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im stuk between areis and tifa ki dont think it wouldnt be yuffie because he didnt have much interrest question

Alright, I keep seeing you use Aeris' death alot in your previous posts, Pink. And in all those cases you use the emotions he shows then as an immediate indicator that he loves Aeris. Well, I think that if someone close to me was taken out and I was unable to do anything about it, Id be kinda emotional about it too, especially if it was someone who I swore to protect. He wouldve shown emotion if any of his comrades who he had spent so much time with up and was killed in front of him. Aeris was just the one that died, so he laid her to rest, but didnt in a way. She remained engraved in his mind because he failed her. He wasnt able to protect her when it mattered most. The guilt of her death followed him for years until he was finally able to let it go because he found out that she didnt blame him.

This same guilt existed in his mind for Zacks death, which wasnt apparent to him until after he became himself again and wasnt even acknowledged earlier in the game. Once he realised that his best friend had been gunned down in front of him, the same feeling of guilt he had for Aeris' death arose for him as well. So Aeris wasnt loved by Cloud just because he showed emotion towards her death and kept her in his thoughts, since the same happened with Zack and Im damn sure Cloud didnt love him. Utilization of Aeris' death as a reason for his loving her is null and void due to the Zack factor, along with the wholesome guilt that is made clear in the prologue of the Dirge of Cerberus strategy guide.

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Next thing on my agena is the affection levels in the game. Aeris has a higher one. Whoopdeedoo. She starts somewhere up in the 60s I believe and all choices that lead to her are boosted in affection stats. This is because Aeris is the character the game is defaulted to for the date scene. Doesnt matter what their totals can be, because one is a boosted character.

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The KH universe is a skewed reality for the FF characters. No facts can be gathered from it. Hell, if facts were gathered from it, the a pixy is looking to be together with a 10yr old boy for the rest of her life, Yuffie changed worlds, Squall really let himself go, and Selphie never grew up. Nothing in those games can even possibly lead to factual evidence to be taken into light in the FF universe.

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Bringing outside references into this debate isnt very professional of you. Squall and Rinoa are like Cloud and Aeris. Ya, well ever think that Rinoa is also part of Tifa? Bet you didnt. The character templates (cant think of the word Im looking for) are the same in all FFs. You always have a warrior, you always have a dominant mage, always have a thief, always have a gunner, always have a stereotype, always have a pilot. Just because characters are alike, doesnt mean that they are the characters. One sets ending doesnt prove that another would turn out the same way.

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Cloud and Tifa in the beginning of the game had a difficult relationship because he wasnt the person that Tifa remembered. Cloud had just pulled out of a barely conscious, amnesiatic state. He didnt even remember that his best friend had just been killed in front of him. How could he be expected to remember a promise made 7 years prior to that? And back in Nibelheim, he was ashamed of himself for not making it into SOLDIER, so he didnt show himself, but he did in the end. He made it clear that he came to save Tifa when he demasked himself inside of he reactor. Tifa ackowledged that he came for her when she was in need, but was losing blood and that can effect what you remember from a certain point. We call that a concussion.

You make it sound like Tifa forced him to believe certain things. She led him to believe something that wasnt true. Well, she didnt. She merely used memories she had and shared with Cloud to talk to him. She didnt force him to believe anything. She talked, Cloud listened, and from what he heard and his minds instability, he shaped his past to the way that would make what he believed about himself fit.

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Ill continue later, but Im finding myself wanting to play Dirge of Cerberus really badly right now.

You know it's really funny that you use that picture as proof because that's from the cleris book of wisdom and guess what that was made by clotif people to show just how stupid the idea of cleris is. They made that with sarcasm written all over it. rofl rofl rofl Oh and by the way the game picture still looks like a clown fish.



Not true in fact most of what you have said in the past about CloudxAeris is your own interpretation of what was said and done between Cloud and Aeris beside the fact that every single factual piece of evidence that you have for CloudxAeris can be countered by factual CloudxTifa evidence. But there is one thing I have that you don’t

Advent Children Reunion Files. These are scans from the official AC Reunion Files. It is a book that you can get with the DVD box set.

