different. Link called to her with tears in his eyes and everything. But, Navi knew she couldn't stay, so she just told Link she loved him and went back to the forest.])
At the Start of Majora's Mask (MM) Link's ocarina (it's a flute instrument Zelda gave him as a memento of their time together when they saved Hyrule. So, obviously, Link cares for it deeply.) get's stolen by a wooden puppet and his two fairy partners (Tatl and Tael) and then they curse Link to look like a plant creature from the woodlands and they steal his horse, Epona. (NIce way to start an adventure, no? xp Come the end game, Link and Tatl (who was, and remains to this very day: Sarcasm with fluttering wings) grew closer as a Fairy and human partner. And, when Link has to leave, you see Tatl is shaking, like she is crying. And she calls for him, falls quiet, and then tells him "thank you" before shaking even more. Which gives reason to imply that she was crying since she'd never see Link again.
Hmm, Aang and Link comparison.
Link, either they were willingly sacrificed, or he had no choice in the matter for obvious reasons. (One, he went in stride with it, or Two, he couldn't do anything in his power to change it. sweatdrop )
Age 10 At the start of Ocarina of Time
Age 11, possibly 12 at Majora's Mask beginning. (It wasn't mentioned how much time had past between the last game and that one, but Link got really tall and his voice became deeper.)
Sacrificed: The girl he loved.
All the friends he made.
His fairy partner left.
He left his home in search of that partner, not finding her in the end.
Found a new partner, had to leave her and his new friends behind in that world.
Oh, and did I mention he grew up without knowing his mother and father? (They were killed in the war, which took place around the time Link was born.)
In Majora's Mask, Link's horse, Epona got stolen (Appa's lost day's anyone?) and Link freaked out of his head. (Not to mention you don't find her until after you pass the second dungeon. XD; )
Aang
Lost his original glider. (that was replaced with the blue one)
Lost Appa.
Lost his "family" (Air Nomads) to the war.
Parents, no clue. They were never mentioned, and it's speculation since Aang was the Avatar the monk's took Aang from his mother. (shrug)
If I'm forgetting anything, feel free to add anything to Aang's list. :/ I seemed to notice that whenever he lost something, it was replaced, if not found later.
Air nomad family [---> Replaced with Katara,Sokka,Momo,Toph,Suki and Zuko.
Glider [---> Replaced with a brand new blue one,
Appa [---> Found
Okay, I've rambled enough. But seriously, I can now connect most of the ATLA dots, and I used an 8 almost 9 year old video game to help me. neutral Way to think Original Bryke. stare Oh, and I should mention, the voice of that turtle? He has the same voice from the Precursor's from the Jak and Daxter series. Namely, the one from part three. stare
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 2:39 pm
Artxet [Voted "I'll get the sacrifical alter" option] (Also spoilers for The Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask in my rant, but it brings up a valid point or two. ;P) You forgot to mention how entirely stupid that goddamn Lion-Turtle (which should be effin hunted down and made into Zutara soup stare ) and that animal was in fact (as far as I know) taken from The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask, it's a part during the game when Link travel's out west to a place called "The Great Bay," and he helps a singer recover her voice: And the nearby island becomes a talking turtle which will take Link to the temple to help "resolve" the problems that are going on in those waters. (Ironically enough, the main gist of the game [get this] there is a Cursed Moon slowly falling over the period of 3 days, and if Link doesn't wake up the 4 protective spirits to help stop the moon from crushing The World, everyone, including himself, will die in a whirl of fire and ash.) Hmm, story of a 11 almost 12 year old boy who ventures into a new unknown land. And he has to save the world from being destroyed in 3 days time, by awakening 4 Giant (and I mean GIANT, as they're as tall as the central town in the game) spirits to stop the moon and confront the person who caused all kinds of hell to the various people across the world, and almost destroyed all life as Link has known it, even if he isn't from Termina. (The name of the newer world, Link's birth home is called Hyrule. [Where his love interest was waiting for him. x3 [Zelda]) Difference between Link and Aang. Link, for starters, has gone 7 years into the future in his last game. (Ranging from 10 to 17, and goes back and forth multiple times) So he has seen many things, both the good and the bad. And not only did this make him more mature for his age, he's sacrificed so much. For starters: Link and Zelda don't stay together, Navi (Link's fairy friend who helped guided him through this adventure,) doesn't stay either as he is not a member of the Forest race, the Kokiri. (Link let her fly away, he didn't