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 Posted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 3:09 am
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Posted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 3:33 am
DarklingGlory Ooops ma'bad smile Fair enough. Keeping your weight centered is important in lots of martial arts. The centre line principle does work for some things but I have noticed it can be quite weak against quite a lot of attacks. I have a friend who does kungfu and is really hot for center line theory and when we spar I can beat him round the place by using circular or inward attacks to go for his sides or side of his head. Admitedly atacking his centre line can be a bad idea. We're taught to strike with the first two knuckles in horizontal fist, and we condition them with knuckle press ups and breaking boards. Ok we're not getting anywhere arguing this back and forth, whats your take on open handed strikes using the side of the hand? We call them knifehand and ridge hand strikes in TKD. When I first started training I was very doubtful about the whole thing, now I really like them. So much so that I prefer using a knifehand (outside side of the hand) strike to break boards than a punch Well, we do not only protect the center, we also protect the sides of course. It's not as if we focus so much on the center we forget the rest. We use a lot of "stepping aside". This basically means if someone comes to your side, you step in such a way that the attack will go to your center, and not the side, if you want. Like I said, it's very important to be centered, but it's not all we learn 3nodding We also use the first 2 knuckles, because if you punch like that, the bones are in the best and strongest position. We do not use an open hand often. At least, I haven't learnt many techniques with them yet, lets put it like that. We do use it to break noses, you know, but hardly instead of a punch to the side of the head for instance. What I've experienced is when I do that, I can't get enough power behind it. (situation when you stand infront of the opponent, and you want to hit the side of the opponent) What we do is open the hand a bit, and when you want to make the punch you close the hand suddenly while moving. It gives it a little bit of speed and power. Or maybe it's just something I experience... sweatdrop We do that in combination of turning yourself. That gives you the extra length, and it looks faster. I have no idea if you understand that, if not, ask whee Oh! But we often use the open hand while going for the archeries in the neck. (sp?) You suddenly come forward and hit the neck. 3nodding
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Posted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 5:41 am
LELIE DarklingGlory Ooops ma'bad smile Fair enough. Keeping your weight centered is important in lots of martial arts. The centre line principle does work for some things but I have noticed it can be quite weak against quite a lot of attacks. I have a friend who does kungfu and is really hot for center line theory and when we spar I can beat him round the place by using circular or inward attacks to go for his sides or side of his head. Admitedly atacking his centre line can be a bad idea. We're taught to strike with the first two knuckles in horizontal fist, and we condition them with knuckle press ups and breaking boards. Ok we're not getting anywhere arguing this back and forth, whats your take on open handed strikes using the side of the hand? We call them knifehand and ridge hand strikes in TKD. When I first started training I was very doubtful about the whole thing, now I really like them. So much so that I prefer using a knifehand (outside side of the hand) strike to break boards than a punch Well, we do not only protect the center, we also protect the sides of course. It's not as if we focus so much on the center we forget the rest. We use a lot of "stepping aside". This basically means if someone comes to your side, you step in such a way that the attack will go to your center, and not the side, if you want. Like I said, it's very important to be centered, but it's not all we learn 3nodding Hehe friend does that aswell biggrin I'd chuck something with the left and he'd move across so it was going to his centre line then I'd just switch kick with the right, and because he's moved its even more oblique LELIE We also use the first 2 knuckles, because if you punch like that, the bones are in the best and strongest position. So you punch with the first two knuckles vertically? Interesting, the kungfu people I know punch vertically witht the bottom two knuckles LELIE We do not use an open hand often. At least, I haven't learnt many techniques with them yet, lets put it like that. We do use it to break noses, you know, but hardly instead of a punch to the side of the head for instance. What I've experienced is when I do that, I can't get enough power behind it. (situation when you stand infront of the opponent, and you want to hit the side of the opponent) What we do is open