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In Medias Res II

PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2009 9:14 am


Yes, I am home, safely. Thanks for your concern you guys.
I'm going to sound like a horrible person, a bigot, a racist, worse, but I do NOT like Islamic culture. Egyptian Arabs were horrible. I have never felt more uncomfortable. I didn't fear for my safety but you can feel their eyes on you and as a woman I am definitely treated as second class, I would argue third class because I am not a Muslim woman. The night Israel struck Gaza was an interesting one. Three of us were standing on a beach in Nuweiba looking at oil tankers in the Red Sea, and there were lights visible across the sea in Saudi Arabia and there were a lot of planes, I had a feeling something was going awry. The next morning we left for Jordan (MUCH MUCH MUCH nicer people, cleaner people, more respectable, I'd go back).

We were dropped off at the port and it was horrifying. Excuse my language but it was really a s**t hole. Literally. Walking past the Egyptian men was awful, they'd make comments and ask me to sleep with them. We were stuck there, in filth, for hours and then they put us westerners on a bus and we were not allowed to look out of the window and the dashboard was painted over so the driver only could see the road. We were dropped off in the middle of nowhere and went through interrogation on top of them checking our passports so that there was no sign of us being Israeli or having been in Israel (even though Egypt has a peace treaty).

The ferry was as filthy as the holding place. People washing their feet in the bathrooms, sleeping on the filthy floor, Palestinian PLO scarves EVERYWHERE. I got stared at more than the other women with me, and I think it's for my dark curly hair, everyone else was noticeably American.

Jordan was much nicer to us. Lovely people for the most part. After the last call to prayer on Friday there was a Palestinian demonstration that was interesting to watch. I got out of there the next morning.

Part of me wishes I just went to Israel. I'm glad I took off my chai, even though I was reluctant. I had a Christian Arab ask me if I was a Jew, and he was extremely hostile while he said it, I don't know what even provoked that. I told him I was Catholic. it was nuts.

In anycase.

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Sigh* Those are the mountains of Israel behind me.
PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2009 9:35 am


Bruchim habaeem on your return. mrgreen

I don't believe we 'met' on these forums before, but it is good to know you're safe and it's good to have you back.

Lumanny the Space Jew

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In Medias Res II

PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2009 9:38 am


Toda!

No I don't think we have met, but it is nice to meet you =]. I'm Amanda!
PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2009 9:45 am


It's good to meet you, too.

Your adventures sound most interesting! Continue to memoir it while the details are fresh?

Lumanny the Space Jew

Blessed Poster


SIammy

PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2009 10:19 am


:0 Shoulda come visit me in Israel!

That's... interesting. I hadn't thought Egypt was so bad. My impression was that it was a fairly modern country, with stuff such as discrimination towards women much less noticeable.

And yeah, even though the surrounding countries have peace treaties with Israel, they don't like it very much. At least Jordan was all right... (They send me a text message whenever I drive by the border and connect to their cell towers)

Well, at least you got a taste of a different culture, no matter how it was. Good to have you back!
PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2009 10:31 am


I plan on visiting Israel in the summer! I think that the experience in Egypt would be different for men, and definitely different for people who are already in the Middle East. I had one man actually grab me. I think the thing I said most was LA SHUKRAN!

regardless, I love the ME. Jordan is definitely okay with me. It's clean and I didn't get food poisoning there XD

Oh man, I was gonna nap..

Mind you, I also didn't have heat or hot water for over a week..

In Medias Res II


SIammy

PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2009 10:45 am


The first result on Google for "La shukran" was a site telling about how it's the most important phrase to know when visiting Egypt, lol.

To be honest, I can't say if I love the Middle East, because I've only been to Israel. I like Israel very much, though. Just not to live, at least while I'm in school.

No heat or hot water? gonk That's terrible. Did you go with a tour group or by yourself?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2009 11:00 am


I like the picture of the Supercop Ninja. =D

Sorry you didn't have a super fun time over there.

But at least you got to experience the plight.

LordNeuf
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Behatzlacha-S

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2009 3:30 pm


SlamuelBTP

And yeah, even though the surrounding countries have peace treaties with Israel, they don't like it very much. At least Jordan was all right... (They send me a text message whenever I drive by the border and connect to their cell towers)


I was coming out of David's Tomb in the Old City, I turned my mobile on and it said:
"Jawal! Smell the jasmine and taste the olives! Jawal welcomes you to Palestine! For customer support, text HELP to 2345."

