Arguments that you hate

[LittlePinky82]

Freedom Fire

I once read on a Bible website that even if a pregnancy puts a woman in danger, she shouldn't have an abortion because "God will take care of her." rolleyes

I also hate:

~Women shouldn't get aboritons just because pregnancy is inconvenient for her.
~If I did get pregnant, which I wouldn't because of the magical word ABSTINENCE, well, that would be okay because I would have a cute wittle kid!
~If the woman got raped, the baby would make things better because it would make her happy
~That child could find a cure for AIDS!
~I wanna punish those teenage sluts!
~When you consent to sex, you consent to pregnancy.

That one boils me because as a person who does believe in God God can help you in all sorts of ways. Even when you think it wouldn't be a way such as an abortion. You just don't know and don't have the proof that it's God either way. The last one also gets to me because uh duh what about rape you know? rolleyes And abstience doesn't work. Sooner or later you will have sex unless you're going to be abstient all your life (good luck).  

[Chickabiddy]

Reinna Astarel

Luna Eclipse

Another argument I hate: Someone in either the PLG or the abortion debate thread (I can't remember which) denied that pregnancy could possibly have longlasting problems or cause some form of emotional trauma, saying that millions of women give birh or actively try to get pregnant everyday, if it's supposedly so horrible and oppressive, then how could our species reproduce, etc. etc.

Of course pregnancy is neither oppressive nor traumatic...if you are going through it willingly and looking forward to the outcome. Anything that is enjoyable will become the exact opposite if it is forced upon you against your will. Case in point: sex. Sex is fun, exciting, and an especially great experience when shared with someone you love. When sex is forced upon you despite your opposition however, it is not fun. It's traumatizing.

You know what else grinds my gears? How the antis refer to pregnancy as "miraculous", or a "precious gift". Yet, in the argument I mentioned above, pregnancy suddenly dropped from miracle status to something millions of people do worldwide everyday and is no big deal. What is it, pro-lifers? Miraculous or mundane? Ask these same people about abortion, and they will describe it as a traumatic event that results in much bloodshed, a barbaric medical procedure in which the abortionist reaches in and yanks a fully formed, screaming infant out of it's mother's uterus and proceeds to rip it limb from limb before her very eyes, spraying the walls with blood and scarring the woman for life. Yet somehow, this same procedure is simultaneously the "easy way out." eek C'mon pro-lifers! Consistency!

Hrm, I hadn't noticed that before. Thanks for pointing it out whee - and yeah....some lifers really do need to choose a story and stick with it.

Then again, I've known a few who might respond with the 'easy way out vs. traumatizing women' part by saying 'Oh, she was fed information that it would be the easy way out to avoid consequences blahblahblah, and wasn't told anything about how traumatizing it would be..." rolleyes

Yeah, that's really really irritating...
DD:
One of the reasons why I stopped debating. I mean, there are so many people who just won't listen to logic like that and just ARG. It was getting me in a foul mood all the time and generally just wasn't good.

 

[October Cross]

I really enjoy the pro-life people who argue that

people get married to have children.
marriage = instant financial stability.
childfree people shouldn't have sex! scream  

[Prinsesse Maggie]

Asexual-Slut~Enya

Really, you are? That is amazing -- I have never known any other person, in real life, who also frequents Gaia. Perhaps, you will be the first -- that is, of course, if you still intend to attend Hamline after you graduate. wink

I live on Snelling, and I bus past Hamline all the time on the 84. smile  

[WatersMoon110]

The idea that women who have abortions somehow were "forced" into it, rather than making the choice of their own free will bothers me.

Personally, I see this as a sort of mental leap of the part of Pro-Lifers. The ones who make this point don't understand why a woman wouldn't want to be pregnant, so assume that she must have been tricked into getting an abortion.

And really, this is why the people who make this point can't hold their own in the Debate. Points built on falicies are falicies in and of themselves.  

[Asexual-Slut~Enya]

adabyron

Asexual-Slut~Enya

Really, you are? That is amazing -- I have never known any other person, in real life, who also frequents Gaia. Perhaps, you will be the first -- that is, of course, if you still intend to attend Hamline after you graduate. wink

I live on Snelling, and I bus past Hamline all the time on the 84. smile

My, it is a small world after all. Hey, maybe you have ridden right past me while I've been walking along the road -- though, I don't do it too often for fairly obvious reasons.  

[Akhakhu]

"It's wrong because it isn't natural."
Says the person on the computer... probably wearing clothes...

"It's 50% the father's baby, so he should get 50% of the say in abortion."
So if I shove my stick into your a**, you have to consult me before removing it?

"If the woman just has the baby, she can have her family and friends help her take care of it. Her school/job will provide day care for her and the government will make sure that she can make rent and put food on the table. And who knows, maybe once he sees his baby, the father will want to marry her and they can be a perfectly happy white Christian family like God wanted them to be!"
Sorry... what?  

[Asexual-Slut~Enya]

Kukushka

"If the woman just has the baby, she can have her family and friends help her take care of it. Her school/job will provide day care for her and the government will make sure that she can make rent and put food on the table. And who knows, maybe once he sees his baby, the father will want to marry her and they can be a perfectly happy white Christian family like God wanted them to be!"
Sorry... what?

Or, her family and friends completely abandon her -- for now she is the village harlot, of course. She drops out of school and loses her job and she is ineligible for government grants because, legally, she is still dependent on the parents who abandoned her. And, who knows? Maybe, once he sees his baby, the father will lose his temper and beat the poor girl to a bloody pulp and they can be a perfectly unhappy dysfunctional family; but, the fetus will have been born, just like the pro-life camp wanted it to be!

W00t for fortune-telling.  

