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 Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2007 11:14 pm
I hope that this doesn't count as a "how do I say," against the rules, thread. Many, many apologies, if so.
I'm designing a tattoo for my sister-in-law and, after much searching for words that mean "peace," "harmony," or "serenity," she decided she liked "serenity."
I'm not heading back to school for another two weeks, so I can't exactly walk into class and ask my professor if the word is correct, and I wouldn't trust just any old dictionary or online translator with something that was bodily permanent. I was wondering if "安らぎ" (やすらぎ) was a proper translation of the English word "serenity."
Many thanks!
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Posted: Sun Aug 19, 2007 3:57 am
1. Yes it quite obviously counts as a "how do I say" thread. 2. You wouldn't trust a dictionary or online translator with this, but you would trust a bunch of relative strangers on an internet forum? 3. You do know that tattoos in a language you can't read are really lame, right? That's L-A-M-E. Just checking. 4. Write in English, or write in Japanese, but please don't pepper your posts with random Japanese words and phrases for no reason other than you think it looks cool. It's not cool, it's just mildly annoying and kinda lame. 5. Regarding your actual question, Jim Breen's online dictionary defines 安らぎ as "peace, tranquility", with a couple of examples: * 私の望むのは安らぎと静けさだけです。 All I want is peace and quiet. * 森の静けさは安らぎを与える。 The silence in the forest is restful. So no, probably not exactly the same as "serenity", but hey, if she wanted a tattoo saying "serenity", she could just have it written in English, right? [ lame neutral ]
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Posted: Sun Aug 19, 2007 5:03 am
No no no no no.
NO
That word derives from yasui or 'cheap', and the kanji itself 安 stands for relaxation, quietness and cheapness, and depicts a woman under a roof (ie. house wife = quiet), not really appropriate for a sister-in-law domokun
Well, maybe as a joke, but not something you want etched into ones skin
Maybe you should try talking her into another word, as 'serenity' itself essentially means 'quietness' or "calmness", what would you think if you saw a Japanese person with a big "silence" tattooed on their arm in English?
That leads to another point, I have talked to Japanese friends about people with Japanese tattoos and they all agreed that they thought they looked ******** ridiculous, I don't think they look that bad, but I would never get one done myself
Anyway, we are all just students here, and can give you some pointers an advice, but when it comes to something as permanent as a tattoo, you would be better off asking a Japanese person, give them some words for a tattoo and ask them if they think it would look stupid (They will probably say any Japanese word as a tattoo will look stupid), and get some advice from the source
Whatever you do, DO NOT pick a word out of a book at a tattoo parlor, I went into one to have a look, and they had messed just about everything up
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Posted: Sun Aug 19, 2007 2:36 pm
1. Sorry. However, I did see a thread that was asking about another word kanji-related, and I wasn't sure where else to put it. If you'd rather I ask a moderator to delete the thread, fine. 2. Many relative strangers on internet forums are relatively trustworthy. I have no problem asking a question like this, especially in a guild meant specifically for learning Japanese. It's not like my sister-in-law is planning on getting the tattoo right when the design is done. 3. Tattoos are personal, and it's up to the person getting the tattoo to decide what's lame. It's not for you, so I'm not bothered that you think it's lame, and I'm sure she's not either. 4. I apologize for bothering you, but I'm not a huge fan of writing in romaji, and I don't call my Japanese professor "professor." I concur, I could have used without the classroom bit, but "sensee" is "sensee." 5. Thank you for actually attempting to answer my question. I don't appreciate your rude response. You could have easily said everything you did without being so condescending.
