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 Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2008 10:11 pm
Sir BlackHeart -Sunset Wahine- Sir BlackHeart -Sunset Wahine- Sir BlackHeart -Sunset Wahine- In that term I meant you are either of the world or of God. That makes more sense, however you still did not answer the last part of my question? Well, yeah. If you don't have Jesus, you can't make it toHeaven. It's about Jesus' love. It's not about doing good or what... Okay a couple more questions So then it could be said that once you accept Jesus there's a point where you could loose him or really choose not to follow him to the latter end and wined up in the Inferno correct? Also what do you mean it's about Jesus' love care to elaborate more on this? Through God's love comes the fulfillment of salvation. Hell is just a consequence of our sins. We choose to live in sin and rebel against God's promises for our lives. In hell, we are forever seperated from God our Savior. And yes, it is possible to lose your salvation and relationship with God by going farther and farther away from Him. The more we sin, the colder and harder our hearts get. Can you support this with concrete scriptures...then again I've also seen evidence that say otherwise I guess you really don't know till you reach the end of the race huh? Evidence of losing salvation is what you ask? You know you're not saved when there is no more conviction and when Evertime God says something in His word or in the Holy spirit, you say no. Only God knows when you crossed the line.
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Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2008 10:15 pm
-Sunset Wahine- Sir BlackHeart -Sunset Wahine- Sir BlackHeart -Sunset Wahine- Well, yeah. If you don't have Jesus, you can't make it toHeaven. It's about Jesus' love. It's not about doing good or what... Okay a couple more questions So then it could be said that once you accept Jesus there's a point where you could loose him or really choose not to follow him to the latter end and wined up in the Inferno correct? Also what do you mean it's about Jesus' love care to elaborate more on this? Through God's love comes the fulfillment of salvation. Hell is just a consequence of our sins. We choose to live in sin and rebel against God's promises for our lives. In hell, we are forever seperated from God our Savior. And yes, it is possible to lose your salvation and relationship with God by going farther and farther away from Him. The more we sin, the colder and harder our hearts get. Can you support this with concrete scriptures...then again I've also seen evidence that say otherwise I guess you really don't know till you reach the end of the race huh? Evidence of losing salvation is what you ask? You know you're not saved when there is no more conviction and when Evertime God says something in His word or in the Holy spirit, you say no. Only God knows when you crossed the line. Hmm good point, good point, precise and direct too, oh I made an edit to my post go look at it if you don't mind.
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Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 11:31 am
Sir BlackHeart -Sunset Wahine- Sir BlackHeart -Sunset Wahine- Wait. You're saying God gives some sort of conditional love? It's not that God won't be your friend anymore if you don't obey Him. You can always call on him for help and guidance. He cares for you. First of all, He loves you, and He created you. Secondly, if you are a child of God, it is your decision to ask forgiveness from God if you want to get CLOSER to Him. Thirdly, before you obey God's commands, believe that He loves you so much that He set those standards for you to protect you. Quote: Not really some of those "standards seem kind irrelevant", and in the Bible it sometimes seems as though GOD is giving you an ultimatum more than asking you to listein to him. Friends ask and even parents ask sometimes too but it's seems he gives you no choice at all. Just remember: Love God with all your heart. Grow closer to Him and get intimate with the Holy Spirit through prayer. Then live a lifestyle that is pleasing to Him. Quote: So basically if I don't live a lifestlye according to how he wants he basically doesn't love me or dear I say it not like me at all. And do you truly know the Gospel? God has always loves us. We were meant to be together with God, but sin seperated God and man. Sin has hardened the hearts of man towards God's love. So to solve this, God sent His only Son Jesus Christ to die for our sins out of His mercy, so that we may be forgiven and draw closer to Him. It is then a matter for you to believe and accept God into your heart or to turn your back on His love. Quote: Well GOD could have intervened and stopped our ancient parents from eating the fruit which condemned man from that moment on it's not my fault I was born sinful, and yes I could repenting of my sins, but sin is hardwired into humans and it's not exactly easy to get rid of, in fact it's much more like HIV. When you take the necessary medicine for it you stave off the disease but you don't get ride of it it's still there, but just not as bad. Also another thing is not everyone in the world will be saved for some reason or another, and some of these people aren't necessarily evil, but they do have sin and that automatically from what I understand qualifies them for hell, so Jesus's sacrifice does not save everybody and I think....I think that there's more to salvation than the simple belief of having faith in Jesus...I think. And if you struggle to live Holy, God will help you pick up your cross daily. Quote: Yeah thats another thing lifes hard enough without the constant struggle against your unholy nature interferring with your daily affairs. =) True. It is hard. If we try to live Holy on our own will, it is impossible. We can't live the Christian life by our own emotions. It is by a relationship. Whenever I get confronted by temptation, I immediately pray and ask God for His will to be mine for he know's what's best for me. I keep the faith. the Holy Spirit will help you. This morning I read Luke 4: The Temptation of Jesus "1Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan and was led by the Spirit in the desert, 2where for forty days he was tempted by the devil. He ate nothing during those days, and at the end of them he was hungry. 3The devil said to him, "If you are the Son of God, tell this stone to become bread." 4Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Man does not live on bread alone.'[a]" 5The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. 6And he said to him, "I will give you all their authority and splendor, for it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. 7So if you worship me, it will all be yours." 8Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Worship the Lord your God and serve him only.' "
9The devil led him to Jerusalem and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. "If you are the Son of God," he said, "throw yourself down from here. 10For it is written:
" 'He will command his angels concerning you
to guard you carefully;
11they will lift you up in their hands,
so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.'"
12Jesus answered, "It says: 'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.'"
13When the devil had finished all this tempting, he left him until an opportune time."
Notice the passage said Jesus was filled with the Holy Spirit. Ask God for the Holy spirit. Only through long intimate prayer, you can understand God more. And through that, obey Him. And in the long run, the feeling of this world and its temptation of sin will be a disgust to you. You will soon have the mind of Christ. Get to know God. Once you try to reach that goal, you'll experience the Greatest Love. But I did try to reach the ultimate goal, it hurt like hell fire, although probably nothing compared to it. It was painful, and I really don't know if this so called love was worth it, especially knowing all this could have been forgone if he just took a few measures against the garden incident, but then again I don't think he wanted to he let it happen. And no I rather don't want t obey I'd rather do my own thing and still be loved if thats at all possible for him to do. I will say this I do think he has some good moral precepts and I would like to be better at practicing them, just not feel like everytime I fail I have go ask for forgiveness for something I don't have total control over, again I'm sinful because I was born with sin not because I choose to be even the Bible confirms it. Also about your Luke thing, I have to say this Jesus was GOD is human form so thats not nessecarily encouraging to see the most powerful being in the universe-possibly take the form of man and completely stomp temptation and the devil in a single swooping, and also although he was made to be sin specifically a sin sacrifice for us I don't think he was born with sin. I think that even with the Holy Spirit it is hard, because temptation always comes back sooner or later. Everything you've just said....I'm sorry, is Pride. "I want to do my own thing, and still be loved" The bible talks about loving God in a way that you cannot be lukewarm with Him, or complacent. You cannot claim to love God AND love the world. For that right there is adultery with God. eventually the bride, or the church will be caught up in the air to be with Jesus forever. God wanted those that would willingly be with Him, that chose Him and not the world or their flesh. Even Jesus in the garden said to His Father "Not my will, but YOUR will" Even the flesh of Jesus wanted to live, but the spirit that dwelled in Him knew the will of God comes first. If we are supposed to be Christ-like, than taking our will over God's, is sin. Its pride, and God will only recieve a broken and humbled heart, that is not hardened so He can work with it and sculpt us to his will. You need to read the bible a little more because no where in the Word does it say that we should follow God's will only when it coincides with our will. God forbid.
