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| Who did cloud like |
| Tifa |
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47% |
[ 118 ] |
| Aries |
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50% |
[ 125 ] |
| Yuffie |
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2% |
[ 6 ] |
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| Total Votes : 249 |
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 Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 5:05 pm
I personally think it was aeris only because in the game once he met her her always followed her around and even in other games cloud was in like KH he was "looking" for her...
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Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 3:45 pm
Cloud prefered Aeris crying , but, if his spikey a** had any sense he would have chose Tifa! scream
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Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 4:00 pm
Quoting my infamous CloudXAeris post.
1. Cloud and Tifa were close childhood friends.
~ False. Tifa clearly states during the Lifestream Event that she and Cloud didn’t know one another very well as children.
And so:
One of the common arguments used against Cloud and Aerith being the true couple of Final Fantasy VII is the idea that they have less time together than Cloud and Tifa. An analysis of the script found at Comparing Cloud’s Affection for Aerith and Tifa shows that Cloud has approximately the same number of non-optional interactions during the course of Final Fantasy VII with both Aerith and Tifa. The same analysis also reveals that even though Cloud spends the same number of non-optional scenes alone with Aerith as he does with Tifa, he only speaks with Tifa twice during two of those scenes alone with her.
The Lifestream Event also reveals that Cloud and Tifa did not know one another well as children, which means that Cloud and Tifa were actually just getting to know one another at the beginning of the game. As children, Tifa had a separate group of friends, a three-some, who would not allow Cloud into the group. Cloud only used to look up at Tifa’s window from outside.
After Tifa’s accident at the bridge in the mountains, Cloud felt that she blamed him and hated him for what happened, which implies that they were estranged even further. Cloud wouldn’t feel that Tifa blamed him and hated him if their relationship was close. Tifa even mentions that Cloud’s invitation to meet him at the well surprised her because it was so sudden, which implies that they spent little time together. The fact that they weren’t close as children is clearly indicated in the following dialogue from the Lifestream event:
Young Cloud "Tifa... did you forget... about those days?"
Tifa "Look... I..."
Tifa "I'm sorry... But what are you talking about?"
Young Cloud "No... it's all right. You were having a hard time back then."
Young Cloud "You were so busy with your own things, it's only natural you don't remember me back then."
Tifa "'Back then'?"
Tifa "My room?"
Young Cloud "It was my first time there."
Tifa "Was... it?"
Young Cloud "I only used to look up at it from outside."
Tifa "Was that the first day you came into my room?"
Tifa "...that's right. We lived next to each other. But I really didn't know you that well."
Tifa "I've known you since we were children and I always thought we were close..."
Tifa "Now that you mention it... I don't recall you ever being in my room..."
Young Cloud "Tifa always used to be with this three-some."
Tifa "...That's right."
Young Cloud "You were all childish, laughing at every little stupid thing."
Tifa "But we were children, back then."
Young Cloud "...I know. I'm the one that was stupid. I really wanted to play with everyone, but I was never allowed into the group."
Young Cloud "Then later... I began to think I was different... That I was different from those immature kids."
Young Cloud "That then... maybe..."
(A double of the adult Cloud stands, and then it speaks.)
"Just maybe, they would invite me in."
"I thought that might happen, so I hung around..."
(The double speaks again.)
"That night I called Tifa out to the well... I thought to myself Tifa would never come, that she hated me."
Tifa "Yeah... it was so sudden. I was... a bit surprised."
(She turns to face Young Cloud.)
Tifa "But... It's true that we weren't THAT close, but..."
From these passages in the Lifestream event, it’s obvious that Cloud and Tifa were not close as children. Tifa even says, “We lived next to each other. But I really didn't know you that well." This passage from the Lifestream event conclusively shows that Tifa and Cloud were not even close friends as children, and that Cloud only had a crush on her from afar. Therefore, Cloud’s past feelings for Tifa were not based on an actual relationship with her.
Since Cloud and Tifa were not close as children, an actual relationship between them began shortly before the beginning of Final Fantasy VII when Tifa asked Cloud to join AVALANCHE. Tifa essentially remains a background character in Disk One, which is indicated by the relatively low amount of interaction between Cloud and Tifa for that period of time. This is all fully documented in the analysis at Comparing Cloud’s Affection for Aerith and Tifa. Since the total number of non-optional interactions between Cloud and both women are nearly equivalent, this shows that Aerith and Tifa basically receive the same amount of focus in Cloud’s life during the course of the game. Therefore, the idea that Cloud and Tifa have a longer period of time together than Cloud and Aerith is actually false
One of the most common things is that people say Aeris didn't know the REAL Cloud. WRONG!!!!!! Or, that she loved Cloud because of Zach. WRONG!