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Posted: Sun Aug 19, 2007 2:47 pm
geishaboy That word derives from yasui or 'cheap', and the kanji itself 安 stands for relaxation, quietness and cheapness, and depicts a woman under a roof (ie. house wife = quiet), not really appropriate for a sister-in-law domokun Well, maybe as a joke, but not something you want etched into ones skin Maybe you should try talking her into another word, as 'serenity' itself essentially means 'quietness' or "calmness", what would you think if you saw a Japanese person with a big "silence" tattooed on their arm in English? That leads to another point, I have talked to Japanese friends about people with Japanese tattoos and they all agreed that they thought they looked ******** ridiculous, I don't think they look that bad, but I would never get one done myself Anyway, we are all just students here, and can give you some pointers an advice, but when it comes to something as permanent as a tattoo, you would be better off asking a Japanese person, give them some words for a tattoo and ask them if they think it would look stupid (They will probably say any Japanese word as a tattoo will look stupid), and get some advice from the source Whatever you do, DO NOT pick a word out of a book at a tattoo parlor, I went into one to have a look, and they had messed just about everything up Thanks! I'm aware that the kanji derives from "cheap," but I've been grasping at straws trying to find another way to say "serenity" in so many words. She specifically likes that meaning, as opposed to "peace," etc, so I'm trying to get a vaguely direct translation. I think I will let her know about all of this, and try to talk her into something more along the lines of just "和" (わ/harmony) with the rest of the design. I really do believe that a tattoo is a personal thing, but I will let her know what your Japanese friends have said. Thank you again!
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Posted: Sun Aug 19, 2007 5:24 pm
Anata geishaboy That word derives from yasui or 'cheap', and the kanji itself 安 stands for relaxation, quietness and cheapness, and depicts a woman under a roof (ie. house wife = quiet), not really appropriate for a sister-in-law domokun Well, maybe as a joke, but not something you want etched into ones skin Maybe you should try talking her into another word, as 'serenity' itself essentially means 'quietness' or "calmness", what would you think if you saw a Japanese person with a big "silence" tattooed on their arm in English? That leads to another point, I have talked to Japanese friends about people with Japanese tattoos and they all agreed that they thought they looked ******** ridiculous, I don't think they look that bad, but I would never get one done myself Anyway, we are all just students here, and can give you some pointers an advice, but when it comes to something as permanent as a tattoo, you would be better off asking a Japanese person, give them some words for a tattoo and ask them if they think it would look stupid (They will probably say any Japanese word as a tattoo will look stupid), and get some advice from the source Whatever you do, DO NOT pick a word out of a book at a tattoo parlor, I went into one to have a look, and they had messed just about everything up Thanks! I'm aware that the kanji derives from "cheap," but I've been grasping at straws trying to find another way to say "serenity" in so many words. She specifically likes that meaning, as opposed to "peace," etc, so I'm trying to get a vaguely direct translation. I think I will let her know about all of this, and try to talk her into something more along the lines of just "和" (わ/harmony) with the rest of the design. I really do believe that a tattoo is a personal thing, but I will let her know what your Japanese friends have said. Thank you again! Well, that kanji on it's own 和 actually stands for Japan, and Japanese. For example, Japanese to English dictionaries are called 'waei jisho' 和英辞書, so although it has the meaning of peace, that kanji alone would look like having "Japan" tattooed on your arm It's these kinds of things that make tattoo parlors hopless when it comes to kanji meanings, they just find a kanji compound in a dictionary and assume it's the right word
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Posted: Sun Aug 19, 2007 5:47 pm
geishaboy Well, that kanji on it's own 和 actually stands for Japan, and Japanese. For example, Japanese to English dictionaries are called 'waei jisho' 和英辞書, so although it has the meaning of peace, that kanji alone would look like having "Japan" tattooed on your arm It's these kinds of things that make tattoo parlors hopless when it comes to kanji meanings, they just find a kanji compound in a dictionary and assume it's the right word Goodness! Thank you very much! This is why I've been quite troubled about the design, though the picture itself (a Buddha) is essentially completed. It's just that the length of the compound changes the look of the design, so I'm trying to get it as done as possible before I return to school and can't really work on it for her anymore. Are any of these correct? 協和 (harmony) 調和 (also harmony) 平静 (last ditch effort at "serenity") I'm sorry to keep bothering you with this. Thank you again for all your help.