[Aiko_Kaida]

Asexual-Slut~Enya

Kukushka

"If the woman just has the baby, she can have her family and friends help her take care of it. Her school/job will provide day care for her and the government will make sure that she can make rent and put food on the table. And who knows, maybe once he sees his baby, the father will want to marry her and they can be a perfectly happy white Christian family like God wanted them to be!"
Sorry... what?

Or, her family and friends completely abandon her -- for now she is the village harlot, of course. She drops out of school and loses her job and she is ineligible for government grants because, legally, she is still dependent on the parents who abandoned her. And, who knows? Maybe, once he sees his baby, the father will lose his temper and beat the poor girl to a bloody pulp and they can be a perfectly unhappy dysfunctional family; but, the fetus will have been born, just like the pro-life camp wanted it to be!

W00t for fortune-telling.

Actually, once you have a child you no longer have to file your FAFSA with your parent's information. Marriage, children, and military service allow you to file as an independant adult before the age of 23.  

[GreenSouthpaw]

One argument I hate with a passion is when a pro-choicer says "people shouldn't be legislated to not have control over their bodies" and then a pro-lifer says "well yes they can, as a matter of fact drugs are illegal"... it's flawed, because drugs are something that you completely choose to do, knowing beforehand that they themselves are harmful, illegal, etc... while sex is something that is one of the most basic human activities... it's legal, it's necessary for reproduction, and it feels good without being harmful... pregnancy isn't a guarantee with sex, and it's the thing that's intruding on the woman's body. Drugs intrude on the body themselves... abortion is trying to remove that intrusion...  

[S. Shark]

GreenSouthpaw

One argument I hate with a passion is when a pro-choicer says "people shouldn't be legislated to not have control over their bodies" and then a pro-lifer says "well yes they can, as a matter of fact drugs are illegal"... it's legal, it's necessary for reproduction, and it feels good without being harmful... pregnancy isn't a guarantee with sex, and it's the thing that's intruding on the woman's body. Drugs intrude on the body themselves... abortion is trying to remove that intrusion...

It also assumes their opponent is against the legalization of illegal drugs. Maybe IRL that can be an okay assumption, but on Gaia people are more liberal about drugs. >_<

A pro-lifer would probably say, "Well, if abortion were illegal, it would be something women completely choose to do, knowing it's illegal." Thing is, they totally forget the self-defense element of abortion. Do people on drugs HAVE to kill people? No. But during pregnancy, the only way to remove the fetus involves killing it.

Quote:

it's flawed, because drugs are something that you completely choose to do, knowing beforehand that they themselves are harmful, illegal, etc...

A pro-lifer would probably say, "Well, if abortion were illegal, it would be something women completely choose to do, knowing it's illegal." -_-;;  

[GreenSouthpaw]

But the thing is, abortion is only necessary if one is pregnant. So they have two choices. One, to have sex. Another, to use birth control and/or another contraceptive. Another still to have that abortion. With the drugs argument, it's like saying not that it's the abortion that's harmful, it's like saying being pregnant should be illegal. Not having sex, just being pregnant. It's as if it's a separate choice all on its own. Pardon me for my lack of eloquence if you're confused as to my meaning, but I'm tired x_x.


OMG bahaha... "i've done my sentence but committed no crime, and bad mistakes, I've made a few.." those lyrics totally fit a pregnant woman who is forced to keep the baby whee . Sorry... yeah. A Green Day cover of We Are the Champions was playing.

 

[Asexual-Slut~Enya]

Aiko_Kaida

Asexual-Slut~Enya

Kukushka

"If the woman just has the baby, she can have her family and friends help her take care of it. Her school/job will provide day care for her and the government will make sure that she can make rent and put food on the table. And who knows, maybe once he sees his baby, the father will want to marry her and they can be a perfectly happy white Christian family like God wanted them to be!"
Sorry... what?

Or, her family and friends completely abandon her -- for now she is the village harlot, of course. She drops out of school and loses her job and she is ineligible for government grants because, legally, she is still dependent on the parents who abandoned her. And, who knows? Maybe, once he sees his baby, the father will lose his temper and beat the poor girl to a bloody pulp and they can be a perfectly unhappy dysfunctional family; but, the fetus will have been born, just like the pro-life camp wanted it to be!

W00t for fortune-telling.

Actually, once you have a child you no longer have to file your FAFSA with your parent's information. Marriage, children, and military service allow you to file as an independant adult before the age of 23.

Well, either way, government grants aren't, really, all that much to begin with -- she won't be living the dream-life, that's for sure.  

[S. Shark]

GreenSouthpaw

But the thing is, abortion is only necessary if one is pregnant. So they have two choices. One, to have sex. Another, to use birth control and/or another contraceptive. Another still to have that abortion. With the drugs argument, it's like saying not that it's the abortion that's harmful, it's like saying being pregnant should be illegal. Not having sex, just being pregnant. It's as if it's a separate choice all on its own. Pardon me for my lack of eloquence if you're confused as to my meaning, but I'm tired x_x.


OMG bahaha... "i've done my sentence but committed no crime, and bad mistakes, I've made a few.." those lyrics totally fit a pregnant woman who is forced to keep the baby whee . Sorry... yeah. A Green Day cover of We Are the Champions was playing.

I didn't understand a word of that. But then, I didn't even make sense in my post. Said the same thing twice... gawh, sorry. I need a nap. Or to stop listening to music. xd  

[GreenSouthpaw]

I swear I'm not an idiot... I just can't get my words out right.
What I was saying was that if you're using the argument that illegalizing drugs is the same thing as illegalizing abortion, that's not accurate... if you wanted to use that argument it would have to be that pregnancy was illegal... I mean sex isn't illegal, and you choose to have sex, but pregnancy isn't something you choose... gah... it still doesn't make sense... I can't explain it x_x.