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Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 11:04 pm
Ireland_Gunner Sir BlackHeart -Sunset Wahine- Sir BlackHeart -Sunset Wahine- Wait. You're saying God gives some sort of conditional love? It's not that God won't be your friend anymore if you don't obey Him. You can always call on him for help and guidance. He cares for you. First of all, He loves you, and He created you. Secondly, if you are a child of God, it is your decision to ask forgiveness from God if you want to get CLOSER to Him. Thirdly, before you obey God's commands, believe that He loves you so much that He set those standards for you to protect you. Just remember: Love God with all your heart. Grow closer to Him and get intimate with the Holy Spirit through prayer. Then live a lifestyle that is pleasing to Him. And do you truly know the Gospel? God has always loves us. We were meant to be together with God, but sin seperated God and man. Sin has hardened the hearts of man towards God's love. So to solve this, God sent His only Son Jesus Christ to die for our sins out of His mercy, so that we may be forgiven and draw closer to Him. It is then a matter for you to believe and accept God into your heart or to turn your back on His love. And if you struggle to live Holy, God will help you pick up your cross daily. =) True. It is hard. If we try to live Holy on our own will, it is impossible. We can't live the Christian life by our own emotions. It is by a relationship. Whenever I get confronted by temptation, I immediately pray and ask God for His will to be mine for he know's what's best for me. I keep the faith. the Holy Spirit will help you. This morning I read Luke 4: The Temptation of Jesus "1Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan and was led by the Spirit in the desert, 2where for forty days he was tempted by the devil. He ate nothing during those days, and at the end of them he was hungry. 3The devil said to him, "If you are the Son of God, tell this stone to become bread." 4Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Man does not live on bread alone.'[a]" 5The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. 6And he said to him, "I will give you all their authority and splendor, for it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. 7So if you worship me, it will all be yours." 8Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Worship the Lord your God and serve him only.' "
9The devil led him to Jerusalem and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. "If you are the Son of God," he said, "throw yourself down from here. 10For it is written:
" 'He will command his angels concerning you
to guard you carefully;
11they will lift you up in their hands,
so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.'"
12Jesus answered, "It says: 'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.'"
13When the devil had finished all this tempting, he left him until an opportune time."
Notice the passage said Jesus was filled with the Holy Spirit. Ask God for the Holy spirit. Only through long intimate prayer, you can understand God more. And through that, obey Him. And in the long run, the feeling of this world and its temptation of sin will be a disgust to you. You will soon have the mind of Christ. Get to know God. Once you try to reach that goal, you'll experience the Greatest Love. But I did try to reach the ultimate goal, it hurt like hell fire, although probably nothing compared to it. It was painful, and I really don't know if this so called love was worth it, especially knowing all this could have been forgone if he just took a few measures against the garden incident, but then again I don't think he wanted to he let it happen. And no I rather don't want t obey I'd rather do my own thing and still be loved if thats at all possible for him to do. I will say this I do think he has some good moral precepts and I would like to be better at practicing them, just not feel like everytime I fail I have go ask for forgiveness for something I don't have total control over, again I'm sinful because I was born with sin not because I choose to be even the Bible confirms it. Also about your Luke thing, I have to say this Jesus was GOD is human form so thats not nessecarily encouraging to see the most powerful being in the universe-possibly take the form of man and completely stomp temptation and the devil in a single swooping, and also although he was made to be sin specifically a sin sacrifice for us I don't think he was born with sin. I think that even with the Holy Spirit it is hard, because temptation always comes back sooner or later. Everything you've just said....I'm sorry, is Pride. Quote: No, not pride I am a free willed individual why should I have to bend to another beings wimps to be loved especially when I did not chose to be created by that being, and did not set up the circumstances in which I have to abide by this beings rules(which by the way his rules go against my natural nature so I have to fight to abide by them.) or I'll be thrown into hell fire. No not pride, but merely a realization that this is kinda wacked "I want to do my own thing, and still be loved" The bible talks about loving God in a way that you cannot be lukewarm with Him, or complacent. Quote: Let me ask you this is it too much to ask GOD to love me for who I am? well actually it is seeing as though he doesn't like sin and I'm sinful, although I'm not happy with some of the things I do. You cannot claim to love God AND love the world. For that right there is adultery with God. Quote: I don't believe I claimed to love GOD or the world, where did I say that in my post? eventually the bride, or the church will be caught up in the air to be with Jesus forever. God wanted those that would willingly be with Him, that chose Him and not the world or their flesh. Even Jesus in the garden said to His Father "Not my will, but YOUR will" Even the flesh of Jesus wanted to live, but the spirit that dwelled in Him knew the will of God comes first. Quote: hold it right there lets talk about the will of GOD, it seems to me that it was the will of GOD in the first place to have man fall, by not interfering in the garden of eden, then have the children of man struggle against their own dark nature to do the right thing and love him although that is extremely hard to do, because again we were curse with a dark nature. And if that isn't enough some people will probably go to hell because some did not know GOD or Jesus, or (I believe) because they didn't make the spiritual cut and finish the race(described by Paul in the Bible) which I believe is to endure which is also very hard for us.It seems to me that GOD is making us suffer to love him, and I don't think that should be so, especially seeing as though he's the one with all the power, not that I'm saying that his death on the cross wasn't hard because that must have been emotionally and physically racking, probably spiritually too; However he's GOD It's not like he did some high risked venture where he didn't know he would succeed he did know he would succeed, because supposedly he's omniscient(all knowing). If we are supposed to be Christ-like, than taking our will over God's, is sin. Quote: And what does Christ like mean, if it means to help/serve other people and try to spread salvation through the word then, and even sometimes sacrifice yourself for others than yeah thats something I would love to do more of. But if it's to Bow down to GOD's whimps and completely agree on everything he says I can't do that, people have their own thoughts and opinions and I can't subject mine to GOD's maybe I could still do some things that he says but I'd never really agree with them. Its pride, and God will only receive a broken and humbled heart, that is not hardened so He can work with it and sculpt us to his will. Quote: So basically GOD wants to subject gate me a free willed being to his will, that mildly seems like oppression and if he wanted robots to begin with why didn't he just create them. You need to read the bible a little more because no where in the Word does it say that we should follow God's will only when it coincides with our will. God forbid. Quote: Again where have I said we or I should follow GOD's will only when it coincides with my own? unless you are trying to make some other point?