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Posted: Sun Aug 19, 2007 6:53 pm
Anata 1. Sorry. However, I did see a thread that was asking about another word kanji-related, and I wasn't sure where else to put it. If you'd rather I ask a moderator to delete the thread, fine. 2. Many relative strangers on internet forums are relatively trustworthy. I have no problem asking a question like this, especially in a guild meant specifically for learning Japanese. It's not like my sister-in-law is planning on getting the tattoo right when the design is done. 3. Tattoos are personal, and it's up to the person getting the tattoo to decide what's lame. It's not for you, so I'm not bothered that you think it's lame, and I'm sure she's not either. 4. I apologize for bothering you, but I'm not a huge fan of writing in romaji, and I don't call my Japanese professor "professor." I concur, I could have used without the classroom bit, but "sensee" is "sensee." 5. Thank you for actually attempting to answer my question. I don't appreciate your rude response. You could have easily said everything you did without being so condescending. Rude, yes, but I've seen much worse. I would personally consult with someone who knows the language and Kanji before making any final decisions, if I were you. I would aid you in this, but my computer lacks the ability to read/write Japanese, so there isn't much I can do. >>;;
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Posted: Sun Aug 19, 2007 9:36 pm
Anata geishaboy Well, that kanji on it's own 和 actually stands for Japan, and Japanese. For example, Japanese to English dictionaries are called 'waei jisho' 和英辞書, so although it has the meaning of peace, that kanji alone would look like having "Japan" tattooed on your arm It's these kinds of things that make tattoo parlors hopless when it comes to kanji meanings, they just find a kanji compound in a dictionary and assume it's the right word Goodness! Thank you very much! This is why I've been quite troubled about the design, though the picture itself (a Buddha) is essentially completed. It's just that the length of the compound changes the look of the design, so I'm trying to get it as done as possible before I return to school and can't really work on it for her anymore. Are any of these correct? 協和 (harmony) 調和 (also harmony) 平静 (last ditch effort at "serenity") I'm sorry to keep bothering you with this. Thank you again for all your help. Hey no problem, we are here to help So lets have a look 協和 kyouwa - While this technically means harmony, it's talking primarily about musical harmony, not really the meaning you are looking for 調和 chouwa - I think this is closer to the meaning you want, you would use this word when talking about being at harmony with nature and stuff like that, it sounds ok, but get it checked by a native Japanese speaker 平静 heisei - This is more like keeping calm, keeping ones composure, that sort of thing, I'm not really sure this is what you are looking for either My suggestions would be; 平和 heiwa - This means peace, in a "Gods in his heaven, all is right with world" kind of peace, not a peace and quiet kind of peace 幸福 koufuku - This means happiness and blessedness, it has the connotations of being completely content in your soul, the world and in the home Even though I have given you those examples, and I'm quite confident they have a nice ring to them, you should still get them checked out by a Japanese person if possible
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Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2007 3:55 pm
geishaboy No no no no no. NO That word derives from yasui or 'cheap', and the kanji itself 安 stands for relaxation, quietness and cheapness, and depicts a woman under a roof (ie. house wife = quiet), not really appropriate for a sister-in-law domokun Well, maybe as a joke, but not something you want etched into ones skin Maybe you should try talking her into another word, as 'serenity' itself essentially means 'quietness' or "calmness", what would you think if you saw a Japanese person with a big "silence" tattooed on their arm in English? That leads to another point, I have talked to Japanese friends about people with Japanese tattoos and they all agreed that they thought they looked ******** ridiculous, I don't think they look that bad, but I would never get one done myself Anyway, we are all just students here, and can give you some pointers an advice, but when it comes to something as permanent as a tattoo, you would be better off asking a Japanese person, give them some words for a tattoo and ask them if they think it would look stupid (They will probably say any Japanese word as a tattoo will look stupid), and get some advice from the source Whatever you do, DO NOT pick a word out of a book at a tattoo parlor, I went into one to have a look, and they had messed just about everything up no. the girl is right. even though安means "cheap"it is still if you add stuff on, it could mean a totl diffeent thing. the girl is correct^_^
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Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:36 pm
