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 Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 5:15 am
Seeing the Kraken Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't a lot of pro-lifers Conservatives? And aren't the Conservatives the ones who oppose such funding that would probably reduce a lot of the call for abortions? Ahhh the Great Irony. Pro-Lifers typically treat pregnancy as a punishment. To many Pro-Lifers, it's enough to just "save" that fetus, nevermind try giving the resulting child a life that's worth anything or the mother any incentive to NOT opt for an abortion. They feel that if you have sex, you've agreed to be pregnant, and you should "suffer the consequences." But Pro-Lifers routinely also support Abstinence-only education in school, cut funding for programs like planned parenthood and others that provide contraceptives and a comprehensive coverage plan for ALL options when a woman is pregnant, not just abortion, (many Pro-Lifers think Planned Parenthood is Pro-Abortion when I know for a fact planned parenthood does help women who choose to have their children, and mostly works on contraceptives than anything).
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Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 5:21 am
Calixti I'm not sure there's any schools like that around here, and I'm sure I would have heard of them considering the school I graduated from has (had?) the highest teen pregnancy rate in the state. There's no daycare or anything either, so most girls who get pregnant wind up dropping out, and if they don't they aren't generally considered "in good standing" and aren't allowed to attend school functions like football games, Prom, or Homecoming (which are the BIG BIG things here), and they aren't allowed to walk at Graduation. A bunch of kids tried petitioning for a daycare. It'd be pretty easy, I think, considering we've got childcare classes and the students take a field trip to a daycare to look after kids for a day. Cut out the field trip and give them more hands-on experience maybe? NO FUNDING. Which is stupid, because we get a ton of money from the federal government because we have so many military kids. Hell, our funding goes UP every year. And what happens? Funding for all "art" classes gets cut. That includes Forensics, Creative Writing, Journalism, and Desktop Publishing. So the forensics kids can only afford to go to maybe one tournament not in the Metro area, they can't afford to send kids to National if they make it. Creative Writing publishes the school's literary magazine, so funding for that got cut. Journalism had to charge more for ads and put more ads in the school paper, so there were fewer articles that students actually cared about. They cut the opinion section entirely because there was no room with the extra ads. (That includes band and stuff too, but I don't have any direct experience or friends who were in band.) And the money went to the football and basketball teams because our football can't compete with Bellevue West and our girls' basketball won State and the school wants to win again next year. Throwing money at sports teams does nothing for the general lack of talent, takes away from established programs, and hinders new programs to help students. Great, huh? Are you in WA State? I just thought so because I read Bellevue, I could be wrong though. I used to go to High School in WA and they cut funding for non-Athletics programs to give to Athletics. In fact I was a part of the Gifted Program and it almost got wiped out by the budget cuts in order to give more to athletics, but John Hopkin's University stepped in and paid for it using grant money since we were also participating in a study (basically a study of Highly Gifted individuals, we had lot of various kinds of testing, etc ). Schools, at least most public ones, are never geared towards or fair to the people who really want to learn and are the intellectuals. It's geared toward the "average" and "below-average". It's never about elevating things up to a higher level, it's always about keeping it the same. Kinda sad.. people used to have school in Ancient Greece so that they could become intelligent, and wise. Now people have school because the Government says so and they have it to pass a standardized test or two and that's about it. I look back on High School and it was the biggest waste of my time. Except for the AP Classes I took and the stuff I learned in the Gifted Program, I learned nothing from regular classes.. and the stuff that I did enjoy and like doing, the school fought tooth and nail to take it away. Go figure.
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Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 1:02 pm
Lady Adriata (many Pro-Lifers think Planned Parenthood is Pro-Choice when I know for a fact planned parenthood does help women who choose to have their children). Excuse me, but how is that NOT pro-choice? Planned Parenthood helps women no matter what they choose to do in a crisis pregnancy. They provide affordable abortions and affordable prenatal care. What Planned Parenthood isn't is pro-abortion. They don't try to force it on people, they give them all options possible, and 97%* of what they do is preventative. *According to their mission statement.
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Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 1:17 pm
PhaedraMcSpiffy Lady Adriata (many Pro-Lifers think Planned Parenthood is Pro-Choice when I know for a fact planned parenthood does help women who choose to have their children). Excuse me, but how is that NOT pro-choice? Planned Parenthood helps women no matter what they choose to do in a crisis pregnancy. They provide affordable abortions and affordable prenatal care. What Planned Parenthood isn't is pro-abortion. They don't try to force it on people, they give them all options possible, and 97%* of what they do is preventative. *According to their mission statement. I mis-typed it.. I meant to say that they think Planned Parenthood is Pro-Abortion, I will fix it. (Pro-Choice is what they ARE in actuality) Up to early to write that properly, haha but thanks for pointing that out.