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 8:13 pm
Sir BlackHeart Ireland_Gunner Sir BlackHeart -Sunset Wahine- True. It is hard. If we try to live Holy on our own will, it is impossible. We can't live the Christian life by our own emotions. It is by a relationship. Whenever I get confronted by temptation, I immediately pray and ask God for His will to be mine for he know's what's best for me. I keep the faith. the Holy Spirit will help you. This morning I read Luke 4: The Temptation of Jesus "1Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan and was led by the Spirit in the desert, 2where for forty days he was tempted by the devil. He ate nothing during those days, and at the end of them he was hungry. 3The devil said to him, "If you are the Son of God, tell this stone to become bread." 4Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Man does not live on bread alone.'[a]" 5The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. 6And he said to him, "I will give you all their authority and splendor, for it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. 7So if you worship me, it will all be yours." 8Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Worship the Lord your God and serve him only.' "
9The devil led him to Jerusalem and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. "If you are the Son of God," he said, "throw yourself down from here. 10For it is written:
" 'He will command his angels concerning you
to guard you carefully;
11they will lift you up in their hands,
so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.'"
12Jesus answered, "It says: 'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.'"
13When the devil had finished all this tempting, he left him until an opportune time."
Notice the passage said Jesus was filled with the Holy Spirit. Ask God for the Holy spirit. Only through long intimate prayer, you can understand God more. And through that, obey Him. And in the long run, the feeling of this world and its temptation of sin will be a disgust to you. You will soon have the mind of Christ. Get to know God. Once you try to reach that goal, you'll experience the Greatest Love. But I did try to reach the ultimate goal, it hurt like hell fire, although probably nothing compared to it. It was painful, and I really don't know if this so called love was worth it, especially knowing all this could have been forgone if he just took a few measures against the garden incident, but then again I don't think he wanted to he let it happen. And no I rather don't want t obey I'd rather do my own thing and still be loved if thats at all possible for him to do. I will say this I do think he has some good moral precepts and I would like to be better at practicing them, just not feel like everytime I fail I have go ask for forgiveness for something I don't have total control over, again I'm sinful because I was born with sin not because I choose to be even the Bible confirms it. Also about your Luke thing, I have to say this Jesus was GOD is human form so thats not nessecarily encouraging to see the most powerful being in the universe-possibly take the form of man and completely stomp temptation and the devil in a single swooping, and also although he was made to be sin specifically a sin sacrifice for us I don't think he was born with sin. I think that even with the Holy Spirit it is hard, because temptation always comes back sooner or later. Everything you've just said....I'm sorry, is Pride. Quote: No, not pride I am a free willed individual why should I have to bend to another beings wimps to be loved especially when I did not chose to be created by that being, and did not set up the circumstances in which I have to abide by this beings rules(which by the way his rules go against my natural nature so I have to fight to abide by them.) or I'll be thrown into hell fire. No not pride, but merely a realization that this is kinda wacked "I want to do my own thing, and still be loved" The bible talks about loving God in a way that you cannot be lukewarm with Him, or complacent. Quote: Let me ask you this is it too much to ask GOD to love me for who I am? well actually it is seeing as though he doesn't like sin and I'm sinful, although I'm not happy with some of the things I do. You cannot claim to love God AND love the world. For that right there is adultery with God. Quote: I don't believe I claimed to love GOD or the world, where did I say that in my post? eventually the bride, or the church will be caught up in the air to be with Jesus forever. God wanted those that would willingly be with Him, that chose Him and not the world or their flesh. Even Jesus in the garden said to His Father "Not my will, but YOUR will" Even the flesh of Jesus wanted to live, but the spirit that dwelled in Him knew the will of God comes first. Quote: hold it right there lets talk about the will of GOD, it seems to me that it was the will of GOD in the first place to have man fall, by not interfering in the garden of eden, then have the children of man struggle against their own dark nature to do the right thing and love him although that is extremely hard to do, because again we were curse with a dark nature. And if that isn't enough some people will probably go to hell because some did not know GOD or Jesus, or (I believe) because they didn't make the spiritual cut and finish the race(described by Paul in the Bible) which I believe is to endure which is also very hard for us.It seems to me that GOD is making us suffer to love him, and I don't think that should be so, especially seeing as though he's the one with all the power, not that I'm saying that his death on the cross wasn't hard because that must have been emotionally and physically racking, probably spiritually too; However he's GOD It's not like he did some high risked venture where he didn't know he would succeed he did know he would succeed, because supposedly he's omniscient(all knowing). If we are supposed to be Christ-like, than taking our will over God's, is sin. Quote: And what does Christ like mean, if it means to help/serve other people and try to spread salvation through the word then, and even sometimes sacrifice yourself for others than yeah thats something I would love to do more of. But if it's to Bow down to GOD's whimps and completely agree on everything he says I can't do that, people have their own thoughts and opinions and I can't subject mine to GOD's maybe I could still do some things that he says but I'd never really agree with them. Its pride, and God will only receive a broken and humbled heart, that is not hardened so He can work with it and sculpt us to his will. Quote: So basically GOD wants to subject gate me a free willed being to his will, that mildly seems like oppression and if he wanted robots to begin with why didn't he just create them. You need to read the bible a little more because no where in the Word does it say that we should follow God's will only when it coincides with our will. God forbid. Quote: Again where have I said we or I should follow GOD's will only when it coincides with my own? unless you are trying to make some other point? "And no I rather don't want t obey I'd rather do my own thing and still be loved if thats at all possible for him to do." What does that sound like to you? That sounds to me like you don't want to follow God's will but you want it to be okay. How can you justify that? OF course God loves you. "humbling" yourself is submitting to the will of God. And saying it was too hard is telling God that He is a liar when He said he will not give you more than you can handle. You said you didn't ask to be created. No one did. But Mary didn't ask to be chosen to carry the tabernacle God would dwell in on Earth. Many people in the Bible did not ask to be chosen for something. But we were created to praise God. It is your choice to follow his will or rebel and say "I don't want to do this anymore" you didn't have to directly say "I choose the world over God's will" But saying that you don't want to follow God's will is rejecting God. That's what lukewarm is when you are not on fire for Him, meaning you do his will. You are not the only one that struggles with this. It is not easy, and the devil will fight you whether or not you live for God. That's why its hard. the bible says that blessed is the man that falls and gets up, no matter how many times it happens, and he will never give you more than you can handle. What it seems like to me is that you are using your flesh as an excuse like you owe it something. You were not created to please your flesh, but to please God. Pride is what tells our minds that that's not fair. "I am a free-willed individual" yes you are, and it is your choice to follow God's will or not. We did not ask to be born to the parents we have. But saying "I didn't ask for this" does not change the fact that it is. You can twist it all you want and in the end that is what you can tell God when you stand in front of Him. He will always love you, and it grieves the spirit when His child rejects him. Your walk with God is your own. But I can tell you that there is always someone who struggled harder than you somewhere in this world, but they chose to serve God. Our struggles make us stronger and become a testimony to help another with the same. I will tell you one thing, you'd be surprised the vices I struggled with, but it was because I strove and fought and clawed my way out of that pit with God on my mind. It's hard, but to me, its worth it. Because I know that the more He forgives me, the more I love Him and the more He can help me.
