Welcome to Gaia! ::

The Physics and Mathematics Guild

Back to Guilds

 

Tags: physics, mathematics, science, universe 

Reply Mathematics
X Per Y or Y into X? and Spherical Coordinate systems

Quick Reply

Enter both words below, separated by a space:

Can't read the text? Click here

Submit

Rhyno_DaGreat

PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 10:33 am


I have two questions in this post, which are split up.

================================================
| X Per Y or Y into X? |
================================================
I have been thinking about this and it doesn't play out too well in my mind. I know I'm probably over-analyzing it, and it's probably stupid...

However I got the thinking about division. Say you have two numbers represented by variables X and Y.

Make X the Dividend and Y the Divisor.

Thus:

X/Y

Now... it's usually read two different ways: "The amount of Y that can go into X" or "The amount of X per Y".

However, those two statements seem to say the same thing, except about opposite variables. With me, the first statement makes more sense. How is it the "Amount of X per one Y"?

The reason I started thinking about this is because of an idea of rate of change I read in a graphics programming article for solving a triangle (poly filling).*

If someone could clarify how this works, I'd be grateful.

Thank you!

*The article can be found here: http://www.phatcode.net/articles.php?id=214

================================================
| Spherical Coordinate systems |
================================================
Does anyone understand how the spherical coordinate system is derived?

If anyone could explain it to me, that'd be great! Thank you!
================================================
PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 3:09 pm


Rhyno_DaGreat
Make X the Dividend and Y the Divisor.
Thus:
X/Y
Now... it's usually read two different ways: "The amount of Y that can go into X" or "The amount of X per Y".

Ah. You mixed that up a bit. The first interpretations should either be "the number of times Y can go into X" or "the amount (portion) of X that is equal to Y."

Rhyno_DaGreat
Does anyone understand how the spherical coordinate system is derived? If anyone could explain it to me, that'd be great!

User Image - Blocked by "Display Image" Settings. Click to show.
Well, the easiest thing to do is to transform from Cartesian (x,y,z) coordinates. The radial coordinate r is defined as the distance from the origin, which, by the distance formula (which is really just a repeated Pythagorean theorem), is
r = sqrt[x²+y²+z²].

The zenith angle φ is defined as the angle the line from the origin to (x,y,z) makes with the positive z-axis. From the image to the left, where z is the distance to the xy plane (hence forming a right triangle), you can see that the sine of the complement of φ is (opposite/hypotenuse) = z/r. But of course the sine of the complement if φ is simply cos φ. Therefore:
φ = arccos(z/r).
[This may be slightly more obvious if you imagine a line from (0,0,z) to (x,y,z), although that's not drawn in the diagram, in which case, cos φ = z/r directly.]

Also in the diagram, observe that the distance from the origin to the projection to the xy plane, i.e., (x,y,0), is then r' = r sin φ. The azimuthal angle θ is defined that the counterclockwise angle from the positive x axis to (x,y,0) in the xy plane. But this is then just a repeat of polar coordinates:
θ = arctan(y/x)
and also
x = r' cos θ, y = r' sin θ,
which is equivalent to
x = r cos θ sin φ, y = r sin θ sin φ, z = r cos φ.

Note: It is a common convention to reverse θ and φ compared to the diagram (e.g., among physicists), so be clear which convention your source is using. See also here.

VorpalNeko
Captain


Rhyno_DaGreat

PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 5:04 pm


Thanks!

The first thing came simple, as it was just an err on my part!

The second thing will be a bit more difficult to grasp, I have to stare at it for a while I think before I'll get it.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 8:08 pm


VorpalNeko, if you are still reading this what do you mean by "the distance from the origin to the projection to the xy plane"?

Rhyno_DaGreat


VorpalNeko
Captain

PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 11:46 pm


User Image - Blocked by "Display Image" Settings. Click to show.
Alright, let's break it down explicitly. I'll label a few of the points and describe a their location in the diagram.
O(0,0,0): the origin
P(x,y,z): arbitrary point; in the diagram, where the r,θ,φ unit vectors originate from. The segment OP has length r.
Q(x,y,0): the projection of P to the xy plane, i.e., straight down from P along the line segment of length z in the diagram, so z = PQ
Note that OPQ is a right triangle, and angle POQ is complementary to φ. By "the distance from the origin to the projection to the xy plane" I mean the length of OQ, which satisfies cos(POQ) = OQ/r, so that OQ = r cos(POQ) = r sin(φ).

[Edit: fixed critical typo]
PostPosted: Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:14 am


VorpalNeko
User Image - Blocked by "Display Image" Settings. Click to show.
Alright, let's break it down explicitly. I'll label a few of the points and describe a their location in the diagram.
O(0,0,0): the origin
P(x,y,z): arbitrary point; in the diagram, where the r,θ,φ unit vectors originate from. The segment OP has length r.
Q(x,y,0): the projection of P to the xy plane, i.e., straight down from P along the line segment of length z in the diagram, so z = PQ
Note that OPQ is a right triangle, and angle POQ is complementary to φ. By "the distance from the origin to the projection to the xy plane" I mean the length of OQ, which satisfies cos(POQ) = OQ/r, so that OQ = r cos(POQ) = r sin(φ).

[Edit: fixed critical typo]


That helped tremendously! I was looking for the projection of a plane onto another plane, not the projection of a point to a plane. sweatdrop

Thank you.

Rhyno_DaGreat

Reply
Mathematics

 
Manage Your Items
Other Stuff
Get GCash
Offers
Get Items
More Items
Where Everyone Hangs Out
Other Community Areas
Virtual Spaces
Fun Stuff
Gaia's Games
Mini-Games
Play with GCash
Play with Platinum