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Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 1:25 pm
Lady Adriata Are you in WA State? I just thought so because I read Bellevue, I could be wrong though. I used to go to High School in WA and they cut funding for non-Athletics programs to give to Athletics. In fact I was a part of the Gifted Program and it almost got wiped out by the budget cuts in order to give more to athletics, but John Hopkin's University stepped in and paid for it using grant money since we were also participating in a study (basically a study of Highly Gifted individuals, we had lot of various kinds of testing, etc ). Schools, at least most public ones, are never geared towards or fair to the people who really want to learn and are the intellectuals. It's geared toward the "average" and "below-average". It's never about elevating things up to a higher level, it's always about keeping it the same. Kinda sad.. people used to have school in Ancient Greece so that they could become intelligent, and wise. Now people have school because the Government says so and they have it to pass a standardized test or two and that's about it. I look back on High School and it was the biggest waste of my time. Except for the AP Classes I took and the stuff I learned in the Gifted Program, I learned nothing from regular classes.. and the stuff that I did enjoy and like doing, the school fought tooth and nail to take it away. Go figure. Nope. Bellevue, NE. Sadly, it makes sense that they keep throwing money at the football team, since football is the state obsession. Unfortunately, it means GOOD programs, programs we were known for, got cut to the bone. As for the AP classes, when my brother was in high school (he graduated in '02) the school covered about three-quarters of the fee for the AP tests so students could afford to take them. I couldn't take the English AP test for my junior or senior year because the school didn't cover any part of the cost anymore, and you had to pay eighty dollars to register, and forty or fifty more on the day of the test. I would've done well, too. My lowest score on an essay was a 6, at the start of my junior year, and my lowest score on the multiple choice practice was fifty percent, and you only need a six on the essay and thirty percent on multiple choice to pass the AP test for English. I know what you mean about keeping kids the same, too. Heck, for the State Writing Exam junior year, my class spent two weeks practicing mediocre essays. My teacher told us, "Strive for mediocrity. That's what this test is about, if you can be average. If you strive for excellence, the graders won't understand you and you will fail." And, naturally, it was a big party when no one in the school failed the writing test. Yay, we could all write crappy essays. rolleyes Public schools are probably the reason for my personal library. And when I adopt kids someday, they will have FULL access to all my books, and I hope they take advantage of it. Schools may push us to be mediocre, but that's no reason to let your mind laze about instead of putting it to work.
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Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 1:33 pm
Lady Adriata Seeing the Kraken Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't a lot of pro-lifers Conservatives? And aren't the Conservatives the ones who oppose such funding that would probably reduce a lot of the call for abortions? Ahhh the Great Irony. Pro-Lifers typically treat pregnancy as a punishment. To many Pro-Lifers, it's enough to just "save" that fetus, nevermind try giving the resulting child a life that's worth anything or the mother any incentive to NOT opt for an abortion. They feel that if you have sex, you've agreed to be pregnant, and you should "suffer the consequences." But Pro-Lifers routinely also support Abstinence-only education in school, cut funding for programs like planned parenthood and others that provide contraceptives and a comprehensive coverage plan for ALL options when a woman is pregnant, not just abortion, (many Pro-Lifers think Planned Parenthood is Pro-Abortion when I know for a fact planned parenthood does help women who choose to have their children, and mostly works on contraceptives than anything). They basically believe that pregnancy is supposed to act as a deterrant. They want to make pregnancy as horrible as possible so that women will abstain from sex. They basically want to use fear as a way to encourage moral behavior. To them, programs that help unwed mothers are just promoting promiscuity.
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Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 1:36 pm
PhaedraMcSpiffy Lady Adriata (many Pro-Lifers think Planned Parenthood is Pro-Choice when I know for a fact planned parenthood does help women who choose to have their children). Excuse me, but how is that NOT pro-choice? Planned Parenthood helps women no matter what they choose to do in a crisis pregnancy. They provide affordable abortions and affordable prenatal care. What Planned Parenthood isn't is pro-abortion. They don't try to force it on people, they give them all options possible, and 97%* of what they do is preventative. *According to their mission statement. I've been arguing with people on Facebook as to whether or not Planned Parenthood is unbiased. I think it is, because although they don't condemn abortion, they never tell women "you should get an abortion" or "you shouldn't get an abortion." They give women all the facts and let them decide which option is best for them. If a patient is pro-life, she's perfectly free to choose not to have an abortion.
