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Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:12 pm
I'm not Jewish, I WANT to be Jewish with all of my heart.
Someone told me that I shouldn't be wearing a Star of David necklace D:
What do you guys think?
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Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:56 pm
The Star of David wasn't a symbol of Judaism until barely 200 years ago. It is also a symbol of Hindu principles, the union of male and female essences. Wear it if you want. Don't worry a bit about it. You have every right to wear the Star of David if you want to wear it, whether as a symbol of support for Israel or as a statement of belief in the God of Israel and the religion of Judaism, or for anything else you want.
If you want to hold off wearing it until after you complete your conversion, I'm sure that it will feel just as meaningful for it to be the first thing you put on after you emerge from the mikvah waters. But don't let your current halachic status bother you. Wear it if you want; don't wear it if you want. Jews have, for four thousand years, done what they felt was right regardless of how the surrounding world felt about it. Do the same.
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Eloquent Conversationalist
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Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 2:12 pm
Divash The Star of David wasn't a symbol of Judaism until barely 200 years ago. It is also a symbol of Hindu principles, the union of male and female essences. Wear it if you want. Don't worry a bit about it. You have every right to wear the Star of David if you want to wear it, whether as a symbol of support for Israel or as a statement of belief in the God of Israel and the religion of Judaism, or for anything else you want. If you want to hold off wearing it until after you complete your conversion, I'm sure that it will feel just as meaningful for it to be the first thing you put on after you emerge from the mikvah waters. But don't let your current halachic status bother you. Wear it if you want; don't wear it if you want. Jews have, for four thousand years, done what they felt was right regardless of how the surrounding world felt about it. Do the same. Thank you Divash! You always know how to make me feel better. Today an Orthodox Jew told me that I shouldn't bother trying to convert because it is wrong for goyim to do so.. we have our "own faiths fabricated". T'was hurtful.
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Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 9:28 pm
In Medias Res II Thank you Divash! You always know how to make me feel better. Today an Orthodox Jew told me that I shouldn't bother trying to convert because it is wrong for goyim to do so.. we have our "own faiths fabricated". T'was hurtful. Wow, that is quite hurtful. I think I would have cried... I really do. sad It's up to you if you wish to wear it or not, like Divash said.
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Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 10:27 pm
Mizakichii In Medias Res II Thank you Divash! You always know how to make me feel better. Today an Orthodox Jew told me that I shouldn't bother trying to convert because it is wrong for goyim to do so.. we have our "own faiths fabricated". T'was hurtful. Wow, that is quite hurtful. I think I would have cried... I really do. sad It's up to you if you wish to wear it or not, like Divash said. I did cry! D: People saying things like that keeps me away from speaking with a rabbi. It scares me.
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Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 10:38 pm
Here's my suggestion.
Find a different rabbi.
Go reformed, they're less a**l about such things.
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darkphoenix1247 Vice Captain
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Posted: Tue Jul 22, 2008 6:44 am
LordNeuf Here's my suggestion. Find a different rabbi. Go reformed, they're less a**l about such things. Agreed. And this guild (as far as I know) will support you as well! 3nodding We all have challenges being Jewish, but I also have added respect for converts since they specifically chose to become Jewish- coming from a different religion means accepting that you didn't like your own AND through research, faith, or whatever, changed to Judaism. I just read an amazing book recently- The Last Lecture- and the author said something along the lines of "Be thankful for brick walls. They let us prove how much we want something." Try thinking of it the same way?
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Posted: Tue Jul 22, 2008 12:56 pm
In Medias Res II Today an Orthodox Jew told me that I shouldn't bother trying to convert because it is wrong for goyim to do so.. we have our "own faiths fabricated". T'was hurtful. Yes, it was hurtful, and not at all necessary, and not at all true. It is not wrong for non-Jews to seek conversion or to convert. It is not necessary, but it is not wrong. That person may have worn the clothing of Orthodoxy, may have spoken the language of Judaism, but they were clearly not Orthodox in the sense of understanding Torah and living by it. A convert should be discouraged because it is a very hard life being a Jew and even harder being a convert, but a sincere convert should be welcomed and assisted -- the discouragement is only meant to help those who truly aren't suited to Judaism to realize it before they've made a lifelong commitment that they will later not want to keep. It's deeply embarrassing to me, as an Orthodox Jew, when an Orthodox (or ostensibly-Orthodox) Jew exercises elitism and bigotry. I wish I could apologize on the person's behalf, but I can't erase the wrongdoing of another. I can only say that this person does not speak for Orthodoxy, and when someone like this pretends to speak for me, he makes me and other Orthodox Jews look bad. This is the sort of behavior that makes people feel the way Neuf apparently does, that all Orthodox Jews are tight-laced, elitist jerks. This isn't the case, and I hope that I can serve as an example of the opposite. I can say, though, that while there are rabbis who are skittish of potential converts, and there are rabbis who are so skittish that they won't do conversions, a real mensch of a rabbi will at least have the courtesy to direct you towards one who will help.