Proof? Zack was more of an outgoing and caring character when you see him in the few scenes of Nibelheim and when he and Cloud escape to Midgar on the truck. Zack, for example, directly gave friendship to Cloud in which Zack talked to him, kind of joked with him, and helped him when Cloud was hurt (Escape from Nibelheim Sequence). Cloud's character is one completely different from that shown by Zack. Cloud, when the player first meets him in the beginning of the game, is perceived as a cold, antisocial, and uncaring person who only wants money and worries about the well-being of no one.
On the other hand, Zack is described by Aerith in Gongaga as being and I quote her in saying, "he loved women, a real ladies man." Cloud seems to be particularly uninterested in this specific area which can be shown from his less than enthusiastic responses to his mother's discussion concerning him getting a girlfriend in his flashback of the visit he had with her in Nibelheim.
As shown in the truck on the way to Nibeheim in the Kalm flashback sequence, Zack was talkative and caring asking how everyone was doing and if Cloud was alright with his motion sickness. Cloud in the beginning of the game basically only says what needs to be and holds a overall, "I don't care" and "It's not my problem" attitude.
If ANYTHING what only can be seen is that Cloud and Zack's person-alities are almost completely contrasting. Cloud and Zack's personalities are in no way anything alike when compared with what information is given to us in the game. So then it can be concluded that the only thing that Cloud has inherited from Zack was some of his memories and gestures as well. The real reason that most people see Cloud before he "finds himself" in the Lifestream as the "fake" Cloud is because some of his memories are mixed up and confused.
This in itself brings up an interesting topic, that being does the past really make us who we are? This can be answered more by opinion, yet the answer to this question doesn't quite address the real issue. This issue being that just because Cloud did not know the truth about a certain part of his past does that mean he was truly incapable of loving another.
Remember that Cloud only had a certain part of his past mixed up, that being the Nibelheim experience five years ago and his involvement in SOLDIER. Cloud remembered that he was born in Nibelheim and not Gongaga, like Zack was. Cloud also remembered bits and pieces of some conversations he had with his mother in Nibelheim as well as a lengthy letter that he read in Tifa’s room word per word.
Because of this I fail to see how Cloud's past in SOLDIER and the Nibelheim incident five years ago can affect Cloud’s relationship with Aerith. This was the past which had nothing to do with Aerith, she was the present. Tifa however was a part of this mixed up past. If that in itself holds a deeper meaning who's to say, that's more of the gamer's opinion.
Now.. some say she's dead so hah. Well I got something for you and big, fat, ugly NO!
The whole speculation about the love triangle in Final Fantasy VII often makes one lose sight of what it and the whole of the game comprises: the theme of Life. While this fact has been known long before the game’s inception, few have actually addressed the exact nature of Final Fantasy VII’s primary theme. The love triangle itself in Final Fantasy VII can be useful in understanding its theme of life, and vice-versa.
Just as there are many paths to a single destination in the ending of Final Fantasy VII, so it is in the actual game - with a twist. Final Fantasy VII is wrought with teasing, confounding lines that hint as much at a certain possibility as they detract from it. One can have Cloud act jealous and envious towards Aerith’s old boyfriend - but one can just as easily give her the cold shoulder on the issue. One can label Tifa as Cloud’s girlfriend right away in the game - but one can just as easily deny it with vehemence. One can have Cloud go on a romantic, magical date with Aerith at the Gold Saucer - but they can have him do so with a number of questionable others, as well as mess up the event entirely. And one can enact a touching and highly suggestive scene between Cloud and Tifa in the form of ‘Last Night under the Highwind’, while another can enact that scene in a brotherly and perfectly platonic way. And it comes as a result in the end that there is not just one, but two destinations for Cloud in the matter of the love triangle. However, according to Final Fantasy VII’s theme of Life, only ONE of them is correct.
Tifa, on the other hand, is shown to be better for Cloud on a platonic level. On that level, Tifa helps him upon his first bewildered arrival into Midgar, fights with him for the planet, and helps him find himself in the Lifestream. In settings involving his heart, however, despite her intentions she ends up hurting Cloud deeply each time. She never noticed his unrequited love as a child, and he ended up humiliating and torturing himself as a result. She hid his past from him to protect him, and instead contributed to his fall and the rise of Meteor. In Cloud’s life, one thing is certain: in any relationship other than a platonic one, Tifa is bad for Cloud.