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Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 9:57 am
Ireland_Gunner Sir BlackHeart Ireland_Gunner Sir BlackHeart -Sunset Wahine- True. It is hard. If we try to live Holy on our own will, it is impossible. We can't live the Christian life by our own emotions. It is by a relationship. Whenever I get confronted by temptation, I immediately pray and ask God for His will to be mine for he know's what's best for me. I keep the faith. the Holy Spirit will help you. This morning I read Luke 4: The Temptation of Jesus "1Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan and was led by the Spirit in the desert, 2where for forty days he was tempted by the devil. He ate nothing during those days, and at the end of them he was hungry. 3The devil said to him, "If you are the Son of God, tell this stone to become bread." 4Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Man does not live on bread alone.'[a]" 5The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. 6And he said to him, "I will give you all their authority and splendor, for it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. 7So if you worship me, it will all be yours." 8Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Worship the Lord your God and serve him only.' "
9The devil led him to Jerusalem and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. "If you are the Son of God," he said, "throw yourself down from here. 10For it is written:
" 'He will command his angels concerning you
to guard you carefully;
11they will lift you up in their hands,
so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.'"
12Jesus answered, "It says: 'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.'"
13When the devil had finished all this tempting, he left him until an opportune time."
Notice the passage said Jesus was filled with the Holy Spirit. Ask God for the Holy spirit. Only through long intimate prayer, you can understand God more. And through that, obey Him. And in the long run, the feeling of this world and its temptation of sin will be a disgust to you. You will soon have the mind of Christ. Get to know God. Once you try to reach that goal, you'll experience the Greatest Love. But I did try to reach the ultimate goal, it hurt like hell fire, although probably nothing compared to it. It was painful, and I really don't know if this so called love was worth it, especially knowing all this could have been forgone if he just took a few measures against the garden incident, but then again I don't think he wanted to he let it happen. And no I rather don't want t obey I'd rather do my own thing and still be loved if thats at all possible for him to do. I will say this I do think he has some good moral precepts and I would like to be better at practicing them, just not feel like everytime I fail I have go ask for forgiveness for something I don't have total control over, again I'm sinful because I was born with sin not because I choose to be even the Bible confirms it. Also about your Luke thing, I have to say this Jesus was GOD is human form so thats not nessecarily encouraging to see the most powerful being in the universe-possibly take the form of man and completely stomp temptation and the devil in a single swooping, and also although he was made to be sin specifically a sin sacrifice for us I don't think he was born with sin. I think that even with the Holy Spirit it is hard, because temptation always comes back sooner or later. Everything you've just said....I'm sorry, is Pride. Quote: No, not pride I am a free willed individual why should I have to bend to another beings wimps to be loved especially when I did not chose to be created by that being, and did not set up the circumstances in which I have to abide by this beings rules(which by the way his rules go against my natural nature so I have to fight to abide by them.) or I'll be thrown into hell fire. No not pride, but merely a realization that this is kinda wacked "I want to do my own thing, and still be loved" The bible talks about loving God in a way that you cannot be lukewarm with Him, or complacent. Quote: Let me ask you this is it too much to ask GOD to love me for who I am? well actually it is seeing as though he doesn't like sin and I'm sinful, although I'm not happy with some of the things I do. You cannot claim to love God AND love the world. For that right there is adultery with God. Quote: I don't believe I claimed to love GOD or the world, where did I say that in my post? eventually the bride, or the church will be caught up in the air to be with Jesus forever. God wanted those that would willingly be with Him, that chose Him and not the world or their flesh. Even Jesus in the garden said to His Father "Not my will, but YOUR will" Even the flesh of Jesus wanted to live, but the spirit that dwelled in Him knew the will of God comes first. Quote: hold it right there lets talk about the will of GOD, it seems to me that it was the will of GOD in the first place to have man fall, by not interfering in the garden of eden, then have the children of man struggle against their own dark nature to do the right thing and love him although that is extremely hard to do, because again we were curse with a dark nature. And if that isn't enough some people will probably go to hell because some did not know GOD or Jesus, or (I believe) because they didn't make the spiritual cut and finish the race(described by Paul in the Bible) which I believe is to endure which is also very hard for us.It seems to me that GOD is making us suffer to love him, and I don't think that should be so, especially seeing as though he's the one with all the power, not that I'm saying that his death on the cross wasn't hard because that must have been emotionally and physically racking, probably spiritually too; However he's GOD It's not like he did some high risked venture where he didn't know he would succeed he did know he would succeed, because supposedly he's omniscient(all knowing). If we are supposed to be Christ-like, than taking our will over God's, is sin. Quote: And what does Christ like mean, if it means to help/serve other people and try to spread salvation through the word then, and even sometimes sacrifice yourself for others than yeah thats something I would love to do more of. But if it's to Bow down to GOD's whimps and completely agree on everything he says I can't do that, people have their own thoughts and opinions and I can't subject mine to GOD's maybe I could still do some things that he says but I'd never really agree with them. Its pride, and God will only receive a broken and humbled heart, that is not hardened so He can work with it and sculpt us to his will. Quote: So basically GOD wants to subject gate me a free willed being to his will, that mildly seems like oppression and if he wanted robots to begin with why didn't he just create them. You