try to stop her. [In the manga this was different. Link called to her with tears in his eyes and everything. But, Navi knew she couldn't stay, so she just told Link she loved him and went back to the forest.]) At the Start of Majora's Mask (MM) Link's ocarina (it's a flute instrument Zelda gave him as a memento of their time together when they saved Hyrule. So, obviously, Link cares for it deeply.) get's stolen by a wooden puppet and his two fairy partners (Tatl and Tael) and then they curse Link to look like a plant creature from the woodlands and they steal his horse, Epona. (NIce way to start an adventure, no? xp Come the end game, Link and Tatl (who was, and remains to this very day: Sarcasm with fluttering wings) grew closer as a Fairy and human partner. And, when Link has to leave, you see Tatl is shaking, like she is crying. And she calls for him, falls quiet, and then tells him "thank you" before shaking even more. Which gives reason to imply that she was crying since she'd never see Link again. Hmm, Aang and Link comparison. Link, either they were willingly sacrificed, or he had no choice in the matter for obvious reasons. (One, he went in stride with it, or Two, he couldn't do anything in his power to change it. sweatdrop ) Age 10 At the start of Ocarina of Time Age 11, possibly 12 at Majora's Mask beginning. (It wasn't mentioned how much time had past between the last game and that one, but Link got really tall and his voice became deeper.) Sacrificed: The girl he loved. All the friends he made. His fairy partner left. He left his home in search of that partner, not finding her in the end. Found a new partner, had to leave her and his new friends behind in that world. Oh, and did I mention he grew up without knowing his mother and father? (They were killed in the war, which took place around the time Link was born.) In Majora's Mask, Link's horse, Epona got stolen (Appa's lost day's anyone?) and Link freaked out of his head. (Not to mention you don't find her until after you pass the second dungeon. XD; ) AangLost his original glider. (that was replaced with the blue one) Lost Appa. Lost his "family" (Air Nomads) to the war. Parents, no clue. They were never mentioned, and it's speculation since Aang was the Avatar the monk's took Aang from his mother. (shrug) If I'm forgetting anything, feel free to add anything to Aang's list. :/ I seemed to notice that whenever he lost something, it was replaced, if not found later. Air nomad family [---> Replaced with Katara,Sokka,Momo,Toph,Suki and Zuko. Glider [---> Replaced with a brand new blue one, Appa [---> Found Okay, I've rambled enough. But seriously, I can now connect most of the ATLA dots, and I used an 8 almost 9 year old video game to help me. neutral Way to think Original Bryke. stare Oh, and I should mention, the voice of that turtle? He has the same voice from the Precursor's from the Jak and Daxter series. Namely, the one from part three. stare Its always a turtle, Alladin, Sinbad, other random things that I forget the name of, only in Avatar's case it was part lion. I acctually called that as soon as I realized that it moved. That compashison is genious.(I love doing things like that. My fav was my comparhison of Zuko and Harry Potter)(anyway)And it wasn't like even if Aang didn't get the blue glider he probably could have found one in the temple. That Turtle thing bugged me on levels I didn't know I possesed. And just as a side note. Did that Air avatar sound like Hama to you??? O and I would love to help you make that Zutara soup smile
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Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 1:11 pm
Yeah, that annoys me too. I mean, some people say that Aang sacrificed his people adn his staff, but... The Air Nomads died, not because Aang made a conscious sacrifice, but because Sozin was evil and Aang was an idiot. If he had've stayed at the Temple instead of running away (like always), then a)he would've died with them, or b) the power of the Avatar State would've been triggered and he would've been able to save some, if not all of the people at his Temple.
And Aang got a new staff in DoBS, so sacrificing his old one in 'The Awakening' doesn't really count. :/
What really, really bothers me about this is that Aang is the main character - he should have the most growth and sacrifice and all that great sutff, but he has none and always reverts back to the way he was in the beginning. D< Bad writing is bad.
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Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 7:02 pm
rachaella22 Yeah, that annoys me too. I mean, some people say that Aang sacrificed his people adn his staff, but... The Air Nomads died, not because Aang made a conscious sacrifice, but because Sozin was evil and Aang was an idiot. If he had've stayed at the Temple instead of running away (like always), then a)he would've died with them, or b) the power of the Avatar State would've been triggered and he would've been able to save some, if not all of the people at his Temple.
