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 Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 12:55 pm
I've noticed a few things that bother me when it comes to bending. And now I'm going to tell them to you, because I have nothing better to do.
1. Earthbenders bending coal. (From the Imprisoned episode)-
This one really bothers me. Coal is made from fossilised plants, NOT earth. Last time I checked, Earthbenders can't bend plants or fossils.
That also brings up the question of whether or not Earthbenders can bend rocks that originated organically, i.e. amber or limestone.
2. Firebenders bending lightning.-
I don't have any fancy facts for this one, but I'm pretty sure lightning and fire aren't that related. I think they just added it to add points to the Fire Nation's coolness factor.
3. Bending lava...magma...whatever. -
Lava/magma is made from molten rocks. That's right: Earth. So that means Earthbenders are the ones who should be bending lava/magma. But since it involves heat, does that mean both Firebenders AND Earthbenders can bend lava/magma? Intriguing...
Whew. Feels good to get THAT off my chest.
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 2:06 pm
Darling, we've had this same debate so many times I'm loosing count. I've just decided ******** it! Until the show gives us an answer on the magma thing, neither of them can bend it.
Lightning is actually near directly related to fire, for one thing it is raw power, much like fire and the firebending form. For another thing lightning is a direct result of fire, much of the time. Lightning can be generated by large forest fires, volcanic eruptions of both magma and ash, thunderstorms, etc. But I think the main connection the show makes is that it is raw energy and power, it can be deadly and uncontrollable, much like fire.
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[Hollow Point] Vice Captain
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 2:12 pm
I've actually commented on this in one of my AllPoetry groups.
Earth is never defined, so it's very broad. What exactly makes up earth?Carbon, Iron, Sodium, and Potassium just to name a few. What are the other elements in Coal, besides Carbon?
There is popular debate on this. If that's the case, they why is it Toph is the only Earth Bender able to bend metal? The show has demonstrated that metal is refined earth, and she's able to "see" the earth in the metal. However, some argue that she's just a step ahead of other earth benders. Others argue that it's because her bending style is different. Regular earth benders use a style based off of Hung Gar, where as Toph uses a style based off of Southern Praying Mantis Kung Fu. Wikipedia says "Metalbending is a skill that, as of the end of Book 2: Earth, only Toph possesses. Most Earthbenders are unable to affect processed metals. Usually, the trace amount of earth still present in metal is so minute that it goes undetected even to the best Earthbenders. However, due to her ability to "see" earth, Toph is able to locate the small fragments of earth in metal, target them, and utilize them to "bend" the metal portion."
Firebending is explained in Chapter 9 of Book 2, as is bending Lightening. I recieved this from Avatar Spirit, where you can go and find the transcript of the show for yourself.
Iroh: Lightning is a pure expression of firebending, without aggression. It is not fueled by rage or emotion the way other firebending is. Some call lightning the cold-blooded fire. (Iroh takes the tea kettle off the fire and pours it into another pot. He then begins to pour two cups.) It is precise and deadly, like Azula. To perform the technique requires peace of mind.
(He hands a cup to Zuko.)
Zuko: I see. That’s why we’re drinking tea: To calm the mind.
Iroh: Oh yeah, good point! I mean, yes.
(Cut to the outside of the building. Zuko and Iroh stand on the edge of a hill overlooking the valley with a walled, abandoned city at the bottom.)
Iroh: There is energy all around us. (Cut to a front view of Zuko and Iroh.) The energy is both yin and yang; positive energy and negative energy. (He holds up one finger on each hand to stand for the two forms of energy.) Only a select few firebenders can separate these energies. This creates an imbalance. The energy wants to restore balance and in a moment the positive and negative energy come crashing back together. (He brings his hands together to illustrate the point.) You provide release and guidance, creating lightning.
As for bending magma, I'm up in the air about that myself. I've had it explained that the reason Fire Lord Sozen was able to bend the Magma was because he was using the heat and the "hot" energies, but I disagree. It's really hot rock, thus only earth benders should be able to bend it. It is eart.
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 2:27 pm
I've thought about making a debate thread regarding metal bending and such. I don't quite agree with you on the coal issue. Sure, it's made from decomposing plants, but you also have to keep in mind the processes that occur to transform it into coal. In the end, they resemble nothing of the organisms they once were.
Take a petrified tree for example. An earthbender should have no problem manipulating that. It's no longer a tree, elements have infiltrated the structure to turn it essentially into a rock.
Or something. I'm not quite ready to debate the matter yet... Maybe I'll just make one big thread to encompass all of the bending anomalies.
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 4:05 pm
rpgamer987 I've thought about making a debate thread regarding metal bending and such. I don't quite agree with you on the coal issue. Sure, it's made from decomposing plants, but you also have to keep in mind the processes that occur to transform it into coal. In the end, they resemble nothing of the organisms they once were. Take a petrified tree for example. An earthbender should have no problem manipulating that. It's no longer a tree, elements have infiltrated the structure to turn it essentially into a rock. Or something. I'm not quite ready to debate the matter yet... Maybe I'll just make one big thread to encompass all of the bending anomalies. isn't there already one? there definatly is- just add to it. I know people like morgan are getting seriously pissed off.
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:46 pm
1. Earthbenders bending coal. (From the Imprisoned episode)-
This one really bothers me. Coal is made from fossilised plants, NOT earth. Last time I checked, Earthbenders can't bend plants or fossils.
That also brings up the question of whether or not Earthbenders can bend rocks that originated organically, i.e. amber or limestone.
Well, plants are a form of earth. and if earth benders are just stuck with bending ROCKS then how did Toph help Katara bend the muck in the episode with the fire nation drill that was attacking the walls of Ba Sing Sai? Or the Master episode when Sokka gives Toph a piece of the metior (SP?) to bend and she was able to bend it?