the hand a bit, and when you want to make the punch you close the hand suddenly while moving. It gives it a little bit of speed and power. Or maybe it's just something I experience... sweatdrop We do that in combination of turning yourself. That gives you the extra length, and it looks faster. I have no idea if you understand that, if not, ask whee Oh! But we often use the open hand while going for the archeries in the neck. (sp?) You suddenly come forward and hit the neck. 3nodding Well we're not allowed to use it in sparring because its designed to be used on dangerous areas like the neck, mainly after motor nerves rather than arteries ( wink ). But you can get rediculous amounts of power in. A ridge hand for example (thumb side of the hand) would be thrown like a horizontal punch slightly off to the side of the neck then opening the hand and twisting it over at the last second. A knifehand (outside of the hand) is swung directly inward or outward but thats easy to see coming so is mainly used as a dummy and/or grab to cover the other hand. We also use a lot of open hand for blocks to cause maximum damage to the attacking tool
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Posted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 6:30 am
DarklingGlory Thats what I'm trying to get at, if someone is behind you the only option you have is something devastating be that backelbow, backfist, back snap kick (bringing the heel straight up into the groin) or jumping backkick, and I dont know about you but I quite like most of the people I train with and dont want to maim them. Mythic how do you avoid loads of injuries if you're using full on nasty stuff? If you're really close vertical fist works nicely but its too short range for my liking. Horizontal fist can be caught and broken if it locks and hangs out. But if you do it properly, i.e. withdraw it as fast as it goes out, its extremely hard to catch, try it I dare ya wink . And it has the benefits of range, twisting the attacking tool into the target causing maximum external and internal damage and the entire body, notably the shoulders and hips rotate into it generating maximum power. And its far more general, I'd only use vertical fist if I was virtually clinching to work over the body. Leslie, when you say centre. Do you mean keeping your body weight centred or 'defending the centre line' as in kungfu? ok, let me clarify something real quick. although we do learn some back attacks, our main focus has never been those types of attacks. we use the 9 angles of footwork alot..footwork is very important to us.. so getting behind us is very difficult. even if we whiff a full powered round kick, we're taught to spin through so we come back facing the right direction. to this extent, the really nasty stuff hasn't ever really entered the picture. secondly, we condition our bodies alot to be able to take a hit. the other day, I took a 3/4ths power round kick to the neck. it hurt, but I was still ok to continue. thirdly, we do pull our punches to a certain extent. it's sort of a silent agreement when we spar. the lower belt dictates the pace. if he wants to go light, the upper belt complies. if he goes really hard, the upper belts show them why they're the upper belts. mrgreen
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Posted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 6:49 am
Back attacks don't work agains us, because if you try that, you get a surprise kick or something like that. Or we just roll away. Trust me, if you go to the left, and we recenter, and you go to the right, you take too much time. By that time an experienced fighter has already reacted.
We are also trained on getting tougher, and becoming able to take a punch or kick. We have trainings in the warming up where your partner has to kick you on the inside of the legs or the upper arms for example as hard as he/she can. This way, the weaker parts of your body gets used to the pain. Then you won't go down the first time you get hit.
You have to like getting hit with us xd
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Posted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 6:52 am
LELIE Back attacks don't work agains us, because if you try that, you get a surprise kick or something like that. Or we just roll away. Trust me, if you go to the left, and we recenter, and you go to the right, you take too much time. By that time an experienced fighter has already reacted. We are also trained on getting tougher, and becoming able to take a punch or kick. We have trainings in the warming up where your partner has to kick you on the inside of the legs or the upper arms for example as hard as he/she can. This way, the weaker parts of your body gets used to the pain. Then you won't go down the first time you get hit. You have to like getting hit with us xd that's harsh.. we do the same thing, but we don't swing full power. there's more than one of us that could easily break a forearm if they kicked as hard as they could.. ... reread that.. well, maybe not break the upper arm, but still...
