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emotional appeals vs. emotional ploys

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Erasmas

PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2007 10:20 pm


I will admit in this debate, it's hard to tell what's an emotional appeal and what's an emotional ploy.

I think emotional appeals are made for them. I think arguments like, 'well, what about rape victims" is an emotional appeal to make their argument stronger. I think emotional ploys are arguments like, "what about woman's right to bodily domain" that mean to discredit your argument by pointing out your inhumane logic.

Am I right or wrong?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 3:13 pm


I don't see how pointing out my actual individual rights weakens any part of my logic.
To me it sounds a lot more logical to be able to exercise your rights than just have them unless you intend to exercise them or are in a specific situation.

Tyshia2


lymelady
Vice Captain

PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 5:06 pm


I don't fully understand, I'm a bit slow at times.

Are you saying that an emotional appeal strengthens an argument because it appeals to emotion without accusing the opponent of lacking empathy, but an emotional ploy seeks to make the opponent seem like he or she doesn't care?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 2:56 pm


I don't agree. I think that appealing to emotions is always an emotional ploy when it comes to this issue. It is an attempt to use someone's emotional reaction to something to convince them of something when a logical point wouldn't.

WatersMoon110
Crew


Tiger of the Fire

PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2007 12:11 am


WatersMoon110
I don't agree. I think that appealing to emotions is always an emotional ploy when it comes to this issue. It is an attempt to use someone's emotional reaction to something to convince them of something when a logical point wouldn't.


Dittoed
PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2007 8:09 pm


Some of them are just bad, like that "In Mommy's Tummy" poem thing on the front page. I'm typing this here so thar I don't bump that stupid poem in the hopes that it will fall back down into obscurity, so hackneyed, shmaltzy and cheesy it is.

divineseraph


WatersMoon110
Crew

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 2:09 pm


divineseraph
Some of them are just bad, like that "In Mommy's Tummy" poem thing on the front page. I'm typing this here so thar I don't bump that stupid poem in the hopes that it will fall back down into obscurity, so hackneyed, shmaltzy and cheesy it is.

Agreed. That poem makes my brain hurt, mostly due to it being badly written (I am really particular about poetry). And it is a very good example of an emotional appeal.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 11:12 am


Quote:
I don't agree. I think that appealing to emotions is always an emotional ploy when it comes to this issue. It is an attempt to use someone's emotional reaction to something to convince them of something when a logical point wouldn't.


I think some emotional appeals are meant to enhance one's argument, instead of demean the opposing argument. We see more emotional ploys than emotional appeals, I will admit. But I don't think they're always the same.

Erasmas


WatersMoon110
Crew

PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 11:42 am


Erasmas
WatersMoon110
I don't agree. I think that appealing to emotions is always an emotional ploy when it comes to this issue. It is an attempt to use someone's emotional reaction to something to convince them of something when a logical point wouldn't.

I think some emotional appeals are meant to enhance one's argument, instead of demean the opposing argument. We see more emotional ploys than emotional appeals, I will admit. But I don't think they're always the same.

Even so, even if the point is to strengthen one's own argument, I still feel that appealing to emotions is a ploy.

The definition of ploy is:
Ploy
An action calculated to frustrate an opponent or gain an advantage indirectly or deviously; a maneuver


Strengthening one's own argument is an attempt to gain an (indirect) advantage, in my opinion.

I mean, I completely agree that using emotions to attack "the other side" is this debate is far, far worse that using emotions to strengthen one's point. But I don't feel that either should be done in debate, if it is possible to avoid them. *grin*
PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 10:37 am


There's a fair amount of emotion on both sides. Unless we get a bunch of Asperger's patients to debate for us, there is going to be emotion. That's why I hate when their (or "you all"s) side acts like they will concede a point when they see proof. That's bullshit. You'll concede a point when you're convinced you're wrong. Even if you give them proof, they're going to b***h about minutiae like wording or the year it was written. Emotional appeals to enhance your argument are fine because you're making your argument better. You're not attacking someone else's argument to be spiteful.

Erasmas


rweghrheh

PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 4:02 pm


In the end, I think it's best to leave emotions out of debates if possible. If they can't control their emotions then it's best to get out of the debate (at least until they calm down).

So emotional appeal is emotional ploy if you try to use it for debating yourside (like try like to make people feel bad or sorry for them instead of just of stating facts and trying to prove their right).

That is why I stopped debating in the ED forum cause of all that crap. I got tired of all the emotional appeals/ploy and losing my cool all the time. I realised noone was really winning the debate.
PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 9:44 am


Your interchangeable use of "you" and "they" is rather confusing. Which is why I tend to stick to "one" when I can, even though it leads to somewhat convoluted sentences. *grin*
Erasmas
There's a fair amount of emotion on both sides. Unless we get a bunch of Asperger's patients to debate for us, there is going to be emotion. That's why I hate when their (or "you all"s) side acts like they will concede a point when they see proof. That's bullshit.
Well, maybe in your opinion. But, frankly, many Pro-Choicers simply do not see the medical facts about pregnancy and abortion or the legal cases dealing with abortion and with bodily integrity as giving support to the Pro-Life side of things (though at times this is only the case when one has a pre-existing bias). To such Pro-Choicers, there are no logical points that back up the Pro-Life stance, and so they really don't (seem to) understand why anyone would be Pro-Life (or, in some cases, they put very wrong reasons behind the Pro-Life stance).
Erasmas
You'll concede a point when you're convinced you're wrong. Even if you give them proof, they're going to b***h about minutiae like wording or the year it was written.
Well, many Pro-Choicers seem to try and keep up to date on all medical reports and studies about pregnancy and abortion. So when new data is thrown into the debate at hand, they want to know the source. When the information has since been refuted, they often counter with more recent information (or sometimes just say that isn't true and don't bother to back it up - but usually there are other sources).

What is "proof" for you is not always proof for everyone, mind. Pro-Choicers often see legal personhood not applying to unborn humans as "proof" that abortion should always be legal, but you obviously don't see that as proof, right? Can you see how something can be "proof" for one view point and not proof for another?
Erasmas
Emotional appeals to enhance your argument are fine because you're making your argument better. You're not attacking someone else's argument to be spiteful.
Just because using emotions doesn't always put down someone doesn't make it a good choice. When it comes to debating abortion, trying to use emotions to convince another of the "right-ness" (or "wrong-ness") of a given point, one is far more likely to put off the very people one is trying to convince than to sway them.

WatersMoon110
Crew

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Pro-Life/Pro-Choice Discussion

 
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