need to read the bible a little more because no where in the Word does it say that we should follow God's will only when it coincides with our will. God forbid. Quote: Again where have I said we or I should follow GOD's will only when it coincides with my own? unless you are trying to make some other point? "And no I rather don't want t obey I'd rather do my own thing and still be loved if thats at all possible for him to do." Quote: MMhh it's more of I don't agree with certain things he has done, and will do, by all means he can do whatever he wants it doesn't mean that I like it or anyone else or even agree with it. What does that sound like to you? That sounds to me like you don't want to follow God's will but you want it to be okay. How can you justify that? OF course God loves you. "humbling" yourself is submitting to the will of God. And saying it was too hard is telling God that He is a liar when He said he will not give you more than you can handle. Quote: well maybe it was more than I can handle you ever thought of that perhaps you should go read certain journal entries I have about how my conscience at times caused me to have anxiety attacks. Are you sure the Bible says he will not give you more than you can handle? Find the verse for me if you don't mind, also humbling yourself doesn't necessarily make you a servant or a push over which is what it seems to me like what he wants. You said you didn't ask to be created. No one did. But Mary didn't ask to be chosen to carry the tabernacle God would dwell in on Earth. Many people in the Bible did not ask to be chosen for something. But we were created to praise God. It is your choice to follow his will or rebel and say "I don't want to do this anymore" you didn't have to directly say "I choose the world over God's will" But saying that you don't want to follow God's will is rejecting God. That's what lukewarm is when you are not on fire for Him, meaning you do his will. Quote: True alot of people were created and were chosen to do things that weren't exactly easy, and it is our choice, however again the choice is difficult to make and it's a daily choice. So basically on a daily basis we're struggling to stave off sin, I don't know about you but I don't like constant struggle. I also don't like the fact that we have to ask for....wait do we even have to ask for forgiveness after each sin? Does the Bible say that or is that something the church made up? again if you'd like to answer me this question , please provide Biblical support. Also yes I know what luke warm is, and when you say on fire for him what does that mean? spending a large portion of your time at church or perhaps kissing his @$$ by telling him oh thank you for this wonderful new car I have or other new material possession when in truth it was your hard work that earned you that certain item. I'm sorry church is good for spiritual learning...sometimes, but I'd rather not spend all my time there or mixing with it's too much like minded individuals( your not sure whether you've talked to this person before because they pretty much say the same thing as the next) and I'd rather acknowledge my hardwork, rather than it always being the mysterious hand of GOD, not that I'm saying GOD doesn't do good things in your life, but sometimes it's because you worked for it. You are not the only one that struggles with this. It is not easy, and the devil will fight you whether or not you live for God. That's why its hard. the bible says that blessed is the man that falls and gets up, no matter how many times it happens, and he will never give you more than you can handle. Quote: Are you sure the Bible said that, please quote Biblical scripture to show me if you don't mind? What it seems like to me is that you are using your flesh as an excuse like you owe it something. You were not created to please your flesh, but to please God. Pride is what tells our minds that that's not fair. Quote: No, I owe my flesh nothing, at least I don't think so, what I do think is that because of the curse which was passed on from Adam and Eve to the rest of man, which by the way omniscient and omnipotent GOD let happen is unfair, I have to pay for their sins, by being born with sin, which again is very difficult to fight against because it's apart of your nature it's apart of who you are and despite your best intentions you blunder, fall, and ultimately screw up, and here's what irritates me the most is that where expected to feel bad for the things we've done which again is in our nature to do. "I am a free-willed individual" yes you are, and it is your choice to follow God's will or not. Quote: It's kinda an almost one sided choice though, it's either you do his will or be sent to hell, so it's almost like you have no choice at all. We did not ask to be born to the parents we have. But saying "I didn't ask for this" does not change the fact that it is. You can twist it all you want and in the end that is what you can tell God when you stand in front of Him. He will always love you, and it grieves the spirit when His child rejects him. Your walk with God is your own. But I can tell you that there is always someone who struggled harder than you somewhere in this world, but they chose to serve God. Quote: I'm not trying to say that I'm the only one that has it hard, some people out there have struggled harder I'm aware the days of Paul and the Romans weren't exactly the funnest of times, my point is not that I am the only one thats has it hard but rather why should we have to suffer for something we didn't do and by the way could have been prevented. Our struggles make us stronger and become a testimony to help another with the same. I will tell you one thing, you'd be surprised the vices I struggled with, but it was because I strove and fought and clawed my way out of that pit with God on my mind. It's hard, but to me, its worth it. Because I know that the more He forgives me, the more I love Him and the more He can help me. Quote: Again I don't see why you or I or anyone else has to suffer from something that could have been prevented it seems to me that GOD wasn't happy with just people loving him without having anything to really stand in their way, which isn't a bad Idea really, because hey that proves we truly love him, but to fail the struggle eqauls an unfair punishment which is hell, and lets be realistic anyone who is born with sin automatically goes to hell, and anyone who fails their walk also goes to hell. So in the grand scheme of things how is all of this fair? I appreciate you being less hostile towards me this time, than you were the last, you've also given me some new things to think about. I still think this is GOD, Heaven, Sin, Hell, etc is unfair. Sorry, but thats going to ring inside my mind till the end comes and I'm sure I'm not the only one who has thought this to be unfair; and no not just atheist's or non christians.