On page 14 it says “There are many dimensions to Tifa’s character. She’s like a mother, a sweetheart and a close ally in battle.
(Nomura)

If you read the Japanese version Sweetheart is translated as lover, girlfriend, or romantic interest. If you don’t believe me have the Japanese version translated for yourself.


ok you should know by now that square does everything for a reason did you read what I wrote earlier about the origins of their names? xp
basically what I meant by the flower girl thing is square usually pairs up as opposites if you know what I mean the mage and the warrior[tidus yuna] the mage and the warrior [cloud and aerith] and such

please think about it more deeply than that! ok well in Japan the carp symbolizes courage, strength, and the struggles each boy must encounter
and losing aerith was probably his biggest concern next to saving the planet
also when you think about it as I said once before in AC when sephi asks what is most important to you he sees aerith first and three times more than tifa who is shown after aerith and none of images of tifa are cloud with tifa together this just shows who is most important to cloud

actually I have played both kh and kh2 and if noticed does cloud ever really look for his light in KH2? no because he has already found it. because KH was the time when Cloud was actually searching for his light and by the end of KH when he was reunited with aerith and he found his light no further does he mention looking for his light in KH2 meaning he had already found it so now that he has his light he can go conquer his darkness[sephi] tifa really plays no part in this basically throughout KH2 she is looking for cloud and after sephi and cloud leave she goes looking for them again >> thats it
this makes it even more obvious no?


ok sheesh the point of me talking about the clothing was just showing how square carefully planned out the characters as I've been saying they do everything for a reason her wearing dreary colors is just another symbol meaning that she will not truly happy in love atleast

well when you look closely at the scene when cloud is holding aerith at the altar she is still wearing the ribbon yes so since the ribbon is still there while Cloud is giving his beautiful speech 'they are tied by a ribbon' making them soulmates! also even caitsith says they are!
"This isn't good. I can't say it. Poor Tifa."
"Looks good. You are perfect for each other! Aeris's star and Cloud's star!"
"They show a great future!"
"Cloud, I'll be your matchmaker, preacher..."
"I'll do whatever you want me to! Just call on me when it all happens!" Yep, it looks like Cait Sith believed Cloud and Aerith would wed in the future! ^_^ Don't believe me? Look at the Japanese version of this scene... "Cloud, I'll arrange your marriage, be the host, or a spy, whatever you ask! Just call me then, OK?"

actually you should pay attention to the dialouge yourself and look into things deeper its called reading in between the lines I have been posting this same section a billion times this is cold proof from the game no symbols happy?

Cloud displays more affection toward Aerith than Tifa during the course of FFVII. Cloud interacted with Tifa a total of 261 times during FFVII. He interacted with/remembered Aerith a total of 253 times during the game. Despite the fact that Cloud interacted with these two women approximately the same amount during the course of the game, their affection ratings are much different. This site documents each time Cloud displayed affection for Tifa and Aerith (affection being defined as displays of caring, concern, helpfulness, kindness, support, protection, remembrance, consideration, and personal interest). The total affection rating for Tifa was 84. The total affection rating for Aerith was 166. So, Cloud displayed nearly twice the affection for Aerith despite the fact that he spent approximately the same time focused on each woman.

um I'd like to see this poster you speak of I have seen figures though but their is sephi too with cloud and tifa...hmm I guess that makes a new love triangle surprised heart aha sarcasm

his work is considered offical!Amano still did much of the visual design for FFVII and much of the artwork, even though Nomura's was also used. So, yes, he was involved in FFVII and his artwork is considered official.
also if you have FFIX and you look at the back of the little booklet thing there is amano's drawing of garnet and zidane. so it is offical sheesh!
they are cannon because he was part of SE!

here is the petition xd haha but they closed it
[here]