Which brings us again back full circle to the theme of Life. In Cloud’s life, regardless of who he chooses, Aerith is shown to be better than Tifa. Everything would point to their being the perfect couple. The only factor that denies the possibility is the untimely murder of the woman herself.
Or does it?
The love triangle in Final Fantasy VII is basically a mirror for the choices in Life itself. After all, although Cloud is thrust into glorious and often fantastical situations, the love situation depicted is just as typical (and just as stupefying) as one we ourselves would encounter. And as has been shown, Aerith is virtually the perfect woman for Cloud. She however, is perceived as unattainable. Tifa, conversely, is the cause of Cloud’s suffering and has never known him as he truly is. She, however, is completely within reach.
And now the great choice of Life, the theme of Final Fantasy VII is revealed: Pragmatism versus Idealism.
In Life, the pragmatist will make the sensible choices, choosing to opt out of dreams simply because they are unreasonable (hence Tifa). The idealist, on the other hand, strives to attain the ultimate result in Life (hence Aerith). The idealist may be much more likely to fail, but the potential rewards that it offers are too much to ignore. We are reminded:
“We are only given one life to live. Remember, when appropriate,
to live it.”
Pragmatism is a paradox. It presumes to be the most sensible and logical way to live one’s life, yet results in being completely unsatisfying in every conceivable way. Why? Because among other things, pragmatism cannot sustain one because it intentionally shortchanges the pragmatist. The pragmatist can never attain everything that Life has to offer. Just as if Cloud chooses Tifa, he will never attain everything that Life and love have to offer.
But if Cloud becomes the idealist, if Cloud dares to love Aerith, despite the risks in doing so, regardless of whether she is alive or dead, and his love is constant beyond death, then his love is ultimately more cherishable than anything that he could ever have with Tifa.
The ultimate problem of Life: does one consign oneself to the ordinary vision of the status quo, or does one risk everything in order to attain the highest form of the self? In Final Fantasy VII, the answer is obvious. Taking the easy answers in pragmatism is not an option, for it embodies Life at a standstill. That is what the Shinra and the corporate pragmatists of our world do. Only idealism, according to Final Fantasy VII, can save mankind from itself, before our Holy in the form of Nature itself relieves us.
The theme of Life in Final Fantasy VII encompasses all of its virtues. And it has an end. Through the betterment of mankind and the fight for an ideal world, Life itself becomes a Fairy Tale.
Subsequently, so does its love story. The ideal search embodied in the love of Cloud and Aerith continues to live on in lore, from outlandish fanfiction tales of resurrection to actual representation of their ongoing search for love in games such as Final Fantasy Tactics and Kingdom Hearts. If anything, this proves that at the end of it all, Cloud is with his Aerith in spirit, if not in body.
And in Final Fantasy VII, this is revealed to be the only thing that matters.
So?
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Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 4:08 pm
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Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 7:35 pm
I think he likes Aeris but I personally think it would be romantic if he went with Tifa seeing that they are close but he really doesn't have any other options anyway since Aeris is dead and not much clues with Yuffie. sweatdrop
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Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 8:36 pm
ya wow. aeris all the way. she's da bomb. tifa = friend.
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Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 9:39 pm
StrawberrieIceCream Like Amylin had said (and explained quite well in a previous thread) before, Aeris and Cloud are more likely to have gotten together. This does not entirely rule out Tifa, but Cloud and Tifa had a more platonic relationship with one another. Cloud may have adored her as a child, but things changed when they grew up. Tifa doesn't seem to love him as much as she seems to worry about him. Cloud probably wouldn't have ever gotten with Yuffie, mostly because of how both of their personalities seem to clash. I've got nothing against CloudxYuffie fans out there, but the two just don't click in the game. He's too much of a smart aleck to her anyways. ***Gold Saucer Date w/ Cloud and Yuffie*** Yuffie: Just say something! Cloud: ...something... ~The screen darkens, and you can hear Yuffie slap Cloud~ ***End Date*** It's not impossible, but it's not likely to happen, either. Ditto! 3nodding I did notice that most of the guys who responded in this forum think it's Tifa that Cloud likes. I think she's what most guys like for Cloud. Tifa after all is pretty, strong (she's kick-a** with her fists as compared to Aeris and her weapon of choice), and does she have big bumpers (ahem. 'scuse me mrgreen )!!! But if you look at it objectively, Cloud's mind is always on Aeris till the very end, even with the CGI movie (never mind that it's because of Aeris that the lifestream came to be, he's still thinking of her). 3nodding
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Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 11:27 pm
Definitely, thank you for quoting that Miss Aeris Gainsborough. Very thorough! 3nodding
Now, just because the idea's struck me, I'm about to go into some unsafe territories here that are a tad off topic, so careful everybody. *grabs Cid's goggles and puts them over her eyes while tightening Vincent's cape (borrowed without asking) around herself before making the dive*
FANFICTION.
