|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
 Posted: Wed Dec 13, 2006 6:05 pm
LonesLover And what does having a house have to do with anything? Not everyone has a house when they have kids. I've never lived in a house, always an apartment. I don't think children are raised any better by living in a house. Technically, it has nothing to do with having kids. As we've discussed, different people have different ideas of what you need to/should accomplish before having children. For some people, it's when you've got the money to do it. Other people think you should have big steps out of the way, such as college and purchasing a house, retirement funds, etc. It's just really about what you think is important, and whether you want to do it solo, or have a kid in the mix which can complicate things, but definitely not make them impossible. We live in a rental house at the moment, and I'm actually GLAD. When things break, or when we have problems, it's not our responsibility to fix, which also means we don't PAY to fix it. With our income right now, we'd live in a crappy house anyway, so it's BETTER for us to not own a home right now. We'll worry about buying a house when my husband and I have paid for college, gone THROUGH college, and have solid careers so we can afford a house we'd actually want to live in, and be able to afford the repairs and upkeep that come with it. So it's all a matter of opinion. However, the one thing that's generally agreed upon is that you should have a place of your own, rented or owned. Raising kids is tough, and you don't need other people around telling you what to do (relatives), or being unsafe because they don't care as much about your child as you do (roommates). A good, sturdy roof over their head is what's important, not who owns the roof. However, when you're the one who owns it (whether rented or owned) that means that YOU'RE responsible for it, and no one can pull it out from under you and screw you over. That's what being an adult and a responsible parent is about, is making sure that you are in charge of the important things, rather than relying on others to provide them.
|
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Wed Dec 13, 2006 6:20 pm
@Savina:
Exactly. You can raise your child in any type of home as long as it's a stable place to live and there's a roof and heat.
You wouldn't want to rush in and say "I'll take this house! It's all I can afford!" Buy it and find out that the heat hardly workds cuz that's money there and things like that. I preferre renting. In an apartment you don't pay for gas, water, trash, taxes, ect. You pay for rent, electric, and anythign else you want or need. We're heading towards that direction more than anything.
Off topic but another big reason I thought about was...well...
Mike almost died multiple times when he was with his parents. Like, he was walking on some ledge(he showed me)and fell in and nearly drown. Another thing is that the baby carriage went out into traffic. He used to run accross abusy street and no one watched him. He'd walk to his friend's house(this was all befor ehe was 6 years old, mind you!)by himself! I mean, I've considered that the moment I am pregnant, getting some kind of court order so they can't be alone with my or any other children. Really, they don't even take proper care of their cat. I think I just wanted a baby so bad, I forgot about all this.. So...
I don't even trust them with my dog, much less something so important as my child.
@Lunashock:
well, I realized I was letting my desire to be a mother get in the way of the praticalness of the decision.
I can't have children. Not now, I just shouldn't. Desire was almost driving me to do something stupid. Of course I want to be a mother, that's a woman instinct. But..back then, it wasn't as complicated to have kids. Back when there were cavemen, they lived in a community of 10 or more people so everyone watched the children. The only threats(besides diease)were animals and food. Now, it's food, place to live, people to care for. Hell, you can barely leave your child at a day care center without worry.
When I thought about this, I knew I needed a stable job that HAD paid maternity leave and that Mike had a better paying job.
I'll admit, at first I thought "Omg you're all wrong". But then I sad down and read through all the comments left on this subject and I realized I was wrong.
@LorienLlewellyn:
We're supposed to be paying rent but we need to pay everyone of first. We're supposed to pay $200 at least for rent and the difference in the electric and heat bill and half the internet bill. But because they know we owe them so much money($500-$700)they said we could wait.