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Posted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 8:49 am
We kick pretty hard, but also not full power. Some of the people I train with have impressive power. I can remember once a Sempai gave a demonstration with a kick, and someone had to hold the punching bag thing. He literally flew back a couple of meters after that kick eek
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Posted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 8:50 am
LELIE Back attacks don't work agains us, because if you try that, you get a surprise kick or something like that. Or we just roll away. Trust me, if you go to the left, and we recenter, and you go to the right, you take too much time. By that time an experienced fighter has already reacted. We are also trained on getting tougher, and becoming able to take a punch or kick. We have trainings in the warming up where your partner has to kick you on the inside of the legs or the upper arms for example as hard as he/she can. This way, the weaker parts of your body gets used to the pain. Then you won't go down the first time you get hit. You have to like getting hit with us xd No you've got me wrong, when I say left then right I dont mean moving right I mean roundhouse kick witht the left for example then switch kicking to right, and you can keep doing it, left right left right. I dont know about ninjitsu but it works wonders on kungfu people, and as always its not infallible and I'm not saying it works on everybody, fighting at the end of the day is down to the person not necessarily what they know or what they train in. I really wanna try ninjitsu by the way, but as always there's no decent dojo around here... sad biggrin getting smacked in the face is a good buzz, I must confess I've started to like getting hit xd when I first started training I was a bit punch shy, now i love it (except when I have a headache.. then it sucks)
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Posted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 11:20 am
DarklingGlory biggrin getting smacked in the face is a good buzz, I must confess I've started to like getting hit xd when I first started training I was a bit punch shy, now i love it (except when I have a headache.. then it sucks) sadly enough, I know exactly what you mean. 3nodding
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Posted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 1:31 pm
Mythic DarklingGlory biggrin getting smacked in the face is a good buzz, I must confess I've started to like getting hit xd when I first started training I was a bit punch shy, now i love it (except when I have a headache.. then it sucks) sadly enough, I know exactly what you mean. 3nodding Same here, you get the feeling "try that again! C'mon!!" or "Oh~! That felt good!" People who think like that usually end up getting better faster because you're not afraid to get hit. 3nodding
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Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2004 2:44 am
I havent personaly got to that stage yet
....Im still quite punch shy
but when I get a good combination and get a few points in a row I get that adrenalin rush and it makes me faster!
I love the satisfaction of getting attack after attack in!
tho My weak spot is backing into corners when Someones pounding me in the head sweatdrop
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Posted: Wed Dec 22, 2004 3:09 pm
Bahvanta I havent personaly got to that stage yet ....Im still quite punch shy but when I get a good combination and get a few points in a row I get that adrenalin rush and it makes me faster! I love the satisfaction of getting attack after attack in! tho My weak spot is backing into corners when Someones pounding me in the head sweatdrop Well, at least you know what your weakness is, so you can work on it 3nodding
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Posted: Thu Dec 23, 2004 9:58 am
Bahvanta I havent personaly got to that stage yet ....Im still quite punch shy but when I get a good combination and get a few points in a row I get that adrenalin rush and it makes me faster! I love the satisfaction of getting attack after attack in! tho My weak spot is backing into corners when Someones pounding me in the head sweatdrop we use a drill in my school that might help you in this situation, vanta.. it's a partner drill so you gotta ask someone to help you with it. what you do is go to a wall, face away from the wall and have the heel of your rear foot touch the wall. and have your partner just continually throw punches at you. you are not allowed to punch back and your heel is not allowed to stop touching the wall. do this for 30sec-1 min rounds. switch from defender to attacker every round. this will do a few things for you. 1. it'll get you used to being defensive and thinking in that mind set. 2. it'll get you used to someone attacking you. 3. in the beginning, when your guard isn't solid, you'll take hits so it'll get you used to that biggrin 4. it'll help you get used to the "trapped in a corner" feeling.. just keep in mind that you aren't supposed to go 100% when you're attacking.. maybe 50%-70% power/speed is enough. cause when it's your turn to defend....payback!
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Posted: Thu Dec 23, 2004 2:55 pm
Sounds interesting. 3nodding
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Posted: Fri Dec 24, 2004 12:46 pm
Simply whatever works. It sounds simple but to those that have read up on some Bruce Lee, this is pretty much what he is saying except he tries to help you develop the skills needed to do this. That and what I learn from Eagle Claw.
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