Now, fanfiction is interesting, because everything a fan ever wished to have happened, whether it's Tifa and Cloud getting all hot and steamy in the chocobo stable or Sephiroth becoming the real hero of the game while Cloud and Co. are the real villians, can come true, in a sense. It's an outlet of creativity, and there's nothing wrong with fanfictions. Well, except for one thing... THEY'RE INACCURATE. Many a time have I come across a fic that said that Cloud and Tifa were the bestest buddies in the whole freakin' world when they obviously weren't. I've also come across those that feel that they must portray either Tifa or Aeris as a villian of sorts, as some sort of jealous b***h, to make their story work. Now, fanfiction is great and all, but barely any of it is accurate and in character. Tifa and Aeris would NEVER be horrible to one another, because they were friends in the game. Sure, there are some well written Cloti's out there (Cloud and Tifa pairing), but how often is it that you come across one that uses actual information from the game to back up the pairing? How many times in a Cloris (Cloud and Aeris) fanfic is the relationship portrayed realistically?
None. There are a few gems out there that are good, but the usual trend (especially nowadays) is that either Aeris gets revived or Tifa goes with some other guy (usually Vincent, Reno, Rufus, and Rude, in that order). I like fanfiction and all, but the fact that people will CLAIM that something in their fanfic is true (which it usually isn't, depending on the fic) then it sets me off. eek Either way, the relationship isn't true to what the characters are supposed to act like. Cloud is portrayed as an a*****e, Tifa is portrayed as a conniving whore, and Aeris is portrayed as a two-timing villianess. Misconceptions of the truth, false hopes, and bad spelling and grammar are usually what makes up many fanfics out there. *looks at Fanfiction.Net* Then again, that could be due to the lack of quality control. sweatdrop So, if there's nothing wrong with fanfiction, with the good, bad, and ugly considered, then why am I complaining about it?
People read the fanfiction, and they keep reading it because they like it. Then, eventually, these people begin to cite parts of the fanfiction to support their arguments, and begin to slowly forget what was actually in the game. That, or because a fanfic contains was the reader wants, the reader will continue to believe in something, until they become convinced that it's a fact, even when it isn't.
There are some damn good fanfics out there, but very few of them, if any, actually portray Cloud, Tifa, and Aeris' love triangle relationship in a manner that keeps all the characters "in character."
Sorry, just had to get that out of my system. Fanfics are still good, but don't use them as a basis for an argument.
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Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 8:01 am
StrawberrieIceCream Definitely, thank you for quoting that Miss Aeris Gainsborough. Very thorough! 3nodding Now, just because the idea's struck me, I'm about to go into some unsafe territories here that are a tad off topic, so careful everybody. *grabs Cid's goggles and puts them over her eyes while tightening Vincent's cape (borrowed without asking) around herself before making the dive* FANFICTION. Now, fanfiction is interesting, because everything a fan ever wished to have happened, whether it's Tifa and Cloud getting all hot and steamy in the chocobo stable or Sephiroth becoming the real hero of the game while Cloud and Co. are the real villians, can come true, in a sense. It's an outlet of creativity, and there's nothing wrong with fanfictions. Well, except for one thing... THEY'RE INACCURATE. Many a time have I come across a fic that said that Cloud and Tifa were the bestest buddies in the whole freakin' world when they obviously weren't. I've also come across those that feel that they must portray either Tifa or Aeris as a villian of sorts, as some sort of jealous b***h, to make their story work. Now, fanfiction is great and all, but barely any of it is accurate and in character. Tifa and Aeris would NEVER be horrible to one another, because they were friends in the game. Sure, there are some well written Cloti's out there (Cloud and Tifa pairing), but how often is it that you come across one that uses actual information from the game to back up the pairing? How many times in a Cloris (Cloud and Aeris) fanfic is the relationship portrayed realistically? None. There are a few gems out there that are good, but the usual trend (especially nowadays) is that either Aeris gets revived or Tifa goes with some other guy (usually Vincent, Reno, Rufus, and Rude, in that order). I like fanfiction and all, but the fact that people will CLAIM that something in their fanfic is true (which it usually isn't, depending on the fic) then it sets me off. eek Either way, the relationship isn't true to what the characters