I'm sorry you didn't enjoy Egypt. I'll be telling my Egyptian friend about that one. It does remind me of this one time, in Jericho... *drifts off to post on other thread...*
I have one of those scarfs! Don't ask, it was a present from a goyim friend. And those mountains in the background! I've walked on them this time I visited the Dead sea.
PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2009 3:47 pm


Nono, don't get me wrong, I actually enjoyed Egypt and I am glad I went. It was a great experience but parts of it were more of an adventure and intense insanity.

I almost bought one of the scarves but then realised I would never. EVER. wear it.

I'll be going to Israel in the spring, for sure. Oh man, the Dead Sea was BRUTAL on the Arab side. The beach was filthy and the shower... hah.. ha ha... ICE COLD water. I was less than impressed, they really need to learn what hot water is.

In Medias Res II


Divash
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 6:39 am


To be fair, Media, you were entering their home territory, and you were looking very much like something they recognized. Your body was outlined by your clothing so that they could see your figure, and your hair was uncovered. Of COURSE men reacted to you as if you were (G*D forbid) a prostitute; that's how they look there. The next time you visit the Middle East, wear something that conceals your figure and your hair, and people will behave very respectfully. That is, they will pretend not to notice you, allowing you privacy from their eyes, while thinking "What a modest young woman, how respectful, how dignified -- I wonder if she would be a suitable match for my son."

In the US I've noticed the exact same thing, only here, the Jewish and Muslim neighborhood wouldn't see me at all when I was in my T-shirts and jeans, but suddenly were welcoming the moment I put on a skirt, a longer shirt, and a scarf. In fact, there are times when I've made friends specifically because I was dressed this way, and someone came up to me with a smile and said, "Are you Jewish? I thought so!" or "Are you Muslim? Ahh, yes, we do have similar customs, don't we?"

In the Western world, "nakedness" is the norm -- that is, bare legs and arms, bare midriff, low-cut tops for women or shirtlessness for men, body-clinging clothing, flowing hair for women, bare-shaven faces for men. Western Jews and Muslims know how to act with "naked" people... by not interacting. But in the Eastern world, it's not nearly as common, and the only people who would reveal their bodies are those who would willingly share their bodies; it's an intentional advertisement. You can't blame them for misunderstanding your intention.

As for people washing feet in the bathroom, well, they had to, didn't they? A Muslim washes face, hands, head, and feet before praying. They also perform wudu after certain other bodily functions and activities -- breaking wind, eliminating urine or feces, having sexual activity. After other activities (including but not limited to menstruation and preparing a body for burial), one performs a more thorough cleaning called ghusl. A public bathroom is the correct place to be washing feet, when one is away from one's home or mosque when prayer time rolls around.

Jews wash our hands three times before praying and before eating bread, and at certain other times. In fact, in the times of a standing Holy Temple, we also wash our faces, heads, ears, arms, and feet as well, almost exactly as Muslims do when performing wudu.

Their ghusl is an echo of our mikvah preparations. A Jew undergoes preparation and mikvah immersion either as the final step of conversion to Judaism, or as a preparation to marriage, or as a monthly event separating the time of menstrual separation and the time of conjugal permissiveness (being permitted to touch your husband again now that you are no longer in a state of nidah, menstrual separation). We also give a dead body a purification and a mikvah immersion, and there are mikvah immersions at other key points in life, too. We have this in common.

But it's a good thing you said "la shukram" so much. "Shukr" is "gratitude" in Arabic, so expressing gratitude with "la shukram" probably saved you a lot of problems.
PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:09 am


Divash
To be fair, Media, you were entering their home territory, and you were looking very much like something they recognized. Your body was outlined by your clothing so that they could see your figure, and your hair was uncovered. Of COURSE men reacted to you as if you were (G*D forbid) a prostitute; that's how they look there. The next time you visit the Middle East, wear something that conceals your figure and your hair, and people will behave very respectfully. That is, they will pretend not to notice you, allowing you privacy from their eyes, while thinking "What a modest young woman, how respectful, how dignified -- I wonder if she would be a suitable match for my son."


You've never been around a flock of tourists that stand out.

While living in Indiana, there was an anime convention in Fort Wayne. During the convention a horde of Asians decided to take a sight seeing tour of city.

You would of thought aliens had landed. People in strange clothes, talking in a strange language. I'm surprised they didn't make the local news.

Same thing happened to me, being a westerner in a group of westerners while visiting Vietnam. The looks were more... "My word... he's a GIANT! what is this white giant doing in our tiny little village?"

I think it has to do more with culture shock in the tourist industry rather than the "is this woman proper or is she a filthy whore?"

LordNeuf
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darkphoenix1247
Vice Captain

PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:13 am


I'm glad you made it back safely, but I'm sorry you had to put up with all of that!
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