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Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 5:42 pm
Sir BlackHeart Ireland_Gunner Sir BlackHeart Ireland_Gunner Sir BlackHeart But I did try to reach the ultimate goal, it hurt like hell fire, although probably nothing compared to it. It was painful, and I really don't know if this so called love was worth it, especially knowing all this could have been forgone if he just took a few measures against the garden incident, but then again I don't think he wanted to he let it happen. And no I rather don't want t obey I'd rather do my own thing and still be loved if thats at all possible for him to do. I will say this I do think he has some good moral precepts and I would like to be better at practicing them, just not feel like everytime I fail I have go ask for forgiveness for something I don't have total control over, again I'm sinful because I was born with sin not because I choose to be even the Bible confirms it. Also about your Luke thing, I have to say this Jesus was GOD is human form so thats not nessecarily encouraging to see the most powerful being in the universe-possibly take the form of man and completely stomp temptation and the devil in a single swooping, and also although he was made to be sin specifically a sin sacrifice for us I don't think he was born with sin. I think that even with the Holy Spirit it is hard, because temptation always comes back sooner or later. Everything you've just said....I'm sorry, is Pride. Quote: No, not pride I am a free willed individual why should I have to bend to another beings wimps to be loved especially when I did not chose to be created by that being, and did not set up the circumstances in which I have to abide by this beings rules(which by the way his rules go against my natural nature so I have to fight to abide by them.) or I'll be thrown into hell fire. No not pride, but merely a realization that this is kinda wacked "I want to do my own thing, and still be loved" The bible talks about loving God in a way that you cannot be lukewarm with Him, or complacent. Quote: Let me ask you this is it too much to ask GOD to love me for who I am? well actually it is seeing as though he doesn't like sin and I'm sinful, although I'm not happy with some of the things I do. You cannot claim to love God AND love the world. For that right there is adultery with God. Quote: I don't believe I claimed to love GOD or the world, where did I say that in my post? eventually the bride, or the church will be caught up in the air to be with Jesus forever. God wanted those that would willingly be with Him, that chose Him and not the world or their flesh. Even Jesus in the garden said to His Father "Not my will, but YOUR will" Even the flesh of Jesus wanted to live, but the spirit that dwelled in Him knew the will of God comes first. Quote: hold it right there lets talk about the will of GOD, it seems to me that it was the will of GOD in the first place to have man fall, by not interfering in the garden of eden, then have the children of man struggle against their own dark nature to do the right thing and love him although that is extremely hard to do, because again we were curse with a dark nature. And if that isn't enough some people will probably go to hell because some did not know GOD or Jesus, or (I believe) because they didn't make the spiritual cut and finish the race(described by Paul in the Bible) which I believe is to endure which is also very hard for us.It seems to me that GOD is making us suffer to love him, and I don't think that should be so, especially seeing as though he's the one with all the power, not that I'm saying that his death on the cross wasn't hard because that must have been emotionally and physically racking, probably spiritually too; However he's GOD It's not like he did some high risked venture where he didn't know he would succeed he did know he would succeed, because supposedly he's omniscient(all knowing). If we are supposed to be Christ-like, than taking our will over God's, is sin. Quote: And what does Christ like mean, if it means to help/serve other people and try to spread salvation through the word then, and even sometimes sacrifice yourself for others than yeah thats something I would love to do more of. But if it's to Bow down to GOD's whimps and completely agree on everything he says I can't do that, people have their own thoughts and opinions and I can't subject mine to GOD's maybe I could still do some things that he says but I'd never really agree with them. Its pride, and God will only receive a broken and humbled heart, that is not hardened so He can work with it and sculpt us to his will. Quote: So basically GOD wants to subject gate me a free willed being to his will, that mildly seems like oppression and if he wanted robots to begin with why didn't he just create them. You need to read the bible a little more because no where in the Word does it say that we should follow God's will only when it coincides with our will. God forbid. Quote: Again where have I said we or I should follow GOD's will only when it coincides with my own? unless you are trying to make some other point? "And no I rather don't want t obey I'd rather do my own thing and still be loved if thats at all possible for him to do." Quote: MMhh it's more of I don't agree with certain things he has done, and will do, by all means he can do whatever he wants it doesn't mean that I like it or anyone else or even agree with it. What does that sound like to you? That sounds to me like you don't want to follow God's will but you want it to be okay. How can you justify that? OF course God loves you. "humbling" yourself is submitting to the will of God. And saying it was too hard is telling God that He is a liar when He said he will not give you more than you can handle. Quote: well maybe it was more than I can handle you ever thought of that perhaps you should go read certain journal entries I have about how my conscience at times caused me to have anxiety attacks. Are you sure the Bible says he will not give you more than you can handle? Find the verse for me if you don't mind, also humbling yourself doesn't necessarily make you a servant or a push over which is what it seems to me like what he wants. You said you didn't ask to be created. No one did. But Mary didn't ask to be chosen to carry the tabernacle God would dwell in on Earth. Many people in the Bible did not ask to be chosen for something. But we were created to praise God. It is your choice to follow his will or rebel and say "I don't want to do this anymore" you didn't have to directly say "I choose the world over God's will" But saying that you don't want to follow God's will is rejecting God. That's what lukewarm is when you are not on fire for Him, meaning you do his will. Quote: True alot of people were created and were chosen to do things that weren't exactly easy, and it is our choice, however again the choice is difficult to make and it's a daily choice. So basically on a daily basis we're struggling to stave off sin, I don't know about you but I don't like constant struggle. I also don't like the fact that we have to ask for....wait do we even have to ask for forgiveness after each sin? Does the Bible say that or is that something the church made up? again if you'd like to answer me this question , please provide Biblical support. Also yes I know what luke warm is, and when you say on fire for him what does that mean? spending a large portion of your time at church or perhaps kissing his @$$ by telling him oh thank you for this wonderful new car I have or other new material possession when in truth it was your hard work that earned you that certain item. I'm sorry church is good for spiritual learning...sometimes, but I'd rather not spend all my time there or mixing with it's too much like minded individuals( your not sure whether you've talked to this person before because they pretty much say the same thing as the next) and I'd rather acknowledge my hardwork, rather than it always being the mysterious hand of GOD, not that I'm saying GOD doesn't do good things in your life, but sometimes it's because you worked for it. You are not the only one that struggles with this. It is not easy, and the devil will fight you whether or not you live for God. That's why its hard. the bible says that blessed is the man that falls and gets up, no matter how many times it happens, and he will never give you more than you can handle. Quote: Are you sure the Bible said that, please quote Biblical scripture to show me if you don't mind? What it seems like to me is that you are using your flesh as an excuse like you owe it something. You were not created to please your flesh, but to please God. Pride is what tells our minds that that's not fair. Quote: No, I owe my flesh nothing, at least I don't think so, what I do think is that because of the curse which was passed on from Adam and Eve to the rest of man, which by the way omniscient and omnipotent GOD let happen is unfair, I have to pay for their sins, by being born with sin, which again is very difficult to fight against because it's apart of your nature it's apart of who you are and despite your best intentions you blunder, fall, and ultimately screw up, and here's what irritates me the most is that where expected to feel bad for the things we've done which again is in our nature to do. "I am a free-willed individual" yes you are, and it is your choice to follow God's will or not. Quote: It's kinda an almost one sided choice though, it's either you do his will or be sent to hell, so it's almost like you have no choice at all. We did not ask to be born to the parents we have. But saying "I didn't ask for this" does not change the fact that it is. You can twist it all you want and in the end that is what you can tell God when you stand in front of Him. He will always love you, and it grieves the spirit when His child rejects him. Your walk with God is your own. But I can tell you that there is always someone who struggled harder than you somewhere in this world, but they chose to serve God. Quote: I'm not trying to say that I'm the only one that has it hard, some people out there have struggled harder I'm aware the days of Paul and the Romans weren't exactly the funnest of times, my point is not that I am the only one thats has it hard but rather why should we have to suffer for something we didn't do and by the way could have been prevented. Our struggles make us stronger and become a testimony to help another with the same. I will tell you one thing, you'd be surprised the vices I struggled with, but it was because I strove and fought and clawed my way out of that pit with God on my mind. It's hard, but to me, its worth it. Because I know that the more He forgives me, the more I love Him and the more He can help me. Quote: Again I don't see why you or I or anyone else has to suffer from something that could have been prevented it seems to me that GOD wasn't happy with just people loving him without having anything to really stand in their way, which isn't a bad Idea really, because hey that proves we truly love him, but to fail the struggle eqauls an unfair punishment which is hell, and lets be realistic anyone who is born with sin automatically goes to hell, and anyone who fails their walk also goes to hell. So in the grand scheme of things how is all of this fair? I appreciate you being less hostile towards me this time, than you were the last, you've also given me some new things to think about. I still think this is GOD, Heaven, Sin, Hell, etc is unfair. Sorry, but thats going to ring inside my mind till the end comes and I'm sure I'm not the only one who has thought this to be unfair; and no not just atheist's or non christians. I'm not trying to be hostile, I apologize if I came across that way before. I had a very good friend that rejected God for the same reasons, she died a few years ago in her sleep (sleep apnia) and was never reconciled to God. That is something I never want someone going to hell for. Because you can't go back and change it when its done. That's why the bible says "where the tree falls there it shall lie" when its done it's final. This will be a struggle your whole life. You will never be able to rid the temptations of the world because it appeals to the flesh, but you can learn to turn it to God as you grow. I struggle with pride that seems to spring up out of nowhere and I have to squash it down in prayer and repentance. I fought against this for a long time until I realized I was only aiding the enemy in my own destruction. God will always take you back, like the prodigal son, he wanted all he could get and then left. There is pride in that, pride of life. He thought he didn't need his father anymore and found in the end he couldn't live without him. Regarding sin, when we ask for forgiveness God forgets our sin as if it never was, a renewal to life. But what the devil does, instead of guilt being what triggers repentance and then forgiveness, he seeks to constantly remind us of our sin and therefore we think God remembers, but that's only the devil. That is something people miss and often backslide because they think God is doing it to them when it is really the enemy. Guilt is not supposed to go beyond forgiveness, that's where we are supposed to get up where we fell and try again, to strive to live for God no matter how many times we fail. I apologize again for typing so long but I felt the need to say it.