are supposed to act like. Cloud is portrayed as an a*****e, Tifa is portrayed as a conniving whore, and Aeris is portrayed as a two-timing villianess. Misconceptions of the truth, false hopes, and bad spelling and grammar are usually what makes up many fanfics out there. *looks at Fanfiction.Net* Then again, that could be due to the lack of quality control. sweatdrop So, if there's nothing wrong with fanfiction, with the good, bad, and ugly considered, then why am I complaining about it? People read the fanfiction, and they keep reading it because they like it. Then, eventually, these people begin to cite parts of the fanfiction to support their arguments, and begin to slowly forget what was actually in the game. That, or because a fanfic contains was the reader wants, the reader will continue to believe in something, until they become convinced that it's a fact, even when it isn't. There are some damn good fanfics out there, but very few of them, if any, actually portray Cloud, Tifa, and Aeris' love triangle relationship in a manner that keeps all the characters "in character." Sorry, just had to get that out of my system. Fanfics are still good, but don't use them as a basis for an argument. ::back from hospital early:: HERE HERE!! I see this happen quite frequently myself. Once in a blue moon I come across a fanfiction that portrays the story accuratly. Hell, even in novels that attempted to sight the game word for word. Usually it starts fine and then the bias come rolling in. Like a blue moon though an accurate and possible fanfiction does happen. ::pulls out a fanfiction on Vincent's views of the journey, a Cloti fanfic, a fanfic on JENOVA infecting the Cetra, a rewrite of the game on if Zack had lived (considering its an AU its pretty damn close), and a fanfic on the son of Tifa(well, this was considered accurate until AC was released.... Cloud's dead in this fic.):: Now, considering the uber amounts of fanfiction that I've read these are few and far in between... but it's nice to know that people are trying.
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Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 12:42 pm
I think that's cloud loves tifa..... But, I think that it was a boring bound sweatdrop
Aeris was a little better! But cloud doesn't really looks like he loves her....
And yuffie was totally come of no-where in that! blaugh heart But that's was my favorite!
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Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 3:54 pm
Miss Aeris Gainsborough
The whole speculation about the love triangle in Final Fantasy VII often makes one lose sight of what it and the whole of the game comprises: the theme of Life. While this fact has been known long before the game’s inception, few have actually addressed the exact nature of Final Fantasy VII’s primary theme. The love triangle itself in Final Fantasy VII can be useful in understanding its theme of life, and vice-versa.
...it comes as a result in the end that there is not just one, but two destinations for Cloud in the matter of the love triangle. However, according to Final Fantasy VII’s theme of Life, only ONE of them is correct.
...
The love triangle in Final Fantasy VII is basically a mirror for the choices in Life itself. After all, although Cloud is thrust into glorious and often fantastical situations, the love situation depicted is just as typical (and just as stupefying) as one we ourselves would encounter. And as has been shown, Aerith is virtually the perfect woman for Cloud. She however, is perceived as unattainable. Tifa, conversely, is the cause of Cloud’s suffering and has never known him as he truly is. She, however, is completely within reach.
And now the great choice of Life, the theme of Final Fantasy VII is revealed: Pragmatism versus Idealism.
In Life, the pragmatist will make the sensible choices, choosing to opt out of dreams simply because they are unreasonable (hence Tifa). The idealist, on the other hand, strives to attain the ultimate result in Life (hence Aerith). The idealist may be much more likely to fail, but the potential rewards that it offers are too much to ignore. We are reminded:
“We are only given one life to live. Remember, when appropriate,
to live it.”
Pragmatism is a paradox. It presumes to be the most sensible and logical way to live one’s life, yet results in being completely unsatisfying in every conceivable way. Why? Because among other things, pragmatism cannot sustain one because it intentionally shortchanges the pragmatist. The pragmatist can never attain everything that Life has to offer. Just as if Cloud chooses Tifa, he will never attain everything that Life and love have to offer.
But if Cloud becomes the idealist, if Cloud dares to love Aerith, despite the risks in doing so, regardless of whether she is alive or dead, and his love is constant beyond death, then his love is ultimately more cherishable than anything that he could ever have with Tifa.