minniemouselover geishaboy No no no no no. NO That word derives from yasui or 'cheap', and the kanji itself 安 stands for relaxation, quietness and cheapness, and depicts a woman under a roof (ie. house wife = quiet), not really appropriate for a sister-in-law domokun Well, maybe as a joke, but not something you want etched into ones skin Maybe you should try talking her into another word, as 'serenity' itself essentially means 'quietness' or "calmness", what would you think if you saw a Japanese person with a big "silence" tattooed on their arm in English? That leads to another point, I have talked to Japanese friends about people with Japanese tattoos and they all agreed that they thought they looked ******** ridiculous, I don't think they look that bad, but I would never get one done myself Anyway, we are all just students here, and can give you some pointers an advice, but when it comes to something as permanent as a tattoo, you would be better off asking a Japanese person, give them some words for a tattoo and ask them if they think it would look stupid (They will probably say any Japanese word as a tattoo will look stupid), and get some advice from the source Whatever you do, DO NOT pick a word out of a book at a tattoo parlor, I went into one to have a look, and they had messed just about everything up no. the girl is right. even though安means "cheap"it is still if you add stuff on, it could mean a totl diffeent thing. the girl is correct^_^ Quote: the kanji itself 安 stands for relaxation, quietness and cheapness, and depicts a woman under a roof (ie. house wife = quiet) I understand that it can mean other things than just cheap, I'm more talking about the idiomatic meaning of the Kanji, and that is Quote: ...depicts a woman under a roof (ie. house wife = quiet) It's sexist, a little derogatory even (In my opinion), not something I would reccomend getting tattoed on a womans arm. besides that, I think the original poster was looking for a two part compound
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Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2007 6:21 pm
geishaboy It's sexist, a little derogatory even (In my opinion), not something I would reccomend getting tattoed on a womans arm. besides that, I think the original poster was looking for a two part compound I've got to say that I agree with you, and I thank you for pointing it out to me. I'm not entirely sure what I was thinking when I picked it; I had a short discussion about the sexism of that kanji with a friend from my Japanese class last semester. Makes me feel incredibly dumb. geishaboy My suggestions would be; 平和 heiwa - This means peace, in a "Gods in his heaven, all is right with world" kind of peace, not a peace and quiet kind of peace 幸福 koufuku - This means happiness and blessedness, it has the connotations of being completely content in your soul, the world and in the home Even though I have given you those examples, and I'm quite confident they have a nice ring to them, you should still get them checked out by a Japanese person if possible I just wanted to thank you again. I greatly appreciate the effort you've put into helping me; it's been far more than I expected or even hoped to receive. I believe she's going to go with 平和, and I'll finish the design for her before I go back. I figure I can ask my professor once I'm at school, just to double-check, but this way she can at least have a somewhat final idea as to what everything would look like. Thank you very much!!
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Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2007 7:40 pm
Anata geishaboy It's sexist, a little derogatory even (In my opinion), not something I would reccomend getting tattoed on a womans arm. besides that, I think the original poster was looking for a two part compound I've got to say that I agree with you, and I thank you for pointing it out to me. I'm not entirely sure what I was thinking when I picked it; I had a short discussion about the sexism of that kanji with a friend from my Japanese class last semester. Makes me feel incredibly dumb. geishaboy My suggestions would be; 平和 heiwa - This means peace, in a "Gods in his heaven, all is right with world" kind of peace, not a peace and quiet kind of peace 幸福 koufuku - This means happiness and blessedness, it has the connotations of being completely content in your soul, the world and in the home Even though I have given you those examples, and I'm quite confident they have a nice ring to them, you should still get them checked out by a Japanese person if possible I just wanted to thank you again. I greatly appreciate the effort you've put into helping me; it's been far more than I expected or even hoped to receive. I believe she's going to go with 平和, and I'll finish the design for her before I go back. I figure I can ask my professor once I'm at school, just to double-check, but this way she can at least have a somewhat final idea as to what everything would look like. Thank you very much!! No problem!
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Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2007 10:37 pm
Anata I don't appreciate your rude response. You could have easily said everything you did without being so condescending. Yeah, I could have been nicer, and maybe it was a bit over the top. But you managed to hit a number of my pet peeves all in one post, and I wasn't in a very patient mood. I'm just amazed that there's still anyone who thinks getting a tattoo in Chinese characters is a good idea. Looking at it in reverse, the number of T-shirts I've seen in China and Japan with slogans written in "English"... the vast majority of them are gobbledegook, and they look ridiculous. And that's just a T-shirt, at least you can take it off. Tattoos are still seen as a yakuza thing in Japan, so you don't see them much, and I haven't seen any with English words - I can only imagine how cringeworthy that would look. The whole "English is cool" thing they've got going here just seems so dumb to me, so I can understand how silly kanji tattoos would look to a Japanese person. But of course it's her choice. At least you're taking some care with the meaning, so kudos for that. I'll shut up now, as you were...
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