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 Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 3:37 pm
I noticed that many many games from years ago (Late 80s and first half of 90s) are much harder than the games today. What do you think? Is that a good or bad thing? Discuss.
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Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 3:45 pm
Well..since I've grew up in the mid 90s. I say it's been well gone, most games are not usually for a challenge now a days. Even though it's says "Hard" it turns out to be a few more generic enemy number 100 something or slightly smarter AI.
Sometimes it's not a smart idea to make a game challenging because it turns off the casual gamer and sometimes the dedicated gamer market. Game like Super Ghost N' Golbins are notorious for being hard and extremely difficult. The problem is gamers have different tastes and wantings for games.
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Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 3:45 pm
you're not the only one. Also, it seems they're getting shorter, as well. gonk
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Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 4:04 pm
For example, look at Legend of Zelda (first game) vs Ocarina of Time in terms of difficulty or even Legend of Zelda (First game) vs Twilight Princess or Phantom Hourglass. Legend of Zelda (First game) and Zelda II are both ridiculously hard.
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Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 4:38 pm
It might have to do with the fact that the point of view in older games (2-D) made it harder to dodge enemy attacks, and that many newer games have unlimited lives. However, there are still some hard 3-D games. Look at the original Doom games, for instance. Crank it up to any difficulty past the "Hey! Not Too Rough!" difficulty, and it gets tough as ********. Wait, they were old games too......you know, some modern games really are getting easier and easier, as well as dumber and generic.
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Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 4:46 pm
Zombicide It might have to do with the fact that the point of view in older games (2-D) made it harder to dodge enemy attacks, and that many newer games have unlimited lives. However, there are still some hard 3-D games. Look at the original Doom games, for instance. Crank it up to any difficulty past the "Hey! Not Too Rough!" difficulty, and it gets tough as ********. Wait, they were old games too......you know, some modern games really are getting easier and easier, as well as dumber and generic. It has little to nothing to do with it being 2-D. Getting hit with enemies cost you more health (I would loose multiple hearts (2-4) per hit on the first two Zelda games). Plus games like UN Squadron were difficult overall and had little to nothing to do with it being 2-D (Though there are games in which it may be they case but more time than not, it being in 2-D or 3-D didn't make a difference.)
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Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 4:51 pm
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Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 5:08 pm
HistoryWak Zombicide It might have to do with the fact that the point of view in older games (2-D) made it harder to dodge enemy attacks, and that many newer games have unlimited lives. However, there are still some hard 3-D games. Look at the original Doom games, for instance. Crank it up to any difficulty past the "Hey! Not Too Rough!" difficulty, and it gets tough as ********. Wait, they were old games too......you know, some modern games really are getting easier and easier, as well as dumber and generic. It has little to nothing to do with it being 2-D. Getting hit with enemies cost you more health (I would loose multiple hearts (2-4) per hit on the first two Zelda games). Plus games like UN Squadron were difficult overall and had little to nothing to do with it being 2-D (Though there are games in which it may be they case but more time than not, it being in 2-D or 3-D didn't make a difference.) Alright, then. I withdraw my first proposal. However, I still think games back then were tougher than most modern games. People make Halo 3 look like the toughest game ever when on Legendary, however, little do they realize Contra III on Hard mode and the original Doom games on Nightmare were easily 10 billion times harder.
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Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 5:10 pm
Old games weren't harder. They were cheaper and ridden with far more technical limitations leading to shoddy coding though.
Clipping, hit detection, Aim bots, etc. It was the illusion of being hard but really a majority of the time it was the game design. For example look at Crash Bandicoot versus Crash Bandicoot 2. There really wasn't any change in difficulty but the coding was better in 2. You wouldn't land on a platform and slip through it just because you were with in the hit detection margin of error as often.
Plus, often times the programmers would do things to make the game seem longer by cheating you.
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Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 5:23 pm
I've noticed the same thing.
I think the reason is because of how gameplay changes over the years. We're so used to current games that the differences in gameplay in games from long ago make older games hard. Even if it seems like as games go on, there's little to no difference, it's because the changes are so subtle that collectively, the changes are big.
Idk, I'm just brainstorming.
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Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 9:37 pm
The Death Blues Mix Old games weren't harder. They were cheaper and ridden with far more technical limitations leading to shoddy coding though.
