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I personally don't agree with homosexuality, but I'm not going to interfere with others if they are. While I don't think it's right, it is equally wrong to force somebody to be something that they are not.

I'm a little biased, though; I have a good friend who is gay.

*don't kill me p.q*

My rabbi gave us a speech about it and he is strongly against it. He says that the "accepting" of homosexual couples should be stamped out. As for accepting a homosexual couple into the congregation? Excuse me, but that is mishkav zahor, and it's CLEARLY stated in the tora as sin (arayot are one of the 3 sins that one must die for). So no, I can't say I would accept someone who openly states that he engages in homosexual acts.

People who are homosexual don't nessecarily have to engage in those acts, and that is why I would accept them into the congergation as long as they don't... you know... anyways, I am strongly against homosexuals that engage in homosexual acts ONLY, not all of homosexuals...

"theres not many of us left"? what do you mean by that?

"don't want to make more enemies"? rofl thank you, that made my night.

Again, your bluntness ceases to amaze me xd

But my point is, who are we to say can be together or not? We're not g-ds for a reason. You also missed kia's point- you don't choose to be homosexual or not- you just are. You can't exactly change that, either.

... so you are ok with gay people as long as they don't have sex?

-.- this is soo stupid

i just think you should deal with it nothing really that wrong with it

i mean there is enough things out there to waist your time hating, why hate people that just love eachother

i mean if you all found out i was lesbian would it affect the way you think of me?

what is there to understand yoni it's not that hard

crying sad crying sad

Thats not what I meant... this just turned into missunderstanding.com (not a real link)

*clears throat and drinks glass of water*

Before I begin, I would like to state we are all friends and this argument is only for the sake of the discussion... 3nodding . So please, no anger is meant to be aroused, thank you blaugh heart !

Let's just make something clear, the torah doesn't say anything about lesbians... only males sex is mentioned.

All I am saying here on this thread is what I learned as halaha. My previous post was NOT my personal view, I was only trying to point out what the torah and my rav had to say about it... Now, since I feel many people missunderstood me, or I miss understood them, here are my responses to all of you...



Indeed, there is no difference between asking a heterosexual couple and a homosexual couple not engage in sex as long as the torah doesn't come into view. But the torah has something to say about it- two males engaging in sex is prohibited. I wouldn't expect anyone to say it's fine to transgress the torah. If the torah says we have to refrain from it, we don't do it, end of discussion, no matter how hard it is. I don't think you'll find an orthodox rabbi that permits homosexual marriages...

Okay, so my friend is homosexual? Okay by me! But according to the tora? Two males having sex is AGAINST the torah. It's not that I have anything against them, all I'm saying is that it's against the torah, and therefore, I wouldn't be so quick in letting them join a jewish congregation.

I actually have a 24 year old friend who is homosexual (not bi), he is a fine yougn man, married to a woman with 2 kids. He just holds back from his drive to have sex with a male... he says that hashem is testing him or something like that.



Having sex with the same gender, on the other hand, is a choice- a choice that the torah forbids. It's not that a human can't live without having sex with the gender he/she is attracted to (or without sex at all). G-d does not test one with something he can't do.

Again, I don't have anything against the fact that they were created homosexual, I'm only saying there is a problem with it in the torah... their sexuality does NOT, I repeat, does NOT change my view on the person himself. They are all fine by me 3nodding blaugh .

So why did g-d create homosexuals? Well... Just an idea, but maybe g-d made homosexuals as a test for their neshama? Maybe in the previous gilgul they had some sort of problem with arayot so g-d sent them back down to attone for it? In any case, g-d obviously has a reason, but unfotunately, we don't know it crying .



crying

Argh... Yvette... I didn't mean it that way sad .

I didn't say I dislike homo's, and I don't have any problem with them at all... I'm only saying two males having sex is against the torah, so accepting them to a congregation would be a problem... It definately would not change my view on anyone's personality though!... When I say that there is a problem with accepting them, I meant that there would be a problem with accepting a homosexual THAT ENGAGES IN HOMOSEXUAL ACTS into a jewish congregation, but I definately would accept one as a friend! It's not that I have anything against them confused . Being homosexual doesn't make them a horrible person in my eyes... why did you have to see it that way? crying

And again, the torah doesn't say anything about lesbians... only males sex is mentioned. So even if you were lesbian, Yvette, I wouldn't have any problem whatsoever in the torah view 3nodding heart .

Please people, there is no stereo-typing here, I am only bringing up the HALAHA.

I'm glad you understand what I meant now sweatdrop 3nodding

Well if you'd wanna freak out, then you'd have to wait in line smile . My rabbi has pissed off a large amount of people... If you search under google you'll find he was behind the ban on "shitat harizuot" (basically preventing a disaster), he sure did freak out alot of people on the way xp . But he really is a good rabbi, he just... goes alittle extreem sometimes rolleyes ...