As with everything else, I agree.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Wed Dec 13, 2006 6:56 pm
I found this article that may interest you or be helpful when you two are in a position to try for a baby. I read it in a baby magazine about a week ago, thought of it just now, and was actually able to find it on the web pretty quickly. http://babyissue.familytimes.biz/change.htmlIt's basically financial advice for soon-to-be parents. It talks about some of the things that will cost money that people might not have thought of and gives some advice. A lot of it is kind of common sense, but even so, when planning for a baby and trying to crunch the numbers, it is easy to forget about a possible expense or two.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Wed Dec 13, 2006 8:53 pm
LonesLover @Savina: @Harry_Manback: First off, we decided to wait. I think you should read an entire thread before posting, not just the first post. As for marriage...what does that have to do with having kids? Why do you need to be married to have kids? Personally, I can't stand people who think you should only have kids if you're married. Why commit your life to someone if you don't care for them, right? Just because you have kids, doesn't mean you love the person who fathered or mothered them. Really, I know how hard the real world is. I haven't seen my father since I was 2 and he's hardly paid any childsupport. My mom was always strained for cash and I've never lived in a home of my own. And if you read higher up, eariler in this post, you'll see how hard my life was up north. And what does having a house have to do with anything? Not everyone has a house when they have kids. I've never lived in a house, always an apartment. I don't think children are raised any better by living in a house. Have you ever considered that the reason why your life was so hard was because your upbringing lacked stability? Now, I don't know you and this is merely just assumptions, but you asked for opinions from strangers, so I'll give mine. I think that a permanent home (it doesn't matter if its rented or not) is important. I was raised in a very stable, two parent, upper income family, so obviously my answers are going to be biased. Some might call my early childhood "spoiled," but because of this I want my kids to have these luxuries my parent's thankfully provided me with. They were able to provide me with these luxuries by attending college, waiting till they were in their lates 20s to have me, owned 2 cars, a modest home and both held full-time jobs for 4+ years. Now, I''m not saying this stuff is essential to raising a happy and successful child, but everyone holds differenet ides of what success is. I've had so many opportunities thanks to my parents waiting and being responsible, like not having to pay for college, or cars when I was younger or vacations and whatever clothing I wanted and toys. But, now I support myself and I understand the value of what my parents sacrificed to make my brother and my early life as happy and care free as possible. I don't think you MUST own a home, but, and this is just my opinion, if you don't have enough money to buy your own home, then you probably don't have enough to raise a kid. Mortage payments are oftentimes the same amount as a high-end apt. rent. It's silly to continue renting when you've found a permanent place to call home, but that's just a lesson in economics. I am traditional in some senses, but only because I already know I will love my (unborn) children so much that I want the best for them. Life throws you curves, but there are some things you can do to ensure their success to a certain degree. I think if you PLAN (plan being the key word) to have kids you should be married. Like I said earlier marriage entitles you to a lot of benefits and protections of the law that being single doesn't. I'm pretty liberal about this stuff though, and I don't think that it's 1950 anymore and a woman must be married to be a great mother, but most women with kids will tell you that having a partner around to help sure helps this. And, if your partner is as great as you say he is, why is he okay with you having his baby (planned), but doesn't love you enough to marry you? Basically the bottom line of all this is maturity is reflected by delayed gratification. You WAIT until you're ready for things because to do otherwise would really be selfish. Accidents happen, but something like this, I think you should wait till you're mature and have the means to give your child the life it deserves. But, then again I'm not perfect either, and if everyone was as responsible as they "should" be, the world wouldn't be nearly as interesting or screwed up as it is. Don't take this too seriously though cause I see it was probably just a lark of an idea you had anyway. But, I thought I'd offer my opinion on the subject cause there are many others that actually do have kids under your circumstances (including some of my good friends - reason I feel so strongly in a way.)
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Dec 14, 2006 3:00 am
@Harry_Manback:
Although I hate to admit it, yes, my childhood wasn't stable or anything like yours. I'll go over my childhood so this may be a big post sweatdrop
My mom was I think 19 or 20 when she had my brother and I(twins). My father was tricked "I'm safe". Ya. I'm here so you can see that was a lie. She had her reasons and I can only assume she didn't think she'd have another chance at having children, which it turned out to be. She said it was a blessing that she had both a boy and a girl when she did because she never had any other children and is too old now(40 but there's no menopause yet).
Anyway, my father told her to put us up for adoption. His reason? "I'm not going to be a good father." I laughed when my mom told me this. Boy, was he right.
Quickly, I'll go into their childhoods.
Mom:
Hasn't been told "I love you" by her mother since she was 8, when her mom had babies(2, about 2 or so years apart, I think)
One was born fine and the next was born still born, cord around his neck. However, they were able to save him. They are my Uncle Brad and Craig.
Brad and Craig took up ALL my grandma's time and my mom had to do everything. Cook, clean, get firewood(they ended up moving way up north), feeding animals, everything. Needless to say, she was no longer special to her mother, she was 3rd.