Clipping, hit detection, Aim bots, etc. It was the illusion of being hard but really a majority of the time it was the game design. For example look at Crash Bandicoot versus Crash Bandicoot 2. There really wasn't any change in difficulty but the coding was better in 2. You wouldn't land on a platform and slip through it just because you were with in the hit detection margin of error as often.
Plus, often times the programmers would do things to make the game seem longer by cheating you. Well..Contra was b***h even with the thirty man code. Super Mario the Lost Levels were hard. Ghost N' Goblins was hard, Megaman 1 and 2 were hard. The ******** X series was a b***h. If you want shoddy and shitty codding then play some Codemasters or Acclaim games. Some games were meant to be hard.
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Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 11:01 pm
Kaiba-X The Death Blues Mix Old games weren't harder. They were cheaper and ridden with far more technical limitations leading to shoddy coding though.
Clipping, hit detection, Aim bots, etc. It was the illusion of being hard but really a majority of the time it was the game design. For example look at Crash Bandicoot versus Crash Bandicoot 2. There really wasn't any change in difficulty but the coding was better in 2. You wouldn't land on a platform and slip through it just because you were with in the hit detection margin of error as often.
Plus, often times the programmers would do things to make the game seem longer by cheating you. Well..Contra was b***h even with the thirty man code. Super Mario the Lost Levels were hard. Ghost N' Goblins was hard, Megaman 1 and 2 were hard. The ******** X series was a b***h. If you want shoddy and shitty codding then play some Codemasters or Acclaim games. Some games were meant to be hard.
True difficulty comes from the need to improve, to acquire skills fit to beat whatever challenge comes. Not from memorizing a set pattern and hoping you make it.
For example, Call of Duty 4 is hard because they keep throwing endless amounts of enemies at you if you don't reach a certain point in the level, not because the AI is incredibly intelligent.
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Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2008 12:23 am
HistoryWak I noticed that many many games from years ago (Late 80s and first half of 90s) are much harder than the games today. What do you think? Is that a good or bad thing? Discuss. Yes and no. I personally believe that game physics have advanced and become natural, which is why going back to old Metroid games are so damn hard. While the puzzles and bosses are much simpler, the interface makes it harder now. But simplicity DOES make a lot of things easier. While we see more complex stuff -- puzzle solving with Zelda bosses -- we may forget that there was a time when all you had to do was blast away. If the gun wasn't working, you needed a bigger gun. That part is easy. You just have to remember that the boss has more power, too.
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Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2008 5:31 am
Kaiba-X The Death Blues Mix Old games weren't harder. They were cheaper and ridden with far more technical limitations leading to shoddy coding though.
Clipping, hit detection, Aim bots, etc. It was the illusion of being hard but really a majority of the time it was the game design. For example look at Crash Bandicoot versus Crash Bandicoot 2. There really wasn't any change in difficulty but the coding was better in 2. You wouldn't land on a platform and slip through it just because you were with in the hit detection margin of error as often.
Plus, often times the programmers would do things to make the game seem longer by cheating you. Well..Contra was b***h even with the thirty man code. Super Mario the Lost Levels were hard. Ghost N' Goblins was hard, Megaman 1 and 2 were hard. The ******** X series was a b***h. If you want shoddy and shitty codding then play some Codemasters or Acclaim games. Some games were meant to be hard. I agree. Shitty coding wasn't the reason most games were extremely hard. Most of these older games weren't plagued with shitty or shoddy coding. Only some like the ones you mention did.
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Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2008 7:49 am
Kaiba-X The Death Blues Mix Old games weren't harder. They were cheaper and ridden with far more technical limitations leading to shoddy coding though.
Clipping, hit detection, Aim bots, etc. It was the illusion of being hard but really a majority of the time it was the game design. For example look at Crash Bandicoot versus Crash Bandicoot 2. There really wasn't any change in difficulty but the coding was better in 2. You wouldn't land on a platform and slip through it just because you were with in the hit detection margin of error as often.
Plus, often times the programmers would do things to make the game seem longer by cheating you. Well..Contra was b***h even with the thirty man code. Super Mario the Lost Levels were hard. Ghost N' Goblins was hard, Megaman 1 and 2 were hard. The ******** X series was a b***h. If you want shoddy and shitty codding then play some Codemasters or Acclaim games. Some games were meant to be hard. True, and another thing that made Contra hard was the there were so many enemies coming at you at once, and that they were always attacking. Also, you died in one hit. Some games were just meant to be hard; shitty programming had very little (if anything at all) to do with it.
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