"There are many dimensions to Tifa’s character. She’s like a mother, a sweetheart and a close ally in battle"
so how does that show that cloud loves her? lol

ooh this is about on the way to a smile
A story from Tifa's point of view, set after Sephiroth was defeated, and before the events of Advent Children. Tifa, Cloud and Barret move to Edge, a new town being constructed just outside of Midgar, and set up a new 7th Heaven as they attempt to build a family life for themselves. After Barret leaves to settle his past, Cloud and Tifa tend to the orphan Denzel and Barret's adopted daughter, Marlene. During the story, Tifa tries hard to maintain a sense of family unity and the concept of a "normal family" itself. She particularly concerns herself with Cloud, as he begins isolating himself from the others as time goes on
so basically it is tifa's PoV so no wonder it may seem like her and Cloud are together >> also barret was living with them so he is part of the family too! and soon after he leaves cloud drifts farther away from them

also did you know that aerith is the favorite in Japan. and dont try to argue that because its true 3nodding

hmmm what else oh! itadaki street!!
Since this is a board game, I don't expect it will shed much light on the "love triangle". However, it is still obvious which pairing is supported in this game. I have seen a shot from this game with a large crowd of characters gathered in an open area. In the middle of this area, Cloud is standing with Aerith while Tifa is standing alone, near the top. XD Also, in the trailers we see Cloud walking with Aerith and Squall walking with Rinoa. Very interesting... ^_^ I was also told, by a friend who is currently playing Itadaki Street, that Cloud and Aerith are shown in the opening of the game and are, in fact, the first Final Fantasy characters shown. I recently downloaded the opening of IS and saw for myself. During the opening, Cloud and Aerith walk together, look at the sky together, and Cloud runs after Aerith when she takes off without him. Tifa is nowhere to be seen. Not only that, but Aerith's Theme makes an appearance in this game. Tifa's Theme does not
here you can see for yourself its on youtube ^^

http://youtube.com/watch?v=oAd-tyvRAs4

lets see... oh!
Aerith and Cloud fit Square's idea of the perfect couple. How do I know this? Just take a look at the other canon couples from FFVIII, FFIX, and FFX

Final Fantasy VIII: Want to see Cloud and Aerith reinvented in another game? Then play FFVIII and take a look at Squall and Rinoa. This pairing is Cloud and Aerith remade. Squall and Rinoa give us a look into what might have happened if Aerith had not died
-Squall is the brooding, dark soldier with a mysterious past. He is very much of an introvert and a loner, never opening up to anyone. Sound familiar? It should, because he acts exactly like Cloud. He even has the same job-- he is a mercenary (Squall was hired to protect and help out Rinoa; Cloud was hired by Aerith to be her bodyguard). Heck, he even carries an oversized weapon and has Limit Breaks that are reminiscent of Cloud's. During the course of the game, Squall begins to open up to Rinoa, much in the same way Cloud opened up to Aerith and was able to laugh and cry. Squall's moment of greatest emotional breakdown was when he thought he had lost Rinoa, saying to her:

"(Rinoa... You feel so cold. Are you going to be like this forever?)... Isn't there anything I can do?! You were so full of life. Now you don't even make a sound. I want to hear your voice...."

Compare that to Cloud's speech at Aerith's death (the moment of Cloud's greatest show of emotion)::

"... Aerith. This can't be real!" "Aerith is gone. Aerith will no longer talk, no longer laugh, cry... or get angry.... What about us? What are WE supposed to do? What about my pain? My fingers are tingling. My mouth is dry. My eyes are burning!"

-Rinoa is the cheerful, optimistic, and flirtatious daughter of a noted general. Just like Aerith, Rinoa is someone of importance, often referred to as "princess" (Aerith was the last of the Cetra, and the rightful heiress to the planet). I have heard CloTis attempt to compare Rinoa with Tifa. This is absolutely laughable, because Rinoa is nothing like Tifa. She has dark hair and eyes. That is the only way Rinoa resembles Tifa. In all other things, Rinoa is just like Aerith. Tifa was an introvert; Aerith and Rinoa are extroverts. Tifa could not express her feelings to Cloud; Aerith and Rinoa are outspoken and flirtatious with Cloud and Squall. Tifa was a physical fighter; Aerith and Rinoa are both mages. I am only scratching the surface here, too.