The ultimate problem of Life: does one consign oneself to the ordinary vision of the status quo, or does one risk everything in order to attain the highest form of the self? In Final Fantasy VII, the answer is obvious. Taking the easy answers in pragmatism is not an option, for it embodies Life at a standstill. That is what the Shinra and the corporate pragmatists of our world do. Only idealism, according to Final Fantasy VII, can save mankind from itself, before our Holy in the form of Nature itself relieves us.
The theme of Life in Final Fantasy VII encompasses all of its virtues. And it has an end. Through the betterment of mankind and the fight for an ideal world, Life itself becomes a Fairy Tale.
Subsequently, so does its love story. The ideal search embodied in the love of Cloud and Aerith continues to live on in lore, from outlandish fanfiction tales of resurrection to actual representation of their ongoing search for love in games such as Final Fantasy Tactics and Kingdom Hearts. If anything, this proves that at the end of it all, Cloud is with his Aerith in spirit, if not in body.
And in Final Fantasy VII, this is revealed to be the only thing that matters.
So?Y'know, I was totally uninterested in the love triangle, until you put it that way. Thanks for appealing to my romanticist sensibilites.
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Posted: Wed Jun 15, 2005 10:36 am
Miss Aeris Gainsborough Quoting my infamous CloudXAeris post.
1. Cloud and Tifa were close childhood friends.
~ False. Tifa clearly states during the Lifestream Event that she and Cloud didn’t know one another very well as children.
And so:
One of the common arguments used against Cloud and Aerith being the true couple of Final Fantasy VII is the idea that they have less time together than Cloud and Tifa. An analysis of the script found at Comparing Cloud’s Affection for Aerith and Tifa shows that Cloud has approximately the same number of non-optional interactions during the course of Final Fantasy VII with both Aerith and Tifa. The same analysis also reveals that even though Cloud spends the same number of non-optional scenes alone with Aerith as he does with Tifa, he only speaks with Tifa twice during two of those scenes alone with her.
The Lifestream Event also reveals that Cloud and Tifa did not know one another well as children, which means that Cloud and Tifa were actually just getting to know one another at the beginning of the game. As children, Tifa had a separate group of friends, a three-some, who would not allow Cloud into the group. Cloud only used to look up at Tifa’s window from outside.
After Tifa’s accident at the bridge in the mountains, Cloud felt that she blamed him and hated him for what happened, which implies that they were estranged even further. Cloud wouldn’t feel that Tifa blamed him and hated him if their relationship was close. Tifa even mentions that Cloud’s invitation to meet him at the well surprised her because it was so sudden, which implies that they spent little time together. The fact that they weren’t close as children is clearly indicated in the following dialogue from the Lifestream event:
Young Cloud "Tifa... did you forget... about those days?"
Tifa "Look... I..."
Tifa "I'm sorry... But what are you talking about?"
Young Cloud "No... it's all right. You were having a hard time back then."
Young Cloud "You were so busy with your own things, it's only natural you don't remember me back then."
Tifa "'Back then'?"
Tifa "My room?"
Young Cloud "It was my first time there."
Tifa "Was... it?"
Young Cloud "I only used to look up at it from outside."
Tifa "Was that the first day you came into my room?"
Tifa "...that's right. We lived next to each other. But I really didn't know you that well."
Tifa "I've known you since we were children and I always thought we were close..."
Tifa "Now that you mention it... I don't recall you ever being in my room..."
Young Cloud "Tifa always used to be with this three-some."
Tifa "...That's right."
Young Cloud "You were all childish, laughing at every little stupid thing."
Tifa "But we were children, back then."
Young Cloud "...I know. I'm the one that was stupid. I really wanted to play with everyone, but I was never allowed into the group."
Young Cloud "Then later... I began to think I was different... That I was different from those immature kids."
Young Cloud "That then... maybe..."
(A double of the adult Cloud stands, and then it speaks.)
"Just maybe, they would invite me in."
"I thought that might happen, so I hung around..."
(The double speaks again.)
"That night I called Tifa out to the well... I thought to myself Tifa would never come, that she hated me."
Tifa "Yeah... it was so sudden. I was... a bit surprised."
(She turns to face Young Cloud.)
Tifa "But... It's true that we weren't THAT close, but..."
