Welcome to Gaia! ::

You've got a point, and it's one I've been mulling over since before the chat even started. I never had any intention of revolutionizing Gaia and taking it back to the way it was when I started talking to Mob last week, because that's impossible. And I recognize that people will continue to buy from the cash shop because, well, that's what people do, and when you target the group that Gaia's targeting, it's usually worse since a number of them want everything that they can get their hands on, just to have it. By th end of the chat, I'd figured out what I wanted though.

Gaia started out as a community, small time, but we felt like we were being taken care of, and in return we took care of Gaia, donating each month, and were rewarded of course, but that doesn't change the fact that we donated. And Gaia thrived because of it. And we never really knew where we were going, things would just happen. Things like towns, puzzles, word bump, slots and cards? All a surprise, and all welcomed, albeit with some complaining about glitches, but they still were a part of the community. And now, Gaia's going big, really big, and we have no idea what's going on aside from the battle system still being worked on. But apparently Gaia has a plan for the future.

And as a community, we should be able to be a part of that. To know what's going on with the inner workings more than just dev journal updates. We're an important part of the community, just like the people in the offices, not as integral but we still keep Gaia up and running. We're curious about the future, we want to know where Gaia's going, we want to be sure that the money we are putting in is going to... somewhere. Paying for servers and employees, yes, that's obvious, they're not working for free. But what about the rest?

Right now, it's just amorphous, a kind of unsure blob that's hovering over everything that's going on with Gaia. It's a company now, and we need to test the waters, because we're not operating under the same rules as before. Maybe it's just me talking, but messing with the marketplace isn't the goal, the goal is to be heard and to get some answers to the questions we have. And I think that those points are valid, I'd like to say that we deserve it, as members of the community, but the fact is we might not. That doesn't mean that we can't push and try to find out anyway, and if it puts the user base at ease, then why should they withhold answers?

I don't know, I'm still pissed about it, not knowing where Gaia, the company, is going because it didn't matter before, we were a community and that was all there was to it, we supported each other. We're much bigger now and things have changed a lot, maybe it's time to see how much. It's not about stopping change, it's about understanding why so that the community can grow with the company.

I hope that other people still feel the same, I think it's worthwhile to at least attempt.

This is tl;dr, so I'll summarize it: Basically, did they create this monster from nothing? Or is this the monster that we wanted?
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I wasn't here for the AIM chat. But...like, has Gaia really changed that much? I say this a lot in threads like these in GCD, and it bears repeating here as well.

I worked in the Exchange for quite a few months back in 2004. There weren't all the new shinies from Gaia itself, but the members haven't changed too much - there's just as much wanking before over pixels, though the names are different now.

I mean, if we were just donating because we loved Gaia, we wouldn't have had a near-riot over the bear pajamas, right? We would have accepted the OMG and AFK with open arms upon initial release, right? We would have never nitpicked about the chain wallet being too small, or the hamster hats being a fugly color, or am I mistaken in my thinking?

And we certainly wouldn't regularly blow up to $200 a month here. (And I mean, regularly.)

Because, after all, back in the day everything was benevolent. Everything was good. There weren't Exchange whores ruining the marketplace and causing the site to seize up in massive amounts of dramatics. There weren't unfair restores because the user had really rare items. And all the moderators were certainly pure of heart and there weren't rampant accusations of corruption.

That said, I do have humongous concerns about the responsibility of many people involved - members and admins included. I hear members saying, "Well, I really hate this item's price...but I have to have ten of it anyway!" And while Gaia does receive money out of the deal, I also have to wonder what the point is where responsibility to your customers trumps the bottom line, and whether that rubicon has been crossed yet. Reading the stories of people who invest hundreds of dollars into having all the evolving items...I have little reason to believe it hasn't.

And I also feel that Gaia as of late has expressed FAR more concern with the bottom line. The amount of sitewide announcements that are concerned with advertising is staggering - I think we get about five announcements of that type a week. And while I'm glad that I was introduced to Cary Brothers (I thought the song I heard off of him was pretty good), it just seems like it's a bit much.

I mean, in the first week of December, we got an announcement that the Cinemas were now being sponsored by Warner Brothers, The Hills thing, and the Tsubasa: Reservoir Chronicle thing. While I respect the right for all three, I think that having them all released in the same week was a bit much.

Even so, I think that actions speak louder than words. We denounce the actions of the greedy money-grubbing corporation that Gaia has become...then gleefully do their bidding with gold signs in our eyes. We say that the Hermes' Moon is obscenely expensive, then whip out our credit cards and buy ten of them to sell on the marketplace. And we say that having MTV on Gaia is condescending to their userbase and that they've sold out...and then we scurry off to Gaia's Hollywood to get that next pair of skinny jeans.

One saying that's been repeated numerous times when people express displeasure at the American political system is that "you don't get the government you want; you get the government you deserve." I can't help but think that the same might apply to Gaia.

Something I think that should be pointed out is the fact that it was much easier to obtain those older items. Even last year. It wasn't terribly difficult to whore myself up to headphones, etc...but if I were to start that process a couple months ago, it would take about 10 times as long. The discrepancy between the rich and poor is growing with middle class kinda disappearing/not really mattering (kinda like America lulz). So yes, there are differences between then and now. I dabbled in exchanging a little in 04. I recall Mellikor doing the same and getting a pair of minis within weeks. Now? It would take most people a good year, if that.