It is also interesting to note that Squall and Rinoa made their promise to each other in a flower field. They promised to be reunited there. And just who is associated with flowers, Tifa or Aerith? Aerith, of course! In fact, Aerith is shown meeting with Cloud in a field full of flowers in FFVII: Advent Children.

Final Fantasy IX: Just like Cloud and Aerith are opposites, Zidane and Garnet are also opposites...

-Zidane is a cocky, flirtatious thief. Like Cloud, he has a mysterious past and later discovers that he is, in fact, an experiment. Zidane also has a polar opposite in the game, the silver-haired villain, Kuja. Sounds rather like Cloud and his polar opposite, the silver-haired Sephiroth, does it not? Zidane is a physical fighter, just like Cloud and Squall.

-Garnet/Dagger is a princess, someone of great importance, just like Aerith and Rinoa. She is one of the last of her kind, one of a mysterious race known as Summoners (Aerith was the last of the Cetra, another mysterious race). Garnet is quiet, yet strong-willed, a complete opposite of Zidane. She is also a princess while Zidane is, let's face it, a criminal. How opposite can you get??? Garnet is also a white mage, weak physically, but strong in mind and magic

Final Fantasy X: Tidus and Yuna are also opposites; Tidus's name/celestial objects refer to the sun while Yuna's name/celestial objects refer to the moon. Not only that, but their story is directly parallel to that of Cloud and Aerith...

-Tidus is an outspoken, cocky blitzball star who, like all FF heroes, has a mysterious past. He also becomes a Guardian for Yuna during her pilgrimage, vowing to protect her from her fate.

-Yuna is the daughter of a famous man, High Summoner Braska. Like Aerith, and all of the female FF heroines before her, she is someone of great importance. She is also a white mage and a Summoner, someone with unusual powers, just like Aerith (a Cetra), Rinoa (a Sorceress), and Garnet (also a Summoner). Yuna is traveling on a pilgrimage with her Guardians to Zanarkand, where she will obtain the Final Aeon. We later discover that Yuna will die upon summoning the Final Aeon. And yet she bravely moves forward, with the good of the world in mind. Sound familiar? Aerith willingly sacrificed herself for the good of the planet in FFVII.

It is only later in the game that Yuna realizes the truth about Tidus. He is merely a dream, to be lost when she destroys the enemy. And yet Yuna bravely presses on selflessly, much the way Aerith did in FFVII. Even when Tidus is lost to Yuna, she does not stop loving him and she does not stop looking for a way to be with him. Just like Cloud, at the end of FFVII, who expresses his desire to be reunited with Aerith, Yuna searches for a way to be with Tidus once again. Again, we see the idea of love beyond death being presented. CloTis may mock this, but it is something Square clearly believes in. It is amusing for me to see so many CloTis that are fans of TidusxYuna, but not of CloudxAerith. Hellooooo???? These two pairings are the same!

Final Fantasy X-2: In this game, we see a continuation of Yuna's search for Tidus. Although he is gone, she continues to love him, hold his memory dear, and search for a way to be reunited with him. Also, in this game, we see another story that supports love beyond death. Shuyin and Lenne, while dead, still love one another, although they haven't seen each other for thousands of years. They are soul mates and their spirits persist in Spira, searching for one another. This is what love means, people. Loving someone forever is something that a lot of CloudxTifa fans are unable to comprehend. Their idea of love is shallow, at best. If you cannot grasp the true meaning of love, as demonstrated by CloudxAerith, TidusxYuna, and ShuyinxLenne, then you are a very sad person, indeed, and have clearly never experienced true love

At E3 2005, we caught a glimpse of the brand new PlayStation console, due to be released in 2006- the PS3. To showcase the graphics of this machine, S-E prepared a tech demo. Fans were overjoyed to see the entire beginning of FFVII redone in the amazing graphics of the PS3. The only two main characters seen in this demo were, of course, Cloud and Aerith, the hero and heroine of FFVII. So... why am I bringing this up? Because S-E chose to recreate a scene which exclusively shows Cloud and Aerith. They did not show any scenes of Cloud with Tifa. Heck, they even left off the other members of AVALANCHE exiting the train. The entire demo was centered on Aerith and then Cloud.