I think that for the whole argument of the issue of who can bend plants; Water or Earth, I think that the both could since there is water in the plants and they are also part of the earth.
Kind of like the whole Katara being able to bend the blood in a body. You never really know what the writers are going to make up.
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 6:00 pm
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Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 9:17 pm
1. But isn't most dirt made from decomposed plant life? Earthbenders can bend dirt. I think there's a bit of ambiguity there.
2. Yeah, I don't really have any fancy facts either, but my science teacher this year did a move that ttly looked like Iroh redirecting lightning, and he was showing how you could grab onto a Tesla coil without getting electrocuted, and so on and so forth. It was sweet, I was like, "OMGSCIENCE."
3. It's earthbending. As was shown in 306, Firebenders can siphon off the heat, but they can't control the lava or magma.
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Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 12:38 pm
LOL, I totally agree with that! I always wondered about the scientific relevance...but honestly, I decided that I don't want to think about it too much. Science is cool and all..but thinking too much about it ruins the magic of the show. ^_^ Remember, the Avatar universe is not the same world as Earth. Maybe science is different there.
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Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 2:38 pm
Like RPgamer said:
Petrified wood and coal are no longer plant based materials, through millions of years they have changed; petrified wood, is no longer wood, it is purely mineral, millions of years cause calcium, magnesium, iron, sulphide and other minerals to gradually build up in the wood preserving it and turning it into a hard rock like substance.
So far my first post has been the only one to explain anything about lightning... What you must understand is that in a fictional universe anything is possible, I mean it's not like someday there will be a person who will defy the laws of our world and firebend.
@Butterfly- I wouldn't want to grab a tesla coil eek
God, I'm so glad this guild doesnt have crazies. In the Danny Phantom guild (a really s**t guild, btw) there was some crazy b***h me and Magenta got into an argument with. She claimed that she was really half ghost, and that there are half ghosts just like her. She stopped posting after Magenta and I pwnted her hardcore.
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[Hollow Point] Vice Captain
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Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 4:10 pm
[Hollow Point] Like RPgamer said: Petrified wood and coal are no longer plant based materials, through millions of years they have changed; petrified wood, is no longer wood, it is purely mineral, millions of years cause calcium, magnesium, iron, sulphide and other minerals to gradually build up in the wood preserving it and turning it into a hard rock like substance. So far my first post has been the only one to explain anything about lightning... What you must understand is that in a fictional universe anything is possible, I mean it's not like someday there will be a person who will defy the laws of our world and firebend. @Butterfly- I wouldn't want to grab a tesla coil eek God, I'm so glad this guild doesnt have crazies. In the Danny Phantom guild (a really s**t guild, btw) there was some crazy b***h me and Magenta got into an argument with. She claimed that she was really half ghost, and that there are half ghosts just like her. She stopped posting after Magenta and I pwnted her hardcore. But does that mean Earthbenders can bend petrified amber too? It seems like bending sap would be a bit of a stretch...
Earthbending is pretty fickle.
And WTF half ghost??
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Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 4:36 pm
Coska 1. Earthbenders bending coal. (From the Imprisoned episode)- This one really bothers me. Coal is made from fossilised plants, NOT earth. Last time I checked, Earthbenders can't bend plants or fossils. That also brings up the question of whether or not Earthbenders can bend rocks that originated organically, i.e. amber or limestone. Well, plants are a form of earth. and if earth benders are just stuck with bending ROCKS then how did Toph help Katara bend the muck in the episode with the fire nation drill that was attacking the walls of Ba Sing Sai? Or the Master episode when Sokka gives Toph a piece of the metior (SP?) to bend and she was able to bend it?
I think that for the whole argument of the issue of who can bend plants; Water or Earth, I think that the both could since there is water in the plants and they are also part of the earth.
Kind of like the whole Katara being able to bend the blood in a body. You never really know what the writers are going to make up. Plants are organisms, not earth. They need water to survive and can reproduce. Rocks, minerals, and soil don't and can't. Plants are not earth.
Toph was able to help Katara bend the mud because there was soil/crushed rocks in it, not plants. And we can pretty much assume that the meteor is made of some type of mineral or rock. The term earth is just a blanket statement used in place of rocks, minerals, soil, dirt, etc.
It generally varies from person to person, but the average human body is about 70% water, approximately. It makes perfect sense for a waterbender to be able to bend the water in a person, and if they were particular creative and cruel, suck the water out of them, pulling out their very essence, and leaving behind a shriveled and twisted body.
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[Hollow Point] Vice Captain
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Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 7:31 pm
Coska 1. Earthbenders bending coal. (From the Imprisoned episode)- This one really bothers me. Coal is made from fossilised plants, NOT earth. Last time I checked, Earthbenders can't bend plants or fossils. That also brings up the question of whether or not Earthbenders can bend rocks that originated organically, i.e. amber or limestone. Well, plants are a form of earth. and if earth benders are just stuck with bending ROCKS then how did Toph help Katara bend the muck in the episode with the fire nation drill that was attacking the walls of Ba Sing Sai? It was a mix of wall and water. The wall was made of Earth therefore is a mix of water and earth.
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Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 9:40 pm
Also something to keep in mind with earthbending. As has been pointed out, it's a rather vague category. Just like airbending. Airbenders don't necessarily manipulate the nitrogen or oxygen in the air, they bend air, regardless of contents.
Earthbenders can't necessarily separate the humus (decaying organic matter) and limestone and such, they just bend the earth, regardless of what's in it.
Perhaps, though, the benders need a certain composition in order to be able to manipulate a material... calcium is found in earth, iirc, so could earthbenders take control of bones?
The vagueness of it all makes it all very complex.
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