I see AI more than I ever have. I can also attribute this to the increasing amount of gold being generated by the site. Sure, we can place fault on both sides of this. It seems to me like the sheer amount of users on the site tend to magnify the issues tenfold. Of course 03/04/05 is going to look peachy.

Why would people have to have more than one hammi hat? Or one pair of headphones? Why would someone need about 8 mythrill armors? I think the answer there is rather obvious. People like covering themselves in s**t and admins know this and picked up on it. Kudos to them for making multi-equips thus generating more donations/purchases from users.

PG: You mentioned before something about how it's likely many people have traits of autism and I think it's likely a number of people on here have many sorts of issues of the sort. Nit picking and collecting would probably be traits of OCD. Missing an item would probably make people insane, so they'd have to buy into it. It could also be that this virtual environment creates that in otherwise normal individuals as well. I'm sure that's why Gaia put in the disclaimer about assuming no responsibility for those with psychological addictions and the like.

Personally, I think it sucks what Gaia's doing, but I'm a collector. Sure, maybe I won't participate in sponsorers, but I will happily nab those items off the vend for a gold or two. Gaia plays into a level of psychology. The moon, for example, perhaps people disagree with the price, but I'm willing to be a chunk of the moons out there are generated from daddy's credit card. I'm not sure some of us who struggle to save money and scrounge it up when needed are pouring money into pixels. Maybe it's just me? Anyway, about the moons, I would never ever pay $10 for one...but yes, I had to get one from the vend. Why when I don't even support the grossly overpriced items? Because I collect. Wonder if it's kinda neat and I'd like to use it later on in an avi? Wonder if it gets way too expensive and just keeps inflating? Better get it while it's cheap then! That's my thought process and I wonder if it's similar to other people.

Gross generalizations though are not a fair assumption to be universally applied...especially about America. I vote for things that don't pass. That's just how it is and is going to be, but I don't think we all deserve it.

Maybe for the majority..the people cluttering the CB, GCD, GD, what have you, but I think we're talking a huge minority here and I'm just saying that our ideal Gaia is never going to be.


Yikes at people spending hundreds x____x I bet they might regret that in a few years xDDD

To correct my previous post: My last point - actually, the entire thing - was directed toward the now million-strong Gaian community. I'm not saying that it's Kimi's fault or Kin's fault or Mala's fault or even my fault that Gaia is the way it is. (Okay, maybe it's Cynder's fault. But he's not here.) It's not the actions of a few - it's the actions of the whole, which are far more difficult (and probably impossible) to control.

Anyway. To be fair, though, I think the best businesses make a profit without having the consumers realize it. Of course, consumers should be well aware about it (I'm not going to go deal with any business with less than a cynical eye, even the highly idealized Google - they have amazingly good web applications, but they're still a business venture), but it shouldn't be glaringly obvious.

Moreover, this risks sounding much like, "How can Craig Sherman sleep at night?," but I have doubts when a business begins to start exploiting people who...may not be able to stop themselves. I mean, I'd certainly rather receive $10 each from 10 people who can control their spending than $200+ (and people have used mules to get around this cap) from someone who thinks that getting every Gaia item is the most important thing in the world. While I know it's the holidays and all, one only has to look at GCD for a short while to see the latter in play, and I can't help but think that it might be in Gaia's best interests to say, "Look, we appreciate your money, but it's a bit much."

And by "Gaia," I mean both the community and the corporation.

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One other thing I just thought of. Well, two things:

1) Compared to iRO, the administration of Gaia is highly involved. Granted, Gaia and RO are two different animals (one's a social network, the other's a more competitive venture), and iRO's GMs do have to be somewhat aloof to dissolve any notions of favoritism. However, the largest issue I had with the company's service was that they were a faceless company until very recently.

2) I'm guessing that a lot of this topic is due to inflation concerns. First, if you think that inflation is currently out of control...it was even more out of control back in 2003 and 2004. It was just that everything was more within reach back then; even the halo was only something like...15 mil in stuff. (Granted, 15 mil was far more significant, but still.) But this actually reminds me of what happened on RO.

Basically, when I left last September (just before Veins update - you guys might know it as Beins), inflation on RO was out of control. Stuff I'd bought for 5 mil and had not had its drop rates changed went up past 10 or 15 mil. (And this wasn't expensive stuff; this was common stuff, like over-upgraded slotted bucklers and chainmails. But Veins brought Thor's Volcano, which is a very high-experience dungeon. (I believe it ties Biolabs in exp gain.) However, the way people leveled there required vast amounts of white potions/healing; though priests can heal, using pots actually led to faster experience gain. People spent vast amounts on potions as a result.

The result? I came back, and inflation was back around 2005-2006 levels. Stuff that was 20 mil was now closer to 10 mil. And I had quite a bit of money to play with when I came back, which was nice.

Granted, this update was imported directly from Korea (all our updates are), so we didn't have a say. But I can't help but think that Gaia should implement a gold sink of that nature, and that would assuage a lot of concerns.