Another point I would like to make about this demo is the fact that the demo for the PS2, when it first came out, was centered on Squall and Rinoa. Interesting, no? ^_^ The true couple from FFVIII was showcased with the PS2 and the true couple from FFVII was showcased with the PS3. Wake up and smell the reality, CloTis. XD

A friend of mine owns a collection of Final Fantasy art, released by Square (so, yes, it is an official product), called "The Final Fantasy Art Collection". She recently posted pictures and translations of the images from FFVII in a forum I like to visit. This collection of FFVII art is quite intriguing. All of the images of Cloud are placed directly next to Aerith. Never once is he shown next to Tifa. Tifa is always placed on a completely different row of pictures than Cloud and Aerith. Hmmm

lastly!
Before the release of FFVII, a commercial for it was aired on TV. In this commercial, it showed Cloud laying Aerith into the water, with the word "love" superimposed above it. The narrator then stated, "...a story of a love that could never be..." This statement clearly spoke of a romantic love between two people and the tragedy that would separate them. In fact, this definition of the statement "a love that could never be" is supported by two experts at AllExperts.com. You can see their answers here and here. Why would Square portray Cloud and Aerith as the intended couple of the game in this commercial if they were not? Some people, people without a hint of common sense, like to say that this commercial was not made by Square and, therefore, it is not official. How idiotic! Whoever made it was hired by Square, right? And, so they would have been given information regarding FFVII, like who was the hero, who was the villain, and who loved who, right? Do you honestly think Square would have allowed a commercial to be released if it portrayed something false??? The commercial is official, so deal with it. That line was even used in the official FFVII tagline, according to IMDb: "The story of a love that can never be, and a hate that always was". Oh, and BTW, Tifa was shown in the commercial, too. She was shown, alone, at the end, with the narrator saying, "...will never come to a theater near you..." So, she was portrayed as she was meant to be-- alone



I'm not even going to bother with proofs because everything and I mean everything that you have writen here has been either proven wrong by SE or is of your own opinyon and I refuse to waist anymore time or space on this fourm on it.



If this is what you truly believe then why do you keep coming up with stuff saying that Cloud and Aeris were and are the true couple. If you really believed that it's up to the player to choose which one he really loves then you wouldn’t be debating the issue.

Id say Tifa played a bigger role than Aeris mainly because without her, there wouldnt be a Cloud after a certain point in the game. Without her going along, believing Cloud would find himself, and being opened up to by Cloud and opening up herself to Cloud and telling the truth, Cloud wouldve been lost in his Mako induced coma for much longer than just a 5 years span like he had already suffered.

The change in Clouds personality may not be that much for all we know. We didnt see the real Cloud until after that point, but Aeris' death did place a very heavy burden on him. Much larger than you seem to be giving it credit for. I mean, he isolated himself away from everyone, even those he had trusted so much just two years before. And him being alone is an understandable thing, but the guilt was what I believe kept her directly in his mind. He no doubtebly thought of her for other things, but a guilt from watching someone die in front of you without being able to stop it would far outlive that feeling of being alone.

Then again, he didnt isolate himself from guilt and to think things through, it was because he felt he was inadequate to help anyone, even himself, since he became sick with the Stigma.

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I dont get at all where youre going with the holding Tifa after the Loz fight in comparison to when he was holding Aeris after Sephiroth stabbed her.

you're right you couldnt have said it better cool soda talks nicely

Aeris, but Tifa liked him and he liked Tifa too, he just couldn;t see it because he was "blinded" by Aeris.

I say both Tifa and Aeris. He is so confused about himself he doesn't really sort out his feelings for anybody, well, until he loses Aeris, then he can't stop thinking about how he failed her. 3nodding

i think tifa and cloud where ok looking together but cloud and aries where better looking.
ninja