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 Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 5:33 am
This is a new place for us to discuss this topic. The last thing that was said in the other thread was: Lethkhar Combat Chuckles Lethkhar Hence why Christianity is the only religion in the world. rolleyes Obviously, nature has misguided quite a few people. I know we're way off topic, but I just gotta say one more thing. If you would have read my post back up a bit, I said: Quote: when you view nature, you have a couple of choices to make. 1) Seek out the source of it's creation, which would then lead you to another crossroad. One leading toward the Creationist view and another leading toward the Evolutionist/Big Bang/etc view. Or 2) choose not to seek an answer. I suppose you could also 3) choose to worship nature itself and not concern yourself with who/what created it. Hence, why I also said nature CAN lead you in the right direction. Not WILL, but CAN. So really salvation is totally a matter of whether you're lucky enough to be "led" correctly. It has nothing to do with your actual character and everything to do with the circumstances that character is faced with. ...and continue
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Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 5:42 am
Not 'lucky enough to be "led" correctly', but diligent enough to seek the answers.
So, really salvation is totally a matter of whether you're diligent enough to seek the answers.
Nature can point you in the direction of those answers. Thats all I'm saying. I'm not saying nature alone can save you, only that it can point you where you need to go.
...if you are diligent enough to seek the answers.
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Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 3:25 pm
Random question, so I can get a grasp on the topic you've started. Are you speaking from the opinion of Deism?
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Posted: Wed Feb 06, 2008 7:33 am
Lyneun Random question, so I can get a grasp on the topic you've started. Are you speaking from the opinion of Deism? Read the last couple pages of this thread to get the beginnings of this topic. Basically, I believe no one is without excuse when the time comes for judgment. Regardless of where they were born or how they were raised. And one reason I believe that is because of what we see in nature.
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Posted: Wed Feb 06, 2008 11:23 am
Maybe you could paraphrase? I have little time to do much, with work going as it is. sweatdrop
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Posted: Wed Feb 06, 2008 1:51 pm
Lyneun Maybe you could paraphrase? I have little time to do much, with work going as it is. sweatdrop The basic argument was, do people who have never heard of Jesus, ever and never will, go to hell? One of the sides is yes, because nature should lead them to a creator, and the other is no, because how on earth would a human mind comprehend that nature = God? Discuss. xd
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Posted: Wed Feb 06, 2008 2:16 pm
Well, as for me, I believe those people who have never heard of God or Jesus, wont go to Hell, but God will show Himself to them, and they will make the choice. As for those who've heard but never seeked... well, they might go to Hell.
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Posted: Wed Feb 06, 2008 9:54 pm
Combat Chuckles Not 'lucky enough to be "led" correctly', but diligent enough to seek the answers. So, really salvation is totally a matter of whether you're diligent enough to seek the answers. Nature can point you in the direction of those answers. Thats all I'm saying. I'm not saying nature alone can save you, only that it can point you where you need to go. ...if you are diligent enough to seek the answers. But what if the answers you find are wrong? e.g. Well over half of the world does not practice Christianity. They feel that they've found different answers.
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Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 6:13 am
Lethkhar But what if the answers you find are wrong? e.g. Well over half of the world does not practice Christianity. They feel that they've found different answers. So, do you think God should save those who have 'found different answers'?
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Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 11:09 pm
Combat Chuckles Lethkhar But what if the answers you find are wrong? e.g. Well over half of the world does not practice Christianity. They feel that they've found different answers. So, do you think God should save those who have 'found different answers'? If He is just, then yes.
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Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 5:19 am
Lethkhar Combat Chuckles Lethkhar But what if the answers you find are wrong? e.g. Well over half of the world does not practice Christianity. They feel that they've found different answers. So, do you think God should save those who have 'found different answers'? If He is just, then yes. No, God has laid down the requirements for salvation. What's the point of Jesus sacrifice if God's gonna save them all anyway? Since he's just, he has to send those that don't choose to follow Jesus to hell. If He goes against his own edicts, that makes Him a liar and therefore not God.
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Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 1:06 am
Combat Chuckles Lethkhar Combat Chuckles Lethkhar But what if the answers you find are wrong? e.g. Well over half of the world does not practice Christianity. They feel that they've found different answers. So, do you think God should save those who have 'found different answers'? If He is just, then yes. No, God has laid down the requirements for salvation. What's the point of Jesus sacrifice if God's gonna save them all anyway? Since he's just, he has to send those that don't choose to follow Jesus to hell. If He goes against his own edicts, that makes Him a liar and therefore not God. But a vast majority of people who don't "follow Jesus" do so because they were misled by nature. It's hardly their fault that their environment was inhospitable to the Christian faith.
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Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 7:26 am
Quote: But a vast majority of people who don't "follow Jesus" do so because they were misled by nature. It's hardly their fault that their environment was inhospitable to the Christian faith. You're right. I think the Divine has different ways of showing itself to the world. God is God. And we are never going to understand It. God's servants (other than humanity) have ways of reaching these people who have never heard of Jesus, and ways of telling them the truth. There are different traditions with the same mythological structure as Christianity, some with a Christ, God Incarnate. We are not God. This could be his truth being spread through different faiths, and different places. I think, in God's wisdom, he wouldn't set up an event and only have it accessable to one group of people (the one who hears/knows of it). He loves all of us. That much we know. I'm very positive he gives each and every person a seperate chance, and true knowledge. Whether it adheres to the Bible or not is up to God. Don't you think?
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Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 8:06 am
Lethkhar Combat Chuckles Lethkhar Combat Chuckles Lethkhar But what if the answers you find are wrong? e.g. Well over half of the world does not practice Christianity. They feel that they've found different answers. So, do you think God should save those who have 'found different answers'? If He is just, then yes. No, God has laid down the requirements for salvation. What's the point of Jesus sacrifice if God's gonna save them all anyway? Since he's just, he has to send those that don't choose to follow Jesus to hell. If He goes against his own edicts, that makes Him a liar and therefore not God. But a vast majority of people who don't "follow Jesus" do so because they were misled by nature. It's hardly their fault that their environment was inhospitable to the Christian faith. So a judge should let all the murderers, rapists, and terrorists go free because it's not their fault that they were made that way. . . rolleyes
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Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 11:39 pm
Lyneun Quote: But a vast majority of people who don't "follow Jesus" do so because they were misled by nature. It's hardly their fault that their environment was inhospitable to the Christian faith. You're right. I think the Divine has different ways of showing itself to the world. God is God. And we are never going to understand It. God's servants (other than humanity) have ways of reaching these people who have never heard of Jesus, and ways of telling them the truth. There are different traditions with the same mythological structure as Christianity, some with a Christ, God Incarnate. We are not God. This could be his truth being spread through different faiths, and different places. I think, in God's wisdom, he wouldn't set up an event and only have it accessable to one group of people (the one who hears/knows of it). He loves all of us. That much we know. I'm very positive he gives each and every person a seperate chance, and true knowledge. Whether it adheres to the Bible or not is up to God. Don't you think? Possible. But that sounds more like Baha'i than Christianity... But it could all be one in the same, I suppose. I applaude you.
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