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Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 9:57 pm
I agree, Freedom Fire. I think the only way they're "biased" is because they do care deeply about reproductive rights and they actually have medical knowledge and experience. I remember a few months ago, when a local newspaper ran a story about how the d&x abortion ban would affect family planning centers like Planned Parenthood. They talked about the escalations in clinic protests and how it could lead to more clinic violence. People wrote angry letters saying things like "Oh, that evil abortuary* Planned Parenthood is just angry because it's losing money and not killing more babies!" I had to write a letter explaining that PP is a non-profit organization and that 97% of what they do is PREVENT pregnancy and other negative consequences of sex. Also, that they provide prenatal care. *I kid you not, the letter I responded to not only used this term to describe PP, they also lamented the fact that Concerned Women For America was not used as a source. They also tried to say that abortion is never medically necessary to save a woman's life and that most doctors agree. Lady Adriata PhaedraMcSpiffy Lady Adriata (many Pro-Lifers think Planned Parenthood is Pro-Choice when I know for a fact planned parenthood does help women who choose to have their children). Excuse me, but how is that NOT pro-choice? Planned Parenthood helps women no matter what they choose to do in a crisis pregnancy. They provide affordable abortions and affordable prenatal care. What Planned Parenthood isn't is pro-abortion. They don't try to force it on people, they give them all options possible, and 97%* of what they do is preventative. *According to their mission statement. I mis-typed it.. I meant to say that they think Planned Parenthood is Pro-Abortion, I will fix it. (Pro-Choice is what they ARE in actuality) Up to early to write that properly, haha but thanks for pointing that out. Oh. I thought it might be a typo, but I kinda freaked out because so many people say things like that. Freedom Fire They basically believe that pregnancy is supposed to act as a deterrant. They want to make pregnancy as horrible as possible so that women will abstain from sex. They basically want to use fear as a way to encourage moral behavior. To them, programs that help unwed mothers are just promoting promiscuity. Bingo. Almost all the lifers I meet are pro-punishment to some degree. It's not about the fetus' right to life, it's about pregnancy as a detterent. Look at their posts. Isn't it almost always "She shouldn't get such an easy way out!" or "She should be forced to deal with the consequences!"?
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Posted: Sun Jul 08, 2007 7:21 am
Freedom Fire PhaedraMcSpiffy Lady Adriata (many Pro-Lifers think Planned Parenthood is Pro-Choice when I know for a fact planned parenthood does help women who choose to have their children). Excuse me, but how is that NOT pro-choice? Planned Parenthood helps women no matter what they choose to do in a crisis pregnancy. They provide affordable abortions and affordable prenatal care. What Planned Parenthood isn't is pro-abortion. They don't try to force it on people, they give them all options possible, and 97%* of what they do is preventative. *According to their mission statement. I've been arguing with people on Facebook as to whether or not Planned Parenthood is unbiased. I think it is, because although they don't condemn abortion, they never tell women "you should get an abortion" or "you shouldn't get an abortion." They give women all the facts and let them decide which option is best for them. If a patient is pro-life, she's perfectly free to choose not to have an abortion. Planned Parenthood gave me a workbook when I was pregnant and it was totally unbiased.. it had you fill out how you felt about abortion, and keeping the child, and how your parents feel, the father of the baby, etc etc etc. In the back it had a list of options and things that planned parenthood could provide for you-- one was for people who chose to keep it, with the pre-natal care and discounts/free medications and vitamins. The other was for the abortions. Just because you support a woman's right to abortion doesn't mean you think they're awesome and everyone should get them.. not to mention that PP is non-profit, as PhaedraMcSpiffy said. There's no benefit to PP for performing abortions besides being able to help young women with unwanted pregnancies who want to get it aborted. PhaedraMcSpiffy Bingo. Almost all the lifers I meet are pro-punishment to some degree. It's not about the fetus' right to life, it's about pregnancy as a detterent. Look at their posts. Isn't it almost always "She shouldn't get such an easy way out!" or "She should be forced to deal with the consequences!"? Yeah, I read that a lot. Which is kinda funny because in a way it invalidates their argument -- what kind of compassionate, caring person would seek to use a child as a tool of revenge or punishment? I mean, if someone commits a crime and it's found out that they hate children, is it okay to send them a bunch of children to look after because that's a great punishment? Obviously not-- why is your own flesh and blood any different? Not to mention many Pro-Lifers seem to believe sex is a MYSTICAL CONTRACT between yourself and God or something that you're agreeing to get and stay pregnant. Hence why my signature says what it does-- I'm sick of explaining it to Pro-Lifers that just because I choose to have sex and know pregnancy is a risk, I never accepted to be content should that risk become reality. Of course when I posed that hypothetical question no one had too great of a come back for it, so it was back to, "Women who have sex and get pregnant are teh slutz" argument.
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