And Aang got a new staff in DoBS, so sacrificing his old one in 'The Awakening' doesn't really count. :/
What really, really bothers me about this is that Aang is the main character - he should have the most growth and sacrifice and all that great sutff, but he has none and always reverts back to the way he was in the beginning. D< Bad writing is bad. Zuko and Katara were the characters who evolved the most. And they evolved because of each other. Does that mean nothing??? Mike and Brian need to work on their story plots and views of romance
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Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 12:53 am
I think it didn't annoy/bother me so much so that the rest had to sacrifice so much, as that Aang didn't sacrifice ANYTHING at all.
Stupid bald brat. We hates its guts, we does, preciousss.
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Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 8:34 am
Emmelyn I think it didn't annoy/bother me so much so that the rest had to sacrifice so much, as that Aang didn't sacrifice ANYTHING at all. Stupid bald brat. We hates its guts, we does, preciousss. EXACTLLY!!!!Poor Sokka gave up everything. And also, love the Lord of the Rings reference smile
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Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 2:49 am
thats a good point all aang did like half the show was cry and tell everyone he couldnt do something (it changed every epi.) D<
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Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 3:10 am
Veysa rachaella22 Yeah, that annoys me too. I mean, some people say that Aang sacrificed his people adn his staff, but... The Air Nomads died, not because Aang made a conscious sacrifice, but because Sozin was evil and Aang was an idiot. If he had've stayed at the Temple instead of running away (like always), then a)he would've died with them, or b) the power of the Avatar State would've been triggered and he would've been able to save some, if not all of the people at his Temple.
And Aang got a new staff in DoBS, so sacrificing his old one in 'The Awakening' doesn't really count. :/
What really, really bothers me about this is that Aang is the main character - he should have the most growth and sacrifice and all that great sutff, but he has none and always reverts back to the way he was in the beginning. D< Bad writing is bad. Zuko and Katara were the characters who evolved the most. And they evolved because of each other. Does that mean nothing??? Mike and Brian need to work on their story plots and views of romance You couldn't have said it better. *applause*
Honestly, Mike and Bryan, and the Kataangers who worship the finale are NUTS. IGNORING THE SHIPPING, there is so much wrong with it.
Lion-Turtle? WTF. Come on. I'm aware it was foreshadowed in the shot from the Library when Aang's looking at a scroll, but COME ON! Do you call that foresahadowing?? And Spirit-bending. AGAIN, what the hell.
You know what's FORESHADOWING? The freaking dream from Nightmares and Daydreams. Where TOPH is in danger and there's all sorts of symbolism for his ATTATCHMENT holding him back from saving the freakin world.
Why did they put that there?? What the hell did it mean?? God, if they were trying to hint at the finale and how the war would be won in the end like what we THOUGHT they were getting at, why didn't he run into a big, scary lion turtle in the dream?? For the love of Zutara, if there was a time to foreshadow that loophole, THAT was the place to do it.
Instead, they show TOPH, with out her FACE, which is a TOTAL reference to Koh...who has been rumored and hinted at coming back in the series...I just noticed this, but she is kind of sucked into the ground, kind of like how AANG was when he plunges into the spirit water to merge with the ocean spirit. SPIRIT WORLD CONNECTION NUMBER 2.
They even go as far as showing Toph reflected in HIS EYES. That's probably the closest kind of regards you can physically show. Windows to the soul. This is animation, folks, you don't show a character relfected in another's eyes unless it really means something. Oh, but not Avatar!
Katara is surrounded by fire. Means nothing, right? Being endangered by Azula in the Agni Kai scene, maybe? Oh, wait, the fire is ORANGE, not blue.
ICE freezing him into place while Ozai laughs in his face and he FALLS. Nooo, that means nothing either.
He sinks to the bottom of a poll, until it turns and he's at the top, stuck UNDER THE ICE as the comet passes overhead. Obviously his attatchment to a water bender has to be holding him back for how much it's comin up in here, right? Noooope. Once again, meaningless.
Honestly, WATCH THAT DREAM AGAIN, and please tell me where all that work of symbolism and foreshadowing went! Mike and Bryan honestly don't have any idea what they're doing if this is what they give us. They can't do romance, and they can't do dreams.