From these passages in the Lifestream event, it’s obvious that Cloud and Tifa were not close as children. Tifa even says, “We lived next to each other. But I really didn't know you that well." This passage from the Lifestream event conclusively shows that Tifa and Cloud were not even close friends as children, and that Cloud only had a crush on her from afar. Therefore, Cloud’s past feelings for Tifa were not based on an actual relationship with her.
Since Cloud and Tifa were not close as children, an actual relationship between them began shortly before the beginning of Final Fantasy VII when Tifa asked Cloud to join AVALANCHE. Tifa essentially remains a background character in Disk One, which is indicated by the relatively low amount of interaction between Cloud and Tifa for that period of time. This is all fully documented in the analysis at Comparing Cloud’s Affection for Aerith and Tifa. Since the total number of non-optional interactions between Cloud and both women are nearly equivalent, this shows that Aerith and Tifa basically receive the same amount of focus in Cloud’s life during the course of the game. Therefore, the idea that Cloud and Tifa have a longer period of time together than Cloud and Aerith is actually false
One of the most common things is that people say Aeris didn't know the REAL Cloud. WRONG!!!!!! Or, that she loved Cloud because of Zach. WRONG!
Proof? Zack was more of an outgoing and caring character when you see him in the few scenes of Nibelheim and when he and Cloud escape to Midgar on the truck. Zack, for example, directly gave friendship to Cloud in which Zack talked to him, kind of joked with him, and helped him when Cloud was hurt (Escape from Nibelheim Sequence). Cloud's character is one completely different from that shown by Zack. Cloud, when the player first meets him in the beginning of the game, is perceived as a cold, antisocial, and uncaring person who only wants money and worries about the well-being of no one.
On the other hand, Zack is described by Aerith in Gongaga as being and I quote her in saying, "he loved women, a real ladies man." Cloud seems to be particularly uninterested in this specific area which can be shown from his less than enthusiastic responses to his mother's discussion concerning him getting a girlfriend in his flashback of the visit he had with her in Nibelheim.
As shown in the truck on the way to Nibeheim in the Kalm flashback sequence, Zack was talkative and caring asking how everyone was doing and if Cloud was alright with his motion sickness. Cloud in the beginning of the game basically only says what needs to be and holds a overall, "I don't care" and "It's not my problem" attitude.
If ANYTHING what only can be seen is that Cloud and Zack's person-alities are almost completely contrasting. Cloud and Zack's personalities are in no way anything alike when compared with what information is given to us in the game. So then it can be concluded that the only thing that Cloud has inherited from Zack was some of his memories and gestures as well. The real reason that most people see Cloud before he "finds himself" in the Lifestream as the "fake" Cloud is because some of his memories are mixed up and confused.
This in itself brings up an interesting topic, that being does the past really make us who we are? This can be answered more by opinion, yet the answer to this question doesn't quite address the real issue. This issue being that just because Cloud did not know the truth about a certain part of his past does that mean he was truly incapable of loving another.
Remember that Cloud only had a certain part of his past mixed up, that being the Nibelheim experience five years ago and his involvement in SOLDIER. Cloud remembered that he was born in Nibelheim and not Gongaga, like Zack was. Cloud also remembered bits and pieces of some conversations he had with his mother in Nibelheim as well as a lengthy letter that he read in Tifa’s room word per word.
Because of this I fail to see how Cloud's past in SOLDIER and the Nibelheim incident five years ago can affect Cloud’s relationship with Aerith. This was the past which had nothing to do with Aerith, she was the present. Tifa however was a part of this mixed up past. If that in itself holds a deeper meaning who's to say, that's more of the gamer's opinion.
Now.. some say she's dead so hah. Well I got something for you and big, fat, ugly NO!
The whole speculation about the love triangle in Final Fantasy VII often makes one lose sight of what it and the whole of the game comprises: the theme of Life. While this fact has been known long before the game’s inception, few have actually addressed the exact nature of Final Fantasy VII’s primary theme. The love triangle itself in Final Fantasy VII can be useful in understanding its theme of life, and vice-versa.