Because of Brad's stillborn thing, he became the favorite. Craig didn't like this and would pick on Brad in many, many ways of which I don't really know.
My mom would stand up for Brad and Craig would get her for it.
One thing that stands out in my memory is that Craig chased her around with an axe and it is unclear if he had any intention to hurt her. Craig HATED them so it's hard to say. It truly was hate, you can be sure.
Dad:
Mother paid little or no attention to him.
Abusive
Depressed constantly
Mom got him a puppy and he watched the puppy get mauled by some horrible people, leaving a scar.
His mom threw a remote at him and it broke his nose. She threatened him not to tell anyone at the hospital about it or she'd do worse.
That's all I really know. My dad has commitment issues and things of the like.
Okay, while my mom was pregnant, my dad wasn't really abusive but I can't remember how he was, exactly.
But he stuck around after we were born. They got an apartment together.
One day my mom found out he was cheating. We were 2 then. She yelled at him the whole time after she found out.
They went to court. My father denies us. We ended up being like, 97.999% his. Har har. He got landed with childsupport which he hardly paid(owes my mom $8,000 in backed childsupport). She should have got more, though. It was only like, $150 per kid. I've heard of like, $300 or more per kid. But whatever.
So, mom moved out on her own. I can't remember a whole lot but family helped loads. Spoiled us alot, too. Mom wanted to give us a different childhood than what she had so we weren't expected to do anything, really. Big mistake.
Um....let's see...
We moved alot. Once or twice a year. We never had alot of money so when rent would go up, we would leave.
I'd hate to say my mom was a bad mother but she was certainly not ready. However, she did the best she could since it was just her, my brother, and me.
As for the house thing...I don't know. Personally, I'd rather live in a rental. I don't(usually)have to pay for water, gas, trash, and everything else. Which is good for me because I like it around 70 degrees in my home(which is isn't in here)and I adore taking showers and baths. I know that Mike's parents pay alot for water because his mom takes a bath or shower EVERYDAY! I mean, isn't that bad for your skin, not to mention the bill? Drr. Anyway, that's my view. I like apartments. Yes, I'd love to have a house and Mike and I have looked and found a few we love but we don't bother with a price. At least in an apartment you'll have a little more freedom because you're not taking care of the yard or how the house looks, you're taking care of the inside. If your stove breaks, the land lord gets a person to fix it and he pays for it. Of course, this means you can't buy the stove you like but at least it works.
But, I've always lived in apartments and I've never really minded them. As long as they have a pool(something we never had)and a play ground(alot of apartments have those around here! It's wonderful!)I'm content.
As for the marriage thing, we're getting married early next year, so I don't worry too much about that.
We were SUPPOSED to be married last august but I was under 18 and there was so much to do and something we found out about last minute it would have pushed the wedding back. We're going to go in to a courthouse, pay the people $100 for our license, wait the amount of days you need to, and pay $100 for the person to marry us. My dress is....xD My kimono. It's pretty so no worries. My mom and godmother are supposed to drive down, which is why it isn't in Nov/Dec like we planned.
@LorienLlewellyn:
^_^ Thankyou! Mike and I are going to look that over(I'm looking now, he will after work).
The only thing that worries me is childcare.
It was determined if I had children, my mom and godmother would watch over them. And, as I've said, I don't trust Mike's parents for s**t.
I'm also warry of daycare. I own the Rape and Abuse Survivors guild. I've read a few things about stuff happening in daycare not to mention the news always has something.
We both decided that it's sometimes better for a parent to stay home, if the family can afford it, than a daycare. I thought this through.
Of course, I wanted to be the stay-at-home mom but if I have a higher paying job than Mike, he's the stay-at-home parent.
But, sadly, if we can't afford for one of us to take off of work permentaly, we'll have to look into a good daycare(*waves bye bye to money*). lol They're expensive, I know. My cousin goes to one. @_@ But they're rich, so meh.