Dreams in stories are supposed to foreshadow. They are supposed to give shape to the true essence of things and what things will be in the future of the story. You saw Zuko's dream, and the symbolism and message in that was clear, and it came to fruitation(except for the freaking Ursa subject, but that's another story).
They might as well have shown us the dream where Toph gets them killed because of her tiny bladder, for all the relevence they ended up showing with that nightmare.
D<
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Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 12:34 pm
Teh_Sheba Veysa rachaella22 Yeah, that annoys me too. I mean, some people say that Aang sacrificed his people adn his staff, but... The Air Nomads died, not because Aang made a conscious sacrifice, but because Sozin was evil and Aang was an idiot. If he had've stayed at the Temple instead of running away (like always), then a)he would've died with them, or b) the power of the Avatar State would've been triggered and he would've been able to save some, if not all of the people at his Temple.
And Aang got a new staff in DoBS, so sacrificing his old one in 'The Awakening' doesn't really count. :/
What really, really bothers me about this is that Aang is the main character - he should have the most growth and sacrifice and all that great sutff, but he has none and always reverts back to the way he was in the beginning. D< Bad writing is bad. Zuko and Katara were the characters who evolved the most. And they evolved because of each other. Does that mean nothing??? Mike and Brian need to work on their story plots and views of romance You couldn't have said it better. *applause*
Honestly, Mike and Bryan, and the Kataangers who worship the finale are NUTS. IGNORING THE SHIPPING, there is so much wrong with it.
Lion-Turtle? WTF. Come on. I'm aware it was foreshadowed in the shot from the Library when Aang's looking at a scroll, but COME ON! Do you call that foresahadowing?? And Spirit-bending. AGAIN, what the hell.
You know what's FORESHADOWING? The freaking dream from Nightmares and Daydreams. Where TOPH is in danger and there's all sorts of symbolism for his ATTATCHMENT holding him back from saving the freakin world.
Why did they put that there?? What the hell did it mean?? God, if they were trying to hint at the finale and how the war would be won in the end like what we THOUGHT they were getting at, why didn't he run into a big, scary lion turtle in the dream?? For the love of Zutara, if there was a time to foreshadow that loophole, THAT was the place to do it.
Instead, they show TOPH, with out her FACE, which is a TOTAL reference to Koh...who has been rumored and hinted at coming back in the series...I just noticed this, but she is kind of sucked into the ground, kind of like how AANG was when he plunges into the spirit water to merge with the ocean spirit. SPIRIT WORLD CONNECTION NUMBER 2.
They even go as far as showing Toph reflected in HIS EYES. That's probably the closest kind of regards you can physically show. Windows to the soul. This is animation, folks, you don't show a character relfected in another's eyes unless it really means something. Oh, but not Avatar!
Katara is surrounded by fire. Means nothing, right? Being endangered by Azula in the Agni Kai scene, maybe? Oh, wait, the fire is ORANGE, not blue.
ICE freezing him into place while Ozai laughs in his face and he FALLS. Nooo, that means nothing either.
He sinks to the bottom of a poll, until it turns and he's at the top, stuck UNDER THE ICE as the comet passes overhead. Obviously his attatchment to a water bender has to be holding him back for how much it's comin up in here, right? Noooope. Once again, meaningless.
Honestly, WATCH THAT DREAM AGAIN, and please tell me where all that work of symbolism and foreshadowing went! Mike and Bryan honestly don't have any idea what they're doing if this is what they give us. They can't do romance, and they can't do dreams.
Dreams in stories are supposed to foreshadow. They are supposed to give shape to the true essence of things and what things will be in the future of the story. You saw Zuko's dream, and the symbolism and message in that was clear, and it came to fruitation(except for the freaking Ursa subject, but that's another story).
They might as well have shown us the dream where Toph gets them killed because of her tiny bladder, for all the relevence they ended up showing with that nightmare.
D<
YES! THANK-YOU! What the hell was the point of that dream? Seriously - some things might be able to tie into the finale (the world going up in flames, for example), but for the most part? Nope. Nothing had any relevance to the end. They just threw it in there to surprise us. Dx
Also, also, it doesn't matter how much you foreshadow something if you don't explain it when it finally happens. 'Cause, I mean, what the hell? Why couldn't Jun find Aang when he was on the Lion-Turtle? Why did Aang even go there in the first place? How the hell did Aang learn its technique?!. Dx Seriously. I... I don't get it.
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