Just as there are many paths to a single destination in the ending of Final Fantasy VII, so it is in the actual game - with a twist. Final Fantasy VII is wrought with teasing, confounding lines that hint as much at a certain possibility as they detract from it. One can have Cloud act jealous and envious towards Aerith’s old boyfriend - but one can just as easily give her the cold shoulder on the issue. One can label Tifa as Cloud’s girlfriend right away in the game - but one can just as easily deny it with vehemence. One can have Cloud go on a romantic, magical date with Aerith at the Gold Saucer - but they can have him do so with a number of questionable others, as well as mess up the event entirely. And one can enact a touching and highly suggestive scene between Cloud and Tifa in the form of ‘Last Night under the Highwind’, while another can enact that scene in a brotherly and perfectly platonic way. And it comes as a result in the end that there is not just one, but two destinations for Cloud in the matter of the love triangle. However, according to Final Fantasy VII’s theme of Life, only ONE of them is correct.
Tifa, on the other hand, is shown to be better for Cloud on a platonic level. On that level, Tifa helps him upon his first bewildered arrival into Midgar, fights with him for the planet, and helps him find himself in the Lifestream. In settings involving his heart, however, despite her intentions she ends up hurting Cloud deeply each time. She never noticed his unrequited love as a child, and he ended up humiliating and torturing himself as a result. She hid his past from him to protect him, and instead contributed to his fall and the rise of Meteor. In Cloud’s life, one thing is certain: in any relationship other than a platonic one, Tifa is bad for Cloud.
Which brings us again back full circle to the theme of Life. In Cloud’s life, regardless of who he chooses, Aerith is shown to be better than Tifa. Everything would point to their being the perfect couple. The only factor that denies the possibility is the untimely murder of the woman herself.
Or does it?
The love triangle in Final Fantasy VII is basically a mirror for the choices in Life itself. After all, although Cloud is thrust into glorious and often fantastical situations, the love situation depicted is just as typical (and just as stupefying) as one we ourselves would encounter. And as has been shown, Aerith is virtually the perfect woman for Cloud. She however, is perceived as unattainable. Tifa, conversely, is the cause of Cloud’s suffering and has never known him as he truly is. She, however, is completely within reach.
And now the great choice of Life, the theme of Final Fantasy VII is revealed: Pragmatism versus Idealism.
In Life, the pragmatist will make the sensible choices, choosing to opt out of dreams simply because they are unreasonable (hence Tifa). The idealist, on the other hand, strives to attain the ultimate result in Life (hence Aerith). The idealist may be much more likely to fail, but the potential rewards that it offers are too much to ignore. We are reminded:
“We are only given one life to live. Remember, when appropriate,
to live it.”
Pragmatism is a paradox. It presumes to be the most sensible and logical way to live one’s life, yet results in being completely unsatisfying in every conceivable way. Why? Because among other things, pragmatism cannot sustain one because it intentionally shortchanges the pragmatist. The pragmatist can never attain everything that Life has to offer. Just as if Cloud chooses Tifa, he will never attain everything that Life and love have to offer.
But if Cloud becomes the idealist, if Cloud dares to love Aerith, despite the risks in doing so, regardless of whether she is alive or dead, and his love is constant beyond death, then his love is ultimately more cherishable than anything that he could ever have with Tifa.
The ultimate problem of Life: does one consign oneself to the ordinary vision of the status quo, or does one risk everything in order to attain the highest form of the self? In Final Fantasy VII, the answer is obvious. Taking the easy answers in pragmatism is not an option, for it embodies Life at a standstill. That is what the Shinra and the corporate pragmatists of our world do. Only idealism, according to Final Fantasy VII, can save mankind from itself, before our Holy in the form of Nature itself relieves us.
The theme of Life in Final Fantasy VII encompasses all of its virtues. And it has an end. Through the betterment of mankind and the fight for an ideal world, Life itself becomes a Fairy Tale.
Subsequently, so does its love story. The ideal search embodied in the love of Cloud and Aerith continues to live on in lore, from outlandish fanfiction tales of resurrection to actual representation of their ongoing search for love in games such as Final Fantasy Tactics and Kingdom Hearts. If anything, this proves that at the end of it all, Cloud is with his Aerith in spirit, if not in body.
And in Final Fantasy VII, this is revealed to be the only thing that matters.
So? OMG!!! THANK YOU! I have to constantly re-type that to so many people, I am SO glad someone else knows all that as well.... *sigh of relif*
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Posted: Wed Jun 15, 2005 10:46 am
and just to clear this up for some people Tifa does have big boobs its true, but Aerith has the same size if you actually look, she just doesnt flaunt them like a whore. (sorry all you Tifa fans but it is just my opinion) 
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Posted: Wed Jun 15, 2005 10:53 am
heart she is too cool! heart
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Posted: Thu Jun 16, 2005 10:01 am
he wanted aeris but she died crying
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