Thankyou for the article =D
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Dec 14, 2006 2:28 pm
LorienLlewellyn LonesLover And what does having a house have to do with anything? Not everyone has a house when they have kids. I've never lived in a house, always an apartment. I don't think children are raised any better by living in a house. I do not think that anyone said you actually have to own your own house, not an apartment or anything, before having a baby. I do, however, think that you should have some place of your own, could be an apartment, trailer, house, whatever, rather than having a baby in Mike's parents basement that you don't even pay rent for. (I know you said you are waiting, I just thought I would address the house issue). Living in Mom and Dad's basement rent free because you can't afford a place of your own (whatever that place may be) is not a good sign that you are ready for a baby. You should probably be able to stand on your on two feet for the most part before trying to get pregnant. I am not saying you have to be rich, but yes, I do think you should be able to pay your own rent, house payment, whatever. Babies are very expensive. If you can't afford rent, you probably can't afford a baby. I do not see living in Mom and Dad's basement rent free as being at a mature or stable time of your life for most people. I think babies deserve better than that. Do you honestly see nothing wrong with having a baby on purpose when you can't even pay any bills? When you live in a basement for free? When you don't make any money, and your boyfriend does not make much? I am not even going to count your $13 or whatever a month for xbox as a bill. Those are like your average 15-year-old's bills. I am not saying that adults can't have those bills, I am just saying they have them in addition to at least some of the following rent, car payment, mortgage, car insurance, taxes on the house, electricity, gas for the car, gas for the house. Having paid those bills in the past does not mean jack right now. You try telling your kid, "Well, I had enough money once," when you can't send him to college, or take him to the doctor, or when you get kicked out because people are sick of supporting you. I am not trying to be mean about it. I just think babies deserve so much more than you can offer one right now. Yes I believe they were talking about you guys having your own shelter. I lived with my parents with my husband for a year after my son was born.....It is not somthing i ever care to go through again. We have lived on our own for 3 years in our apartment. SPace is a little tight somtimes but hey its our home. That is one of the biggest things you should have when you have a baby. We can love our parents to death but when ther is a new baby they always butt in. "you shouldnt hold him like that" " he looks hungry" "he looks pale" "can I hold him" "support the head" By the end of the year I was ready to kill both my parents because I dealt with that nagging all day and they didnt even bother to learn the important stuff he had like meds and oxygen and feeding tube.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Dec 14, 2006 8:14 pm
wotfan LorienLlewellyn LonesLover And what does having a house have to do with anything? Not everyone has a house when they have kids. I've never lived in a house, always an apartment. I don't think children are raised any better by living in a house. I do not think that anyone said you actually have to own your own house, not an apartment or anything, before having a baby. I do, however, think that you should have some place of your own, could be an apartment, trailer, house, whatever, rather than having a baby in Mike's parents basement that you don't even pay rent for. (I know you said you are waiting, I just thought I would address the house issue). Living in Mom and Dad's basement rent free because you can't afford a place of your own (whatever that place may be) is not a good sign that you are ready for a baby. You should probably be able to stand on your on two feet for the most part before trying to get pregnant. I am not saying you have to be rich, but yes, I do think you should be able to pay your own rent, house payment, whatever. Babies are very expensive. If you can't afford rent, you probably can't afford a baby. I do not see living in Mom and Dad's basement rent free as being at a mature or stable time of your life for most people. I think babies deserve better than that. Do you honestly see nothing wrong with having a baby on purpose when you can't even pay any bills? When you live in a basement for free? When you don't make any money, and your boyfriend does not make much? I am not even going to count your $13 or whatever a month for xbox as a bill. Those are like your average 15-year-old's bills. I am not saying that adults can't have those bills, I am just saying they have them in addition to at least some of the following rent, car payment, mortgage, car insurance, taxes on the house, electricity, gas for the car, gas for the house. Having paid those bills in the past does not mean jack right now. You try telling your kid, "Well, I had enough money once," when you can't send him to college, or take him to the doctor, or when you get kicked out because people are sick of supporting you. I am not trying to be mean about it. I just think babies deserve so much more than you can offer one right now. Yes I believe they were talking about you guys having your own shelter. I lived with my parents with my husband for a year after my son was born.....It is not somthing i ever care to go through again. We have lived on our own for 3 years in our apartment. SPace is a little tight somtimes but hey its our home. That is one of the biggest things you should have when you have a baby. We can love our parents to death but when ther is a new baby they always butt in. "you shouldnt hold him like that" " he looks hungry" "he looks pale" "can I hold him" "support the head" By the end of the year I was ready to kill both my parents because I dealt with that nagging all day and they didnt even bother to learn the important stuff he had like meds and oxygen and feeding tube. Yeah, I couldn't deal with that. Maybe my mom because she'd help with EVERYTHING and she doesn't get all hyper like that. But Mike's parents..omg, they don't know how to be parents. They're not..the brightest bulbs..that's for sure.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2006 11:45 pm
LonesLover I'll admit, at first I thought "Omg you're all wrong". But then I sad down and read through all the comments left on this subject and I realized I was wrong. I'm glad you said this. That shows a lot of maturity to actually accept other peoples' advice, especially when it's all against your ideas. There are plenty of adults who are unwilling to alter their opinion, even when the opposition is valuable. Wotfan, you made me laugh with your parent comments. THat is so right on. Fortunately, my family doesn't do it, but DH's family is horrible... and stupid. "You shouldn't nurse because I know someone who did and it stretched her nipples out so bad she had to get surgery to fix them." "Put some whiskey on his gums." (for teething) "Blow cigarette smoke over a spoonful of formula and feed it to him." (for colic) Not only can advice be annoying, but sometimes it's just plain BAD!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2006 4:26 pm
Savina LonesLover I'll admit, at first I thought "Omg you're all wrong". But then I sad down and read through all the comments left on this subject and I realized I was wrong. I'm glad you said this. That shows a lot of maturity to actually accept other peoples' advice, especially when it's all against your ideas. There are plenty of adults who are unwilling to alter their opinion, even when the opposition is valuable. Wotfan, you made me laugh with your parent comments. THat is so right on. Fortunately, my family doesn't do it, but DH's family is horrible... and stupid. "You shouldn't nurse because I know someone who did and it stretched her nipples out so bad she had to get surgery to fix them." "Put some whiskey on his gums." (for teething) "Blow cigarette smoke over a spoonful of formula and feed it to him." (for colic) Not only can advice be annoying, but sometimes it's just plain BAD! lmfao Thankyou though. I just relized what I want may not be important as the life of a child.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sat Dec 23, 2006 10:34 pm
LonesLover Now we're finally begining to recover. Mike came up north with $2000 dollars and we left with $1000 and alot of debt to pay off. We owe my grandmother $60 for our internet and Mike's parents $500 or more for moving us. And my godmother $75 for gas when she moved Mike up north. We're not innocent or children. We figure if we lived through this, we'll manage to live through a few more years, if not more. Not to be rude, but no, you didn't. You ended up with debt. Honestly, until you have your debt paid off, I would recommend not having a baby and not getting any more animals. Honestly, if you had so much trouble supporting yourselves, you shouldn't have bought so many pets in the first place. LonesLover I know no one cares about dropping out of school but alot of people do. They keep asking me why and even in GD, they do, it's so annoying and frustrating. At first, I didn't mind. But after explaining it for a 5th time to one single person, I got sick of it. Even though I told that person I'd get my GED as soon as I can(which, here, you need to be 1 cool that person didn't believe me at all. So I get horribly fristrated about it. Yeah, I can understand your frustration. My husband and I met on the internet. Rare is the day that goes by that I don't get some smartass telling me that my marriage is inferior to his/her two week relationship just because we met online. People and their prejudices, oy! LonesLover I hope everything works out for you with your career choice! Alot of great people make it into those places and I'm sure you're bound to be one of them. Don't give up! You too! Honestly, vet work is amazing. It's so rewarding. Ever since my husband became a vet assistant, he's been walking on cloud nine. He can't get enough of the feeling that he's really making a difference in an animal's life. By the way, vet assistant is only a 6 week part time course. It can be hard to find work, though. At least, it was for us. So many students take the course just so that they can make some money while they are in school for other vet work. I would recommend going for this first and trying it out to see how you like it. If you enjoy the work, you might consider the next degree - a two year full time. That's for a Vet Technician. As a tech, you do minor surgery and have more responsibilities. Then, of course, there's being a vet. That's a lot more school, lol. LonesLover And what does having a house have to do with anything? Not everyone has a house when they have kids. I've never lived in a house, always an apartment. I don't think children are raised any better by living in a house. She said "get a home" not "get a house." That may well be an apartment. The point she was making, and I agree with her, is that you should be financially independent before you even think about having kids. That means living on your own with Mike, not with his parents. It just isn't fair on his parents to force another mouth to feed on them. And finally, with all the debt you are in, I wonder if it wouldn't be a good idea to cancel your computer game subscriptions until you've paid everything off. Why take on unecessary expenses when you are in the negatives?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
