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 Posted: Mon Sep 04, 2006 11:29 am
WellzY Well that is, as I was saying, a matter of debate among Feminist Scolars. Personally, untill the distinction was made to me as a young child, Actor for me meant both a male or a female. It's in the eye of the beholder. But English is inconsistent with this as well. For example, the word Doctor only has the one form (as far as I know anyway), whereas in German, there is a male and a female form. But the social wiring of people to, in most cases, associate doctor with a man in English, is due to, social wiring. Personally, I don't associate Doctor with male, but that might just be me. What I'm suggesting is doing new wiring so that the connotation is both male and female. I don't think that English is inconsistent, because it does give two words, you just choose not to use one of them. Quote: If, in Hebrew, you suddenly removed the gender forms over-night, there is still that social correlation of gender to career, and a number of other gendered words I'd imagine, that would be difficult for people to get around, but with time it would simply make no difference. I'm not suggesting removing the gender forms at all (that would be a disaster) I'm suggesting using the plural form. I am also not suggesting saying "alakazam! Everyone is politically correct!" I am suggesting that the government, and in particular, the Ministry of Education be non-discriminatory. Quote: Again in German, there is a female and a male form of vegetarian, but as far as I can tell, there is no social connection between gender and whether you're a vegetarian or not. You misunderstand me, then. I do not want to restructure Hebrew. I want the books to use the existing plural.
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Posted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 3:25 am
L eondra WellzY Well that is, as I was saying, a matter of debate among Feminist Scolars. Personally, untill the distinction was made to me as a young child, Actor for me meant both a male or a female. It's in the eye of the beholder. But English is inconsistent with this as well. For example, the word Doctor only has the one form (as far as I know anyway), whereas in German, there is a male and a female form. But the social wiring of people to, in most cases, associate doctor with a man in English, is due to, social wiring. Personally, I don't associate Doctor with male, but that might just be me. What I'm suggesting is doing new wiring so that the connotation is both male and female. I don't think that English is inconsistent, because it does give two words, you just choose not to use one of them. Quote: If, in Hebrew, you suddenly removed the gender forms over-night, there is still that social correlation of gender to career, and a number of other gendered words I'd imagine, that would be difficult for people to get around, but with time it would simply make no difference. I'm not suggesting removing the gender forms at all (that would be a disaster) I'm suggesting using the plural form. I am also not suggesting saying "alakazam! Everyone is politically correct!" I am suggesting that the government, and in particular, the Ministry of Education be non-discriminatory. Quote: Again in German, there is a female and a male form of vegetarian, but as far as I can tell, there is no social connection between gender and whether you're a vegetarian or not. You misunderstand me, then. I do not want to restructure Hebrew. I want the books to use the existing plural. No, I was saying that's what I would do. Missunderstandings ahoy!
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Posted: Sat Sep 09, 2006 1:34 pm
if it cheers you up any,it and he are the very same word in irish. biggrin
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 4:01 pm
Spanish Nerd I know how you feel. Romance languages are also gender specific, and the male form dominates. I just try to ignore it, though it angers me a tiny bit. I just think of it as a completely linguistic aspect, and nothing more than that. It's kind of odd that female teachers would not use the proper form. confused I also usually use the male form when I'm talking to a group of males and females because, well, that's grammatically correct. However, I've seen a lot of writers using the female form too. Our last president, Vicente Fox, also used the male and female form at the same time. The result, however, is awkward in my opinion: instead of saying "los mexicanos" (the Mexicans), he used to say "los mexicanos y las mexicanas" (the Mexican men and the Mexican women). confused
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Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 7:55 am
WellzY In English we have the words Actor and Actress, but I never use Actress; what's the point? There's no need for the distinction, it only further perpetuates a segregation of the sexes, small though it is. Same here. I do it with Swedish too; there's the words skådespelare (actor) and skådespelerska (actress), but I always use skådespelare.
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Posted: Thu Jun 21, 2007 11:39 pm
That's what you get when you learn languages where genders affect everything, Personally it doesn't bother me even in the slightest, and it wouldn't even if i was a woman (assuming that if I became a woman tomorrow I'd still keep my current rationality) because the issue is ultimately unimportant ya know. WHo cares if a group of 999,999,999,999,999,999,999,999 women and only one man must be addressed by 'ellos'? Not ME! mrgreen Because it's unimportant and so ultimately doesn't matter to me and shouldn't really shouldn't matter to anyone, really.
"don't let something so small bother you" I'm certain all your mamas have told you that at one point, and it's a darn good point i might add. LISTEN TO YOUR MAMA.
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Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2007 2:43 am
Mashed Computer WellzY In English we have the words Actor and Actress, but I never use Actress; what's the point? There's no need for the distinction, it only further perpetuates a segregation of the sexes, small though it is. Same here. I do it with Swedish too; there's the words skådespelare (actor) and skådespelerska (actress), but I always use skådespelare. in germany many offical places would write SchauspielerINEN or for students StudentINen. even though i don't like that the language is so male dominated this still anoyes me a lot and i would much rather live just with the male from, but knowing no hebrew i don't know if fixing the problem you describe would end up in such horrid words. as far as i understood it is not the usage of noons but of verbs that is bothering you?
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Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 12:22 pm
Angeyja as far as i understood it is not the usage of noons but of verbs that is bothering you? Mainly, yes. Also when female teachers refer to themselves in the male form. Kind of annoying, but that's more to do with the culture.
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 2:45 am
Teeheeheee tis sucks to communicate in a sexist language. My native tounge makes little jurisdiction between sexes. Our word for teacher "Guro" a corruption of the indian "Guru" can be applied to any gender and our person identification noun "siya" is gender neutral.
xp But i still think Romance Languages Rock!
Is hebrew a romance language?
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Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:54 am
RenegadeBanana Is hebrew a romance language? No, it is a Semitic language.
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Posted: Sun Oct 28, 2007 12:38 pm
I was born in Israel, and lived there until I was 11, so I know what you're talking about.
But to be honest- I think that the endings of some words are not meant to offend women, it's just how the language was made- they won't be able to write every word in both male and female form. And from what I remember, women were treated pretty well in Israel compared to other areas of the world- they got the same education as men, and had the same jobs.
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