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Eloquent Conversationalist
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Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 5:01 pm
Jews are not the kind of people who go out and ask others to convert and say that our religion is better than someone else. For this reason, when somebody wishes to convert, it may not be easy, and there will probably be people trying to hold them back. But if the person has a true desire, they will move past all the obstacles put in their way, and they will manage to convert.
By no means am I saying that what this person said was nice, nor am I excusing this person's behavior. I am just saying that if you, In Medias Res, feel deep down in your heart, that converting is what you truly want to do, than I have no doubt that you will be able to stand up for yourself when you hear things like this, and you will be able to fulfill your dream.
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Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 7:51 pm
He has Redeemed Me!Though I Sorry to be off topic, but what's a goyoim? Is that a non-jew wishing to becoming a jew?
Also, I no next to nothing of Judaism, but you should express your beliefs. Some may not understand, and may come a tell you off for it. But it's what you beleive in, and though you aren't Jewish yet, your studying it and beleive in it and want to be a follower of Judaism, right? So... if you want to wear a Star of David necklace, then where it, I say!
If I am wrong, however, please correct me ^^; am undeserving, He gave his life for mine.
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Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 9:01 pm
mazuac He has Redeemed Me!Though I Sorry to be off topic, but what's a goyoim? Is that a non-jew wishing to becoming a jew?
Also, I no next to nothing of Judaism, but you should express your beliefs. Some may not understand, and may come a tell you off for it. But it's what you beleive in, and though you aren't Jewish yet, your studying it and beleive in it and want to be a follower of Judaism, right? So... if you want to wear a Star of David necklace, then where it, I say!
If I am wrong, however, please correct me ^^; am undeserving, He gave his life for mine. What is your fascination with Judaism...? Why are you using your sig and textbox to proselytise? gonk
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Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 3:20 am
In Medias Res II What is your fascination with Judaism...? Why are you using your sig and textbox to proselytise? gonk I'll field this one. His fascination with Judaism is just simple curiosity about what the culture and religion is and what it's all about. Look at the other thread and see how much I know about Christianity during the reformation. I can tell the difference between a Jacobite and a Jesuit but it doesn't mean I'm either one. The Christian thing he has working in his sig line is just his own pride in his own religion. I don't think consider it proselytizing that he puts crosses everywhere and writes about how Jesus loves him. Infact it appears that he is encouraging you to wear the Star of David regardless of his own views. Oh and back to mazuac's question. Goyim is a term used to describe those who are not Jewish. Translate as "Gentile"
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Eloquent Conversationalist
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Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 7:43 am
mazuac Sorry to be off topic, but what's a goyoim? Is that a non-jew wishing to becoming a jew? A goy (plural = goyim) is a non-Jew, whether or not they are aiming towards conversion to Judaism. This is a proper Hebrew term, with no connotation other than "non-Jewish person." To use the word shaygetz (male) or shiksa (female), however, is highly derogatory. They are Yiddish, and their original source-word means "insect," so using this word is like calling someone vermin. It's a disgusting word.
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Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 11:08 am
Divash mazuac Sorry to be off topic, but what's a goyoim? Is that a non-jew wishing to becoming a jew? A goy (plural = goyim) is a non-Jew, whether or not they are aiming towards conversion to Judaism. This is a proper Hebrew term, with no connotation other than "non-Jewish person." To use the word shaygetz (male) or shiksa (female), however, is highly derogatory. They are Yiddish, and their original source-word means "insect," so using this word is like calling someone vermin. It's a disgusting word. He has Redeemed Me!Though I Oh, that makes sense~ And interesting, isn't Yiddish like... Hebrew and German or something along those lines... My Grandma who is Jewish came from Germany and I think her dad could speak fluent Yiddish and she could also speak some Yiddish along with German and English~
Also, thanks LordNeuf~ ^^ am undeserving, He gave his life for mine.
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Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 1:03 pm
mazuac Divash mazuac Sorry to be off topic, but what's a goyoim? Is that a non-jew wishing to becoming a jew? A goy (plural = goyim) is a non-Jew, whether or not they are aiming towards conversion to Judaism. This is a proper Hebrew term, with no connotation other than "non-Jewish person." To use the word shaygetz (male) or shiksa (female), however, is highly derogatory. They are Yiddish, and their original source-word means "insect," so using this word is like calling someone vermin. It's a disgusting word. He has Redeemed Me!Though I Oh, that makes sense~ And interesting, isn't Yiddish like... Hebrew and German or something along those lines... My Grandma who is Jewish came from Germany and I think her dad could speak fluent Yiddish and she could also speak some Yiddish along with German and English~
Also, thanks LordNeuf~ ^^ am undeserving, He gave his life for mine. I'm very glad that you have a sincere wanting to learn about Judaism, which seems to be your roots! =] may I ask if that is your mother or father's mother?
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