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Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 10:43 pm
Ireland_Gunner Sir BlackHeart Ireland_Gunner Sir BlackHeart Ireland_Gunner Everything you've just said....I'm sorry, is Pride. "I want to do my own thing, and still be loved" The bible talks about loving God in a way that you cannot be lukewarm with Him, or complacent. You cannot claim to love God AND love the world. For that right there is adultery with God. eventually the bride, or the church will be caught up in the air to be with Jesus forever. God wanted those that would willingly be with Him, that chose Him and not the world or their flesh. Even Jesus in the garden said to His Father "Not my will, but YOUR will" Even the flesh of Jesus wanted to live, but the spirit that dwelled in Him knew the will of God comes first.If we are supposed to be Christ-like, than taking our will over God's, is sin. Its pride, and God will only receive a broken and humbled heart, that is not hardened so He can work with it and sculpt us to his will. You need to read the bible a little more because no where in the Word does it say that we should follow God's will only when it coincides with our will. God forbid. "And no I rather don't want t obey I'd rather do my own thing and still be loved if thats at all possible for him to do." Quote: MMhh it's more of I don't agree with certain things he has done, and will do, by all means he can do whatever he wants it doesn't mean that I like it or anyone else or even agree with it. What does that sound like to you? That sounds to me like you don't want to follow God's will but you want it to be okay. How can you justify that? OF course God loves you. "humbling" yourself is submitting to the will of God. And saying it was too hard is telling God that He is a liar when He said he will not give you more than you can handle. Quote: well maybe it was more than I can handle you ever thought of that perhaps you should go read certain journal entries I have about how my conscience at times caused me to have anxiety attacks. Are you sure the Bible says he will not give you more than you can handle? Find the verse for me if you don't mind, also humbling yourself doesn't necessarily make you a servant or a push over which is what it seems to me like what he wants. You said you didn't ask to be created. No one did. But Mary didn't ask to be chosen to carry the tabernacle God would dwell in on Earth. Many people in the Bible did not ask to be chosen for something. But we were created to praise God. It is your choice to follow his will or rebel and say "I don't want to do this anymore" you didn't have to directly say "I choose the world over God's will" But saying that you don't want to follow God's will is rejecting God. That's what lukewarm is when you are not on fire for Him, meaning you do his will. Quote: True alot of people were created and were chosen to do things that weren't exactly easy, and it is our choice, however again the choice is difficult to make and it's a daily choice. So basically on a daily basis we're struggling to stave off sin, I don't know about you but I don't like constant struggle. I also don't like the fact that we have to ask for....wait do we even have to ask for forgiveness after each sin? Does the Bible say that or is that something the church made up? again if you'd like to answer me this question , please provide Biblical support. Also yes I know what luke warm is, and when you say on fire for him what does that mean? spending a large portion of your time at church or perhaps kissing his @$$ by telling him oh thank you for this wonderful new car I have or other new material possession when in truth it was your hard work that earned you that certain item. I'm sorry church is good for spiritual learning...sometimes, but I'd rather not spend all my time there or mixing with it's too much like minded individuals( your not sure whether you've talked to this person before because they pretty much say the same thing as the next) and I'd rather acknowledge my hardwork, rather than it always being the mysterious hand of GOD, not that I'm saying GOD doesn't do good things in your life, but sometimes it's because you worked for it. You are not the only one that struggles with this. It is not easy, and the devil will fight you whether or not you live for God. That's why its hard. the bible says that blessed is the man that falls and gets up, no matter how many times it happens, and he will never give you more than you can handle. Quote: Are you sure the Bible said that, please quote Biblical scripture to show me if you don't mind? What it seems like to me is that you are using your flesh as an excuse like you owe it something. You were not created to please your flesh, but to please God. Pride is what tells our minds that that's not fair. Quote: No, I owe my flesh nothing, at least I don't think so, what I do think is that because of the curse which was passed on from Adam and Eve to the rest of man, which by the way omniscient and omnipotent GOD let happen is unfair, I have to pay for their sins, by being born with sin, which again is very difficult to fight against because it's apart of your nature it's apart of who you are and despite your best intentions you blunder, fall, and ultimately screw up, and here's what irritates me the most is that where expected to feel bad for the things we've done which again is in our nature to do. "I am a free-willed individual" yes you are, and it is your choice to follow God's will or not. Quote: It's kinda an almost one sided choice though, it's either you do his will or be sent to hell, so it's almost like you have no choice at all. We did not ask to be born to the parents we have. But saying "I didn't ask for this" does not change the fact that it is. You can twist it all you want and in the end that is what you can tell God when you stand in front of Him. He will always love you, and it grieves the spirit when His child rejects him. Your walk with God is your own. But I can tell you that there is always someone who struggled harder than you somewhere in this world, but they chose to serve God. Quote: I'm not trying to say that I'm the only one that has it hard, some people out there have struggled harder I'm aware the days of Paul and the Romans weren't exactly the funnest of times, my point is not that I am the only one thats has it hard but rather why should we have to suffer for something we didn't do and by the way could have been prevented. Our struggles make us stronger and become a testimony to help another with the same. I will tell you one thing, you'd be surprised the vices I struggled with, but it was because I strove and fought and clawed my way out of that pit with God on my mind. It's hard, but to me, its worth it. Because I know that the more He forgives me, the more I love Him and the more He can help me. Quote: Again I don't see why you or I or anyone else has to suffer from something that could have been prevented it seems to me that GOD wasn't happy with just people loving him without having anything to really stand in their way, which isn't a bad Idea really, because hey that proves we truly love him, but to fail the struggle eqauls an unfair punishment which is hell, and lets be realistic anyone who is born with sin automatically goes to hell, and anyone who fails their walk also goes to hell. So in the grand scheme of things how is all of this fair? I appreciate you being less hostile towards me this time, than you were the last, you've also given me some new things to think about. I still think this is GOD, Heaven, Sin, Hell, etc is unfair. Sorry, but thats going to ring inside my mind till the end comes and I'm sure I'm not the only one who has thought this to be unfair; and no not just atheist's or non christians. I'm not trying to be hostile, I apologize if I came across that way before. I had a very good friend that rejected God for the same reasons, she died a few years ago in her sleep (sleep apnia) and was never reconciled to God. That is something I never want someone going to hell for. Because you can't go back and change it when its done. That's why the bible says "where the tree falls there it shall lie" when its done it's final. This will be a struggle your whole life. You will never be able to rid the temptations of the world because it appeals to the flesh, but you can learn to turn it to God as you grow. I struggle with pride that seems to spring up out of nowhere and I have to squash it down in prayer and repentance. I fought against this for a long time until I realized I was only aiding the enemy in my own destruction. God will always take you back, like the prodigal son, he wanted all he could get and then left. There is pride in that, pride of life. He thought he didn't need his father anymore and found in the end he couldn't live without him. Regarding sin, when we ask for forgiveness God forgets our sin as if it never was, a renewal to life. But what the devil does, instead of guilt being what triggers repentance and then forgiveness, he seeks to constantly remind us of our sin and therefore we think God remembers, but that's only the devil. That is something people miss and often backslide because they think God is doing it to them when it is really the enemy. Guilt is not supposed to go beyond forgiveness, that's where we are supposed to get up where we fell and try again, to strive to live for God no matter how many times we fail. I apologize again for typing so long but I felt the need to say it. "well maybe it was more than I can handle you ever thought of that perhaps you should go read certain journal entries I have about how my conscience at times caused me to have anxiety attacks. Are you sure the Bible says he will not give you more than you can handle? Find the verse for me if you don't mind, also humbling yourself doesn't necessarily make you a servant or a push over which is what it seems to me like what he wants." 2 Corinthians 7:9-11 (New International Version)- 9yet now I am happy, not because you were made sorry, but because your sorrow led you to repentance. For you became sorrowful as God intended and so were not harmed in any way by us. 10Godly sorrow brings repentance that leads to salvation and leaves no regret, but worldly sorrow brings death. 11See what this godly sorrow has produced in you: what earnestness, what eagerness to clear yourselves, what indignation, what alarm, what longing, what concern, what readiness to see justice done. At every point you have proved yourselves to be innocent in this matter. God does not intend you to suffer after he has forgiven you, but that you get up and try again, even if you fail again, GET UP. 1 Corinthians 10:13 - "There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it." Hebrews 2:18 - For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted. You can give up and say its too hard, but then right here, you are calling God a liar. That's the downright truth right there, because God's word is truth, and this is his word right here. I've struggled with many issues that have landed me out of my mind with worry. But you say that your concience gives you panic attacks. Well then you don't know the Word very well if you allow guilt to transcend beyond forgiveness. That's not God, you ask for forgiveness and God forgets your sin, the devil will keep reminding you of your sin because it keeps you from growing in Him. "True alot of people were created and were chosen to do things that weren't exactly easy, and it is our choice, however again the choice is difficult to make and it's a daily choice. So basically on a daily basis we're struggling to stave off sin, I don't know about you but I don't like constant struggle. I also don't like the fact that we have to ask for....wait do we even have to ask for forgiveness after each sin? Does the Bible say that or is that something the church made up? again if you'd like to answer me this question , please provide Biblical support. Also yes I know what luke warm is, and when you say on fire for him what does that mean? spending a large portion of your time at church or perhaps kissing his @$$ by telling him oh thank you for this wonderful new car I have or other new material possession when in truth it was your hard work that earned you that certain item. I'm sorry church is good for spiritual learning...sometimes, but I'd rather not spend all my time there or mixing with it's too much like minded individuals( your not sure whether you've talked to this person before because they pretty much say the same thing as the next) and I'd rather acknowledge my hardwork, rather than it always being the mysterious hand of GOD, not that I'm saying GOD doesn't do good things in your life, but sometimes it's because you worked for it." 2 Peter 3:9- (NIV) The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance. He is being very patient, and always waiting for you. Repentance requires one to be humble, for God despises pride. Revelation 3:16 So, because you are lukewarm—neither hot nor cold—I am about to spit you out of my mouth. On fire means you seek to know God more, through prayer fastinga and reading the word. Lukewarm means you are complacent in God, you know who He is, but you are not willing to obey Him, yet you claim to be one of His. Cold means you either don't know God or you claim to not believe in him. God would rather you be one or the other, but lukewarm will not work for Him. 1 Corinthians 1:10 I appeal to you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree with one another so that there may be no divisions among you and that you may be perfectly united in mind and thought. yeah, like-minded in the Word. God wants us to band together, to worship him in spirit and in truth. When you are at church, there are people who can fight the devil with you, but when you sit alone, you fight the devil alone. God wants us to help eachother, to be together as brethren and fight the devil as one. Matthew 18:20- For where two or three come together in my name, there am I with them. when you gather with one or more people, there is power and there is healing and aid from God. When you are alone, your mind will run you through all the things that hurt you, and the devil seeks you most when you are alone. We are meant to encourage one another, and pray for eachother and God honors that. there are many scriptures that can help you, guide you, and bring you out. You say many things of one who does not trully understand the word of God. But those with a seeking heart who really want to know God, will have the scales removed from their eyes for He will reveal His word to you. I am not jesting when I say you need to get to a church. For it sounds to me that you fight the devil alone and your mind is tormented by past bad deeds and fear that maybe you won't have forgiveness next time, so why bother? Untrue. That's the enemy. Find a church, I'm apostolic pentecostal, so I go to one of those churches, but you need to seek out those who are also striving to know God more, because there you will find the spirit speaking to the churches and a word that maybe God has for you and He's